Armed Packet

[Garnfellow]

I finally had a chance to take High Guard 2e for a spin. I did a conversion of the armed packet, a T5 ship type that fills a missing niche: a 300 ton, J-3 starship. I used a T5 design Rob Eaglestone had posted a few years.

I also finally tried my hand at drawing up some deckplans:

https://greatdungeonnorth.blogspot.com/2019/04/the-armed-packet.html

Overall, I'm pretty happy with the results. It's a pricey ship, but comes with a lot of potential adventure hooks!

 

[SpaceBadger]

I'm not keen on forum posts that have essentially zero content but only contain a link to the poster's content somewhere else on the Web. Why not post your design notes, ship stats, and deckplans here on CotI if you'd like to discuss them here?

I agree with you that the Armed Packet hits a sweet spot as an adventuring ship. For designers wanting to allow more cargo capacity, some of those passenger staterooms could be taken out and the layout shuffled around to consolidate the recovered space into a cargo hold with external access for loading/unloading.

Speaking of shuffling the layout, I think most ships designed to carry passengers are also designed to isolate those passengers from the working areas of the ship, especially the Bridge and Engineering. I like to have crew staterooms near that crewmember's working area if possible, for fast response in emergencies.

Nice job on the deckplan artwork and key.

 

[mike wightman]

Nice work. I agree that the 300t hull is just about the sweet spot for a PC ship.

Now the criticism

Scouts, at least the iconic Traveller 100t IISS freebee, are jump 2 and always have been.

Passengers should be confined to their own area of the ship, and the crew shouldn't need to EVA to avoid tramping through the passenger area

Cargo capacity it a little on the low side for a 'packet boat', I would get rid of the air/raft, lower the passenger capacity and reduce maneuver to 2g.

For CT compatibility and 3I certification it would need a medic added to the crew.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

For CT compatibility and 3I certification it would need a medic added to the crew.

With five staterooms and four barrack bunks there is space for both a steward and a medic, in addition to the gunners, if you can persuade them to accept such spartan quarters.

MgT2 does not generally require a separate Medic on such small ships.

 

[Garnfellow]

I'm not keen on forum posts that have essentially zero content but only contain a link to the poster's content somewhere else on the Web. Why not post your design notes, ship stats, and deckplans here on CotI if you'd like to discuss them here?

First, thank you for your comments -- I've gotten great feedback that will inform a revised deck plan. Separating the passengers and crew is definitely at the top of the list.

So why not post all the stuff over here? The simple answer: work. Although it may not look like it, it takes me several hours of tweaking images, css code, table layouts, and so on to get the presentation I want. Although this board can handle tables, and images, and some formatting it's a lot of work to recreate all of that in BBCode, but with only a fraction of the layout control. I'm happy to do that for a single image or table, but for something more complex? That's what links are for.

In my experience, the various message board forums are far better for getting interesting discussions going than blog message sections. And blogs and websites are far better at doing complex layout.

 

[Garnfellow]

Nice work. I agree that the 300t hull is just about the sweet spot for a PC ship.

Now the criticism

All welcome -- thanks!

Cargo capacity it a little on the low side for a 'packet boat', I would get rid of the air/raft, lower the passenger capacity and reduce maneuver to 2g.

Yeah, I agree that it seems passenger heavy and cargo light. But I am a little stuck on what would be an appropriate target for cargo. After all, the canonical express boat only has cargo of 1 ton, which get carried over to T5:

A lot of communications information being shipped under special contract for a postal or express service. Governments operate postal services; private companies operate express services.

Mail is always of incidental size (never major or minor sized lots). To be allowed to carry mail, the ship must be armed and the crew must include a gunner. Each mail lot always consists of at least one ton. Each ton of mail is shipped at a premium rate of Cr15,000 (475).

There may be mail or private express (parcel) shipments destined for other worlds. The steward can inquire at the starport about availability.

Each mail shipment is one ton. Payment is a Voucher for Cr15,000 redeemable at any A Starport.

Destination World must be at least Importance-2 less than current world (486).

 

[mike wightman]

Think about what may be mail ordered rather than just electronic mail.

Spare parts for a drive that are needed at a starport so they can complete annual maintainance, an ATV, a herd of groats...

To me a packet boat would carry small but valuable cargos that have been ordered via Interstellar Amazon, it needs the 'legs' to get from the x-boat hub worlds to any world in the immediate vicinity hence jump 3. It may even be the sort of ship that speculative traders use to move goods from world to world to make profits for themselves without having to leave their home world. 20t to 40t cargo would be what I would aim for.

 

[Garnfellow]

To me a packet boat would carry small but valuable cargos that have been ordered via Interstellar Amazon, it needs the 'legs' to get from the x-boat hub worlds to any world in the immediate vicinity hence jump 3. It may even be the sort of ship that speculative traders use to move goods from world to world to make profits for themselves without having to leave their home world. 20t to 40t cargo would be what I would aim for.

I agree with your logic, and 20-40t should be readily doable in a redesign.

 

[Maksim-Smelchak]

I finally had a chance to take High Guard 2e for a spin. I did a conversion of the armed packet, a T5 ship type that fills a missing niche: a 300 ton, J-3 starship. I used a T5 design Rob Eaglestone had posted a few years.

I also finally tried my hand at drawing up some deckplans:

https://greatdungeonnorth.blogspot.com/2019/04/the-armed-packet.html

Overall, I'm pretty happy with the results. It's a pricey ship, but comes with a lot of potential adventure hooks!

Looks great.

Shalom,
M.

 

[Garnfellow]

With all this helpful feedback, I was able to develop the next iteration of the armed packet:

https://greatdungeonnorth.blogspot.com/2019/04/the-revised-armed-packet.html

Still tweaking this design, but thanks for all the ideas and suggestions!

 

[CaptRet]

Wondering why the revised version now has "Barracks" (no. 24 on Level 3), in addition to the Passenger and Crew staterooms. Barracks implies troops/marines of some sort. I think that the Armed Packet could make an excellent vessel for ferrying important governmental personnel (ambassadors, system/major planetary senior administrators), and a barracks would allow for an armed escort/security team to accompany the principal and his/her staff.

 

[kilemall]

Hmm, I dunno. A sweet spot for an ACS to me includes at least enough room for 2 ATVs or Gcarriers and base supplies, for exploring/exploiting or mercing. So a minimum of 25 tons cargo.


That means carving out 10 tons somewhere, I'm thinking 2 staterooms and 2 tons out of the barracks. That's 11 people outside ship crew, plus barracks if that hasn't been transformed into some other mission room.

 

[mike wightman]

Keep your focus on the mission of this ship.

It is to deliver high value cargo, mail and passengers, quickly.

It is not a general trader, explorer, scout, paramilitary or other type of vessel.

Does it need subcraft? - no. It is streamlined and has the m-drive performance to cope with any world it may visit.
Does it need weapons? - yes in order to qualify as a mail carrier.
Does it need a troop barracks? - nope (according to the rules a barracks is for troops, not ship crew or passengers).

 

[CaptRet]

I agree with mike wightman that as configured this Armed Packet design has certain features not in keeping with its stated purpose of armed mail carrier. That said, I can see this particular configuration as a modified version of the standard Armed Packet, and one suitable for use by government agencies as interstellar transport for high ranking diplomats/administrators (and a small staff and security contingent), but who aren't in the top-most tier(s) of their bureaucracy (the Director, Chief, Duke, what-have- you probably has a larger and more luxuriously-outfitted ship). Air Force One is just a highly customized Boeing 747-200B

 

[Maksim-Smelchak]

I agree with mike wightman that as configured this Armed Packet design has certain features not in keeping with its stated purpose of armed mail carrier. That said, I can see this particular configuration as a modified version of the standard Armed Packet, and one suitable for use by government agencies as interstellar transport for high ranking diplomats/administrators (and a small staff and security contingent), but who aren't in the top-most tier(s) of their bureaucracy (the Director, Chief, Duke, what-have- you probably has a larger and more luxuriously-outfitted ship). Air Force One is just a highly customized Boeing 747-200B

Where are the best places to read more about these armed packets? Either the canon or fanon versions?

There are some links at the wiki, but they have not been well developed out yet.

Shalom,
M.

 

[mike wightman]

I don't know if they have had a proper write up yet. The concept borrows from the historical packet boats, the ultimate expression of which was probably the clipper.

Packet boats began as coastal vessels plying European waters delivering mail, high value but small cargos and of course passengers. They were adapted to the task of carrying said loads around the far flung empires of the European powers.

In Traveller terms it is going to have to have reasonable jump legs - three for this design is the sweet spot for me - and have the capacity to carry mail, a small to moderate cargo hold for expensive trade goods (forget freight - speculative goods is how this thing makes credits) and enough cargo capacity for a typical passenger roster for the worlds it flits between.

 

[mike wightman]

How about something like this...

Packet ships are a class of small merchantmen in the 200-500 ton range designed to fill the gaps left by the trade lanes that follow the x-boat routes. They may be operated by planetary governments, private individuals or corporations, they may even be assigned by a subsector duke concerned with developing the economy of their subsector.

Their purpose is to carry mail, passengers and high value cargo quickly from the trade hubs to the more distant worlds within a subsector, worlds often economically unreachable with smaller jump number drives.

A packet ship will typically be fully atmospheric capable, have a 2-3g drive for normal space operation and a jump 3 or 4 drive.

In order to qualify for mail contracts and planetary subsidies a frontier packet ship is routinely armed and is thus designated as an armed packet.

Originally packet ships were often military surplus couriers or dispatch ships, either purchased or leased for civilian use. They have proven so useful for stimulating the frontier economy that purpose built packets have all but replaced the older military designs.

 

[kilemall]

Keep your focus on the mission of this ship.

It is to deliver high value cargo, mail and passengers, quickly.

It is not a general trader, explorer, scout, paramilitary or other type of vessel.

Does it need subcraft? - no. It is streamlined and has the m-drive performance to cope with any world it may visit.
Does it need weapons? - yes in order to qualify as a mail carrier.
Does it need a troop barracks? - nope (according to the rules a barracks is for troops, not ship crew or passengers).

Sure, that's the original mission design.


However, an ACS needs modification from that design. This design won't hack most needs.

 

[mike wightman]

At which point it ceases to be an armed packet - design something that meets the needs of the party of adventurers.

 

[Garnfellow]

These are all useful comments -- I appreciate the thoughts. T5 is the only official source that I am aware of for the armed packet, and I'll use v5.09 as reference. I think some of the incoherence around the ship mission is baked into T5. While the name of the ship type ("packet") implies a mail or courier service based on historical usage, the actual T5 descriptions suggest passenger transport.

Packet appears as a specific mission associated with passengers on page 286. The full taxonomy is Commerce/Merchant/Unscheduled/Passenger, and packets are assigned code U. A Type A Trader, by contrast, is Commerce/Merchant/Unscheduled/Cargo.

This is reiterated on page 287: "For unscheduled routes: a Packet carries primarily passengers, a Trader carries primarily cargo, a Transport carries primarily freight."

We have an illustration on page 738, and the following description: "Armed Packet (UF-CA33) in [sic] unscheduled passenger service for those in a hurry. The crew can be trusted, but these little ships still find themselves jumping in harm’s way."

And that, as far as I know, consists of all canonical information there is on armed packets.

Keep in mind, this design is a translation of Rob Eagleston's T5 design. Given that Rob is close to Marc, I thought that was a pretty good place to start. Rob included both mail and passenger missions in the design -- which seems reasonable to me. So there are staterooms, a 1 ton mail vault, and barracks for the the ship's gunners (which are required for mail contracts). I suppose they could just be called "Gunners' Quarters" instead of barracks, if that is a sticking point.