Open source?

[RickA]

Can you write adventures/modules for T20 and pdf them for sale on sites like RPGNow?

If not, isn't it slightly odd that a game that benifits from a gaming open source license isn't open source itself?

I am a firm believer that the number and quality of adventures/modules available for a product helps determine how likely a new person is to buy the core product. If people can write and pdf their own adventures for the product easily and painlessly then the entire product line benifits (as I think Wizards of the Coast has proven).

It sure would be great to be able to put together high quality T20 materials and maybe actually get recompensed for the product if the market deems it worthy of dollars.

 

[Flynn]

RickA,

Those portions of the rules that are designated as Open Source are available, and as such, can be used in a PDF of your creation. Basing your work solely on T20 rules will allow you to move forward without additional licensure, but you can't identify your product as Traveller-based, since that's protected as Product Identity. For that reason, you could never advertise that your product was Traveller compatible or that it supported Traveller based on what is Open Game Content alone. Using the Traveller name requires permission from Marc Miller.

Bear in mind that the entire background known as the OTU (Official Traveller Universe) is not OGL, and is not open for creation purposes. So none of the PDF adventures you are suggesting can be set in the OTU setting, and thus may not have as much marketing appeal as you project.

Now, there's nothing to stop you from submitting adventures to QLI for publication as an official T20 product. I'd suggest that as a possible course of action, if you are interested in selling OTU products. (In fact, I tend to suggest that people do so fairly regularly on the board if they start talking about a lack of products out there. I figure that if you have the energy to complain, you should put your money where your mouth is and do something about it. I don't mean anything about it, but I prefer that people offer solutions rather than complaints.)

As an FYI, there is a Limited License that should be available soon that will allow people to publish non-OTU products for multiple Traveller systems (all but GT) and use the Traveller name, but that's still in the works.

Finally, both FFE and QLI have Fair Use Policies that allow you to create a fanzine, so long as it's free, that lets you support Traveller in its many and various forms. I refer you to Stellar Reaches as an example of such. (See my sig, below.)

Hope this helps,
Flynn

 

[RickA]

Excellent. It's a shame that OTU isn't available as open source material, think of all the great pdfs you could buy if it was!

Submitting materials for publishing to a company that publishes official books is a much higher bar to clear than self publishing pdf's, which sadly removes a lot of average quality (but still worth $5 as a .pdf) material from the players.

I'll see about writing adventures. I wonder how interested they are in adventures in a format other than the old school epic system?

 

[RainOfSteel]

Originally posted by RickA:
It's a shame that OTU isn't available as open source material [...]

The OTU will never be open-source, in much the same way that the Forgotten Relams, Eberron, Greyhawk, Dark Sun, Mastica, Ravenloft, Mystara, the World of Darkness, Mythic Europe, the official Marvel Universe, et. al. will never be open-source.

 

[kafka47]

I would have to concur that Traveller might be better off, if more of its IP (Intellectual Property) was rendered Open Source. The Limited Licencing agreement does not allow us to build a type of universe that we can all play in (for there are too many canonistas amongst us who will only play OTU sanctioned products).

My feeling is Traveller is going through a renaissance it must also go through a re-visioning process. And, if that revisioning is going to take the form of 10,000 monkeys, at least, we will get our Hamlet.

 

[Malenfant]

The OTU was licensed out to a lot of people in the 70s and 80s. Now it seems MWM is a lot more careful about who he licenses it to - maybe he feels burned by the experience and wants to retain control over the OTU while allowing people to use the systems.

 

[RickA]

Been thinking about this, and moreso than any other game made the OTU is Traveller, not the mechanics. I guess that's the difference in my mind. The mechanics are almost irrelevent to the game.

 

[kafka47]

Originally posted by Malenfant:
The OTU was licensed out to a lot of people in the 70s and 80s. Now it seems MWM is a lot more careful about who he licenses it to - maybe he feels burned by the experience and wants to retain control over the OTU while allowing people to use the systems.

Yes, I am sure that is Marc's reasoning but if the soil is going to be upturned and new pastures are going to be sown.

There has to be diversity for the overall harvest to flourish. Now much of what might be produced will be sh*t but out that new plants will get their nutrients and grow & flourish. Now the OTU needs to be viewed as the seeds in this field. Right now we do have excellent farmers (QLI & FFE) and I won't hold a grudge - SJG. But, these companies are involved in some fairly intensive exercises leaving fans to grope want more than these companies with limited budgets can afford to produce on the market.

However, if the field was opened up to independents, we would get greater brand recognition and exposure plus a whole host of ideas that even the bigger boys can poach.

One forgets the humble origins and looks of the early DGP & SGS looked very amateurish and looked nothing like the "professional" & slick GDW products yet the quality improved and the fans know the rest.

An example, once SJG promised something called Fighter Pilots...now I wished to have something like right after the end of the Cold War Popular Mechanics did a profile of the latest American planes versus the very best that Soviet Union could have produced. I suggested to Loren that this would be perfect as a Zhodani-Imperial backdrop...now that product and in fact the entire line was dropped. Why shouldn't the author be compensated by allowing him to produce it for RPGNow or similar venue?

Products could be vetted by Marc but create guidelines broad enough to allow a thousand flowers to bloom.

 

[RandyT0001]

Originally posted by RickA:
Can you write adventures/modules for T20 and pdf them for sale on sites like RPGNow?

If not, isn't it slightly odd that a game that benifits from a gaming open source license isn't open source itself?

I am a firm believer that the number and quality of adventures/modules available for a product helps determine how likely a new person is to buy the core product. If people can write and pdf their own adventures for the product easily and painlessly then the entire product line benifits (as I think Wizards of the Coast has proven).

It sure would be great to be able to put together high quality T20 materials and maybe actually get recompensed for the product if the market deems it worthy of dollars.

I think that the limited license in the works will address this. You will be able to use any Traveller game mechanic (except Gurps) to create your own Traveller material not set in the Official Traveller Universe. If you have a limited license you will be able to create, produce and sell PDF's here on CotI and RPGNow (I think RPGNow will be included). As far as I know this material can be set in your Alternate Traveller Universe or can be generic, non-setting specific. Once this limited license is finally set up by Hunter and Marc (please hurry guys) I'm sure you will soon see a vast increase in the number of Traveller related products, adventures, and universes.

(Marc and Hunter, please hurry and finalize the limited license package. Thanks.)

 

[kafka47]

Whilst, I do agree with the concept for the limited licence why not also open up the OTU history to fill those blank spots and areas/spaces of the OTU that cannot be filled eg. the Alien Realms or certain sectors that will never go through an official product?

These way create a real fermentation or allow for Traveller to grow beyond its borders. The Limited Licence reminds me of all the products that are already aviable but just using a Traveller mechanic instead of Ronin Arts or RPGObjects path.

 

[RandyT0001]

Originally posted by kafka47:
Whilst, I do agree with the concept for the limited licence why not also open up the OTU history to fill those blank spots and areas/spaces of the OTU that cannot be filled eg. the Alien Realms or certain sectors that will never go through an official product?

Probably for the same reason that Forgotten Realms, Greyhawk, etc (as Rain of Steel mentioned) are not open source. Game companies want to maintain a certain standard of production, compatability and consistancy in their official game worlds. They want to maintain editoral control. Each of these worlds/ settings has large underused blank spots in them also. AFAIK if you want to write something official for Forgotten Realms, etc you have to author it and submit it through the owning game company, WotC doesn't sell licenses to independent companies to write for their specific game settings. Marc does. Hunter at QLI, Steve at SJG, Loren Wiseman Products, plus Martin at Avenger Enterprises all have bought full licenses and can write material for the official game universe. (Gurps in it's Golden Age extension universe though.) If you want to fill in those blank spots of the OTU, submit your adventure, etc. through one of these license holders or buy a full license yourself.

These way create a real fermentation or allow for Traveller to grow beyond its borders. The Limited Licence reminds me of all the products that are already aviable but just using a Traveller mechanic instead of Ronin Arts or RPGObjects path.

I have not bought any of the Ronin Arts nor RPGObjects products but from what I can see in the product writeups and samples provided here through QLI it appears that these products are not based on Traveller (T20) but on D20 open source material. They do not have "Approved for use with Traveller" on them. AFAIK they do not use the T20 based D20 mechanics (ship construction rules, PC classes, etc.) but could be converted from D20 space/future based OGL for use with T20. From what I understand the limited license material will be able to have the "Approved for use with Traveller" logo on it. An important selling point if your target market is the Traveller fan base. The LL material will be based on the mechanics of a Traveller game (CT, MT, TNE, T4 or T20) and could, with little conversion, be use for any Traveller game which is based on the same specific game mechanic (CT, MT etc.)

 

[RickA]

I know I haven't bought any Ronin stuff, because I don't want to waste my money on a D20 Future product when I don't play D20 Future. I play T20.

/sigh/

It really comes down to the somewhat unique position Traveller finds itself in. Traveller is NOT the mechanics of the game (the sort of thing that is often open sourced nowdays) but instead Traveller is the SETTING.

GURPs, T20, whatever, it's all about the setting for Traveller in a Traveller game. And I'd love to see that setting be open, but understand why it isn't. One wonders how much that license costs?

 

[kafka47]

Randy wrote:

Probably for the same reason that Forgotten Realms, Greyhawk, etc (as Rain of Steel mentioned) are not open source. Game companies want to maintain a certain standard of production, compatability and consistancy in their official game worlds. They want to maintain editoral control. Each of these worlds/ settings has large underused blank spots in them also. AFAIK if you want to write something official for Forgotten Realms, etc you have to author it and submit it through the owning game company, WotC doesn't sell licenses to independent companies to write for their specific game settings. Marc does. Hunter at QLI, Steve at SJG, Loren Wiseman Products, plus Martin at Avenger Enterprises all have bought full licenses and can write material for the official game universe. (Gurps in it's Golden Age extension universe though.) If you want to fill in those blank spots of the OTU, submit your adventure, etc. through one of these license holders or buy a full license yourself.

Licences are expensive. Rather, if there could be some portions of the land openned up to allow for experimentation it would allow good and bad to coexist.

 

[jonathonbarton]

Define "Expensive"?

Hundreds?
Thousands?
Tens of Thousands?

 

[kafka47]

For me anything above Cnd$50.00 would be expensive. But, if it was done right one could use this site or similar sites and just have a portion collected that would go back into FFE or other consortium that could distribute funds for start-ups.

My objective is to create a Traveller renaissance, much as, there was recognition that Traveller had nothing on par with it in the 1980s, I would want to see that return for the 21st century as we have a real quality product and the brand recognition is slowly disappearing under the weight of poor exposure, at least in the Ontario market.

 

[The Hinterworlds Rambler]

I'd pay for even an "Approved for Use with TRAVELLER" if the price and benefit was right.

 

[Flynn]

That's what the limited license will be about, my friend.

Looking forward to it,
Flynn

 

[RickA]

Yah, but without the OTU being allowed to be used, you are virtually commited to creating an entire new campaign setting.

That's a prodigious amount of work, 90% of which will be wasted effort, just to get to the point where you can create and publish some modules.

It's a shame, but since Traveller IS the OTU and that is not likely to ever be available for use by pdf publishers it looks like Traveller will continue to have a dearth of material available for it.