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Modifying the Type-J

Sir Brad

SOC-13
Ok how would you modify the Type J? be it making it a true sole operator ship by pulling one of the converted state rooms and turning it in to a workshop or more storage, do you upgrade the turret to a double and install a Missile Launcher to run Sensor & Survey Drones, or do you just mount 100T worth of Cargo & Flue Drop Pods to the outside?


I ask because in part so I can anticipate what a player may try and do if her character can get ahead on her payments, but also so I can scatter interesting mods around the Mining Camp Spaceport, and still concentrate on the campaign instead of playing around with shipping that will largely be background.
 
If it's to be the player's ship, I'd say hand over a scout ship and say, "okay, this and this and this can't be changed without breaking the ship (the game): the rest of the boat is fair play. Get your laser welders out and I'll tell you if you've destroyed your ship completely."

If the player knows the shipbuilding system this shouldn't be hard. If she hasn't digested the shipbuilding rules, she shouldn't have her own ship: it's not fair to you as a ref to have to make all of the calls on this one: just vet what she does and make sure it doesn't break the game.
 
Well the Ship is the Banks, for the next 40 years, unless she makes a big strike.

I Don't really care about Cosmetics and Auxiliary Systems, I'm thinking about the stuff that affects the game mechanics in some significant way, what would your top three basic mods be and what would a major refit look like? for example.

I'm trying to keep ahead of WTF moments the player may pull on me when it comes to ship mods, also I want to concentrate on the campaign not spending time wiping up the Type-J Mod of the Week and trying to keep it fresh.
 
A ha. In that case, go with a standard J and err on making it comfortable and a little safer. It's no fighting ship, but drones are a good idea. I'd argue against overspecializing or cutting crew, especially if there's a bank loan involved: since the bank owns it, they're probably going to frown on excessive customization or ANYTHING that would harm the value of the ship in the probable event that they have to repo the ship and sell it.

IMTU I never figured on the J being a standard ship, but a hacked S of one stripe or another: so, a ship that's already forty or fifty years old before it goes up on blocks and gets chopped. The benefit to the player being that it's long since paid off, the tradeoff being that bits keep falling apart and it leaks atmo like a sieve.

IMTU, I can't square a bank getting behind an indie belter with a multimillion credit loan. I can just square the idea of an indie belter lucking into a rattletrap J, though I'd as soon give a new player something on the lines of a Launch that's been kitted out for belt work, or shared time on a company-owned gig.
 
one term Belter, one and only Benefit came up as a Ship, being the nice GM I am I've given her a Vacc-suit and some basic prospecting tools.
 
one term Belter, one and only Benefit came up as a Ship, being the nice GM I am I've given her a Vacc-suit and some basic prospecting tools.

Hurrah for CT char gen!

Stick to the stock boat. IIRC, though, Citizens of the Imperium didn't tie the Seeker benefit to a bank loan. The assumption being that one way or another, either the Belter struck it rich or struck it lucky, and has possession of the 100ton deathtrap.

Does the player have the skills to pilot the thing?

I'd say let her have the boat - but leave it in her lap to scramble around for a crew that a) she can afford and b) that she can trust... in which case, she's going to need to have the staterooms free.

Or maybe she can charter the boat out to a crew that does have the skills - and then her adventure turns into "how do I keep these near-pirates from stealing my ship that I hardly know how to fly."
 
7B8CA6
Pilot=1, Medic-1, Prospecting-1, Vacc-suit-1, Air/Raft-0, Computer-0

working along side an other 3 term Belter
7C8AA6
Prospecting -2, 0g Combat/Envrion -1, 0g Weapons -1, Brawling -1, Carousing -1, Engineering -1, JoT -1, Navigation -1, Pilot -1, Vacc-suit -1, Computer -0, Air/Raft -0

and a few others
 
One thought might be having that particular J comes with a 'past', it might be either such having been repossessed or recovered from an abandonment or mishap.

If so, it is possible then for you as a referee to 'allow' that the ship had some previously-made alterations and modifications by the previous owners.

Not exactly the $100 Corvette folktale but might suit your purposes.
 
That all being the case, I'd say just give her the "stock" J, and let her dream of all the modifications she can do once she's got some scratch. You give her a ship and a vacc suit, she can't really complain! Any adventurer worth their oxygen should be able to parlay that into some sort of scratch in a few sessions. No weaponry? So what - she'll never survive a real fight with that ship anyway.
 
Ok how would you modify the Type J? be it making it a true sole operator ship by pulling one of the converted state rooms and turning it in to a workshop or more storage, do you upgrade the turret to a double and install a Missile Launcher to run Sensor & Survey Drones, or do you just mount 100T worth of Cargo & Flue Drop Pods to the outside?


I ask because in part so I can anticipate what a player may try and do if her character can get ahead on her payments, but also so I can scatter interesting mods around the Mining Camp Spaceport, and still concentrate on the campaign instead of playing around with shipping that will largely be background.
The turret already is a dual turret equipped with a single pulse laser for use as a mining cutter (Sup. 07, pg. 27). Equipping the other weapon slot with a missile launcher would probably be an excellent choice.

Assuming I had the money one of the first modifications I would make is to replace the type A power plant with a custom TL-15 power plant (6MCr, but the old power plant has a list price of 8MCr and can be fitted in other ships so you can recover some of the expense). It only takes up 2 tons instead of 4 tons and it only needs 1 ton of fuel for 2 weeks of operation instead of 10 tons of fuel. This would allow cargo to be expanded by 9-11 tons, depending on whether the space used by the older power plant can be 'recovered' for cargo. Some Referees may rule that it would be impractical to move the engine bulkheads to turn that space into additional cargo space.

At TL-15 you could also pick up a fuel refinement plant. One sufficient for the ship would take up 3 tons and cost 30KCr. This would not only reduce operating expenses but would open up access to systems that lack a refueling station but which possess a gas giant/source of water (although I would speculate that such a system would probably have entrepreneurs in specially redesigned scout ships that would refuel the miners and that if they didn't the player might consider such a position for themselves).
 
I always just give the belter the whole Seeker as the benefit says nothing about a mortgage, but the description makes it clear it's very much an aftermarket modded craft, and put a few decades on it so it has 'character'.
 
...
IMTU, I can't square a bank getting behind an indie belter with a multimillion credit loan. I can just square the idea of an indie belter lucking into a rattletrap J, though I'd as soon give a new player something on the lines of a Launch that's been kitted out for belt work, or shared time on a company-owned gig.

Here's a post on cheap ships I made in another forum.

I handled this a bit differently - make the ships cheap to buy and cheap-ish to run, but keep the total amount of money available to the PCs low.

I've assumed a market for secondhand starships such as free traders, the price of which is largely driven by the condition of the ship and the revenue generating potential in a frontier region where such a ship might be operated profitably. Thus, you could buy a used trading ship for a few million credits and there is a grey market for used, refurbished and off-brand parts where the maintenance history and actual hours on the part might not be quite as presented.

This keeps the total monies in the campaign relatively low but allows the party to buy and operate a starship. This has the effect of reducing the gap between the costs of outfitting for adventuring and the finances involved in running the starship so the presence of starship-level finances doesn't unduly affect game balance for adventuring purposes.

As an analogy, there are (or were until recently) routes on which it it was still economical to run Boeing 707s, which are obsolete by most modern standards. At one point the market value for an airworthy 707 was about 2 million USD. Similarly, there was quite a substantial market in third party parts and maintenance services for DC3's , which were widely used in third world countries right into the 1980s and later. These services went as far as upgrade kits to fit turboprop engines to the airframe.

If you take this analogy, you can have a market for folks buying and running used trading ships where the purchase price is a small fraction - perhaps 5-20% of the new value - of the craft. The price is driven not by the cost of constructing the ship but by the revenue generating potential - i.e. at what point does the ROI make purchasing the ship worth it.

Say, for argument's sake, that the revenue generating potential of a type A2 trader is Cr60,000 for cargo and Cr40,000 for passengers, giving a revenue of Cr100,000 per jump or Cr2.4 million per annum. Each jump uses Cr22,000 worth of refined fuel and the maintenance cost is Cr500,000 per annum and Cr1000 landing fees per jump for 24 jumps per annum. Crew salaries are (say) Cr250,000 per annum.

Assuming you've got 2.4 million of revenue and 1.3m of costs per annum your ship can bring in a gross profit of (say) Cr1.1m P/A. If you assume this is a somewhat risky venture and insist on a 20% ROI then this means you can justify investing Cr5.5 million in total, which defines the market value of the ship as Cr5.5 million less the cost of any work that needs doing. A bank might insist on a 20% down payment of 1.1 million, which is a figure that could be achieved by a party of adventurers without making them so wealthy as to cause issues with game balance.

This keeps the finances a bit more tame, so you can go with a party of adventurers running their ship on a shoestring without having to write in a third party stumping up 50-100 million for the purchase of the ship.
 
Mmmm, the Seeker has the benefit of already having half its fuel tankage converted to "storage", so...

Turn it into a Gun Sloop and go into business escorting Jump-1 merchant ships and patrolling semi-civilized areas:

Install an L-M-S turret, or (if you're adventurous) a triple-turret missile launcher. Or, if you're even more adventurous, replace it with a dual barbette Particle Accelerator.

Or, replace the turret with three fixed points (or firmpoints) and individually install a missile tube, a mining laser, and a sandcaster. Perhaps not as useful as a LMS turret though.
 
Turn it into a Gun Sloop and go into business escorting Jump-1 merchant ships and patrolling semi-civilized areas:

In such an application, you will probably want to upgrade the quaint lil' ol' Model/1bis computer to at least a Model/2 so you can have something approaching combat efficiency and survivability.
 
Characters are a pair of Belters, a Marine and a Merchant with a mostly Admin & Sales background.

after checking Sup 4, Belt Strike and a few other sources the majority give the ship in question free and clear, others are ambiguous on the mortgage status, so Free ship for the PC, the other Belter also has a Ship that she optioned as a J-200 (a custom 200t belter ship) that I'm insisting on being mortgaged.

game despite the players being most enthusiastic about is having problems getting off the ground.

when it launches I'm going to run a disguised Beltstrike with stuff stolen from MgT Beltstrike and some places outside of Trav.

having the ship free and clear kind of adds to my coustomasion concerns since their are no bank payments to keep profits down things will start sooner than I would like fro my narrative. I'm not a "Money is Evil" GM, it has it's place, and it may come too soon.
 
having the ship free and clear kind of adds to my customization concerns

So the ship creaks a bit, some doors open fine in flight but stick when the landing feet are on a flat surface, certain controls have a 5% failure rate AND a lag, the sensors have a case of cataracts, and the nice big cargo bay smells of sulfur no matter how ofter you purge it and looks like it was used to pop space popcorn once too often. Or twice too often.

A free ship may have character, or BE a character in many respects.
 
Well it's not Free-free, it cost the character their only Benefit Roll, so I figure it's their inheritance that cost them their life savings to get the title transferred over.
 
Characters are a pair of Belters, a Marine and a Merchant with a mostly Admin & Sales background.

after checking Sup 4, Belt Strike and a few other sources the majority give the ship in question free and clear, others are ambiguous on the mortgage status, so Free ship for the PC, the other Belter also has a Ship that she optioned as a J-200 (a custom 200t belter ship) that I'm insisting on being mortgaged.

game despite the players being most enthusiastic about is having problems getting off the ground.

when it launches I'm going to run a disguised Beltstrike with stuff stolen from MgT Beltstrike and some places outside of Trav.

having the ship free and clear kind of adds to my coustomasion concerns since their are no bank payments to keep profits down things will start sooner than I would like fro my narrative. I'm not a "Money is Evil" GM, it has it's place, and it may come too soon.

Money in a miner boom- easy come, easy go.

ist2_1621568_money_pit.jpg


And that ship is just one unending repair job waiting to happen.

And that was before they started customizing.
 
Yeah go tanstaafl on this one. For the freebie, keep it basic: for every mod, throw in a "quirk."

On the other hand, you can use this to make sure they internalize the ship rules, player-wise. If they want to just use the ship as transportation/setting, they won't really need to, but if they really want a cool ship they pretty much ought to do the heavy lifting and really learn the system. Ref has plenty else to do.
 
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