Acceptable level of Vargr Prestige?

[stofsk]

I was wondering something. Vargr prestige is worked out initially by taking the Charisma score, dividing it by three, and rounding down. Let's take a typical Vargr with a CHA of 10. He starts off with a Prestige of +3. Then everytime he levels up, the Ref decides whether or not that Prestige goes up or down. What criteria he uses to decide on this is presumably left up to him (I can't find any rules on this so I think it's a safe bet).

I realise that this topic has been done before and done to death, so I hope I'm asking a new question here. What level do you think is acceptable for a Vargr to have? You can assume he goes through several terms of prior history. Should he have over ten? High teens?

What are we to compare our Vargr character to another? What famous Vargr have there been, and what is their likely level of Prestige? Or if that has no answer, what do the various levels of Prestige imply? What does 5 Prestige *mean*, compared to 10, 15, 20, and so on? Beyond that 5 is less than 10, which really doesn't tell us anything.

 

[stofsk]

Nobody has even an opinion about this?

 

[far-trader]

Oh, an opinion I thought you were hoping for canon

But seriously, it seems a good topic for discussion. I was too short of time when I first saw it to give it much thought. (and that stopped me?

)

(must resist urge to bait RV with VT taunts... )

Per my concepts in this long resting thread (here) my quick take would be something like...

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Prestige Score Pack Standing

0 Dead
1 Runt
2-3 Follower
4 Second
5-6 Leader
7 Legend</pre>[/QUOTE]Dead - as in he used to be great (or not) but bones don't impress (or not) us in the least, if not dead in actual fact then dead to the pack, an outcast

Runt - as in the runt of the litter, never mind no bite this pup doesn't even have a proper bark

Follower - the bulk of any pack, they do their jobs but may try for a higher standing if weakness is shown by a superior

Second - the few of the pack that have shown some backbone but have not yet made a play for leader

Leader - this is the one to be wary of, the pack follows them without hesitation, at least as long as the leader shows none

Legend - not only leader of their pack but known to other packs and respected by their own leaders, the range of notoriety and influence is proportional to the presitge above 6, anywhere from a single port to several systems and able to call upon a few packs to a few dozen, there are few if any Legendary Vargr outside the Extants, working with inferior species is an obvious sign of weakness.

 

[stofsk]

Your scale seems to work, although I'd probably have Legend stick at 10, Leader at 8-9, Second at 6-7, and Follower 2-5.

I'd probably also suggest that there should be only one opportunity for Prestige to go up during Prior History, in spite of the fact that the rules say everytime a vargr levels up the Ref decides whether or not to add or take away from what he's managed to build up so far of his legend.

 

[veltyen]

I dunno. A prestige for each "Starburst for extreme bravery under fire" doesn't seem out of place.

Ditto with a belter hitting a maximum sized haul.

 

[far-trader]

Well my scale was built on the "divide by 3" setup, hence the apparently low numbers. Using anything over 6 (implying an attribute value over 18) for Legend feels right to me. As does 5-6 (15-18) for Leader to allow the chance that a character (with high CHR) may start out as a very prestigious Vargr and already leader of the pack.

As for Prestige change in prior history I just figured the odds should be close to the 1 change per level. That's a chance to go up or down 1 point per level in prior history. It's not spelled out but implied by the rules that Prestige should be adjusted during prior history. That led me to come up with an easy application of the prior history events that might affect it (see link in post above).

IF the character is doing their prior history as a Vargr in a Vargr setting working with other Vargr. If said Vargr PC is doing their prior history in an alien setting (such as The Imperium) working with aliens (like Humans) then not only is their prestige likely to only go down but it won't apply either. They'll be operating under the alien structure of rank and social standing. If they take a journey to the Extants they will probably be treated as Runts at the best (and any non-Vargr won't even get that much deference). The Vargr may gain some Prestige once there, and it may even be possible for aliens to gain some Prestige, possible but not likely.

That's the way I see Vargr Prestige anyway. Only really applicable to predominately Vargr settings, but very important in them.

So a Vargr wouldn't get much (or any) Prestige for an SEH (being an Imperial Decoration) but the actions that led to such may earn some Prestige in the unit if it was an all Vargr unit (if such exist). If it were a Vargr equivalent of the SEH while in Vargr service then yes Prestige is gonna go up.

For monetary gains, such as a Vargr belter hitting it big, my feeling is they would only gain prestige if they spent a goodly chunk of that strike "sharing the kill". If they were stingy and kept it all they'd lose Prestige.

My feeling is Prestige is as much about doing what is good for the pack as it is personal.

 

[far-trader]

As an aside I find the "divide by 3" an unneccesary complication. Why couldn't it have just been handled in the same 3d6 range mechanic?

And why not simply have it as a seperate ability score rather than an extra one? Or even better why make it an extra ability score at all?

Vargr (in a Vargr setting) aren't likely to be using SOC while Vargr (in an alien setting) aren't likely to be using Prestige. It's just more unneccesary complication. In MTU I'd probably just go with one or the other depending on the setting and group.

 

[mike wightman]

I would have made prestige more like the saving throw mechanic.

A Vargr's Cha and Soc stat DMs are totalled, and then the referee can decide if the class level the Vargr takes is worth a bonus or not.

Do Imperial Vargr even bother with prestige, being more civilized than their barbarian cousins

 

[far-trader]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
I would have made prestige more like the saving throw mechanic.

A Vargr's Cha and Soc stat DMs are totalled, and then the referee can decide if the class level the Vargr takes is worth a bonus or not.

That's a new, and worthy of a look, take on it.

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
Do Imperial Vargr even bother with prestige, being more civilized than their barbarian cousins

Civilized? HARF! Domesticated more like. Simpering lap dogs of the lower races. Barbaric? US? OWWWW! You make me laff pinky! You envy our freedoms and fear our honesty

At least I think that's how RV would reply but he hasn't been around in quite a while. Not many pro-Vargr left around here it seems

 

[stofsk]

Originally posted by far-trader:
As an aside I find the "divide by 3" an unneccesary complication. Why couldn't it have just been handled in the same 3d6 range mechanic?

And why not simply have it as a seperate ability score rather than an extra one? Or even better why make it an extra ability score at all?

Vargr (in a Vargr setting) aren't likely to be using SOC while Vargr (in an alien setting) aren't likely to be using Prestige. It's just more unneccesary complication. In MTU I'd probably just go with one or the other depending on the setting and group.

The key thing I think stands out as far as Prestige is concerned is the idea that the vargr in question is building up his legend. That has less to do with ability than it does with circumstances resulting from adventuring. I'd use Prestige as a role-playing aid rather than a game mechanic IMO.

 

[mike wightman]

Originally posted by far-trader:
Civilized? HARF! Domesticated more like. Simpering lap dogs of the lower races. Barbaric? US? OWWWW! You make me laff pinky! You envy our freedoms and fear our honesty

I actually snorted wine because of this one Dan...