Spinward Light Freighter
- Thread starter san*klass
- Start date
Don't know anything about it, but if you need quick 100Td plans try scribbling on plans for a Type J Seeker (or the Type S Scout/Courier that the J's derived from). The wiki description is nicely written, though.
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AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
The wiki entry is marked non-canon, so it's presumably not a published design.
It's difficult to build using LBB2, you'd have to make it larger to match the performance, but that would make it more expensive.
Original:
A LBB2 design at 120 Dt would be match the performance, but note the cost...
It's difficult to build using LBB2, you'd have to make it larger to match the performance, but that would make it more expensive.
Original:
Code:
LF-1611111-000000-10000-0 MCr 28,6 100 Dton
bearing 1 Crew=3
batteries 1 TL=9
Pass=4 Low=24 Cargo=20 Fuel=11 EP=1 Agility=0
Single Occupancy 20 35,7
USP # Dton Cost
Hull, Streamlined Custom 1 100
Configuration Flattened Sphe 6 8
Jump Drive 1 1 2 8
Manoeuvre D 1 1 2 3
Power Plant 1 1 3 9
Fuel, #J, #weeks J-1, 4 weeks 1 11
Bridge 1 20 0,5
Computer m/1 1 1 1 2
Staterooms 7 28 3,5
Low Berths 24 12 1,2
Cargo 20
Single Turret Pulse 1 1 1 0,5
Nominal Cost MCr 35,70 Sum: 20 35,7
Class Cost MCr 7,50 Valid ≥0 ≥0
Ship Cost MCr 28,56
Crew & High 2 Crew Bridge 1
Passengers Mid 2 3 Engineers 0
Low 24 Gunners 1
Extra SR 0 Frozen Service 1
# Frozen W 0 0 Flight 0
Marines 0 Marines 0
Estimated Economy of Ship Standard
Ship price Down Payment Mortgage Avg Filled
MCr 28,56 kCr 5 712 kCr 119 100%
Expenses per jump Revenue
Bank Cr 57 120 High Cr 20 000
Fuel Cr 5 500 Middle Cr 16 000
Life Support Cr 16 400 Low Cr 24 000
Salaries Cr 4 800 Cargo Cr 20 000
Maintenance Cr 1 142
Berthing Cr 100
Summa kCr 85 kCr 80
Income potential per jump kCr -5
Yearly yield on down payment -2,2%A LBB2 design at 120 Dt would be match the performance, but note the cost...
Code:
LF-1611111-000000-10000-0 MCr 46,2 120 Dton
bearing 1 Crew=3
batteries 1 TL=9
Pass=4 Low=24 Cargo=21 Fuel=22 EP=1,2 Agility=0
Single Occupancy LBB2 design 21 51,3
USP # Dton Cost
Hull, Streamlined Custom 1 120
Configuration Flattened Sphe 6 21,2
Scoops Streamlined
Jump Drive A 1 1 10 10
Manoeuvre D A 1 1 1 4
Power Plant A 1 1 4 8
Fuel, #J, #weeks J-1, 4 weeks 1 22
Bridge 1 20 0,6
Computer m/1 1 1 1 2
Staterooms 7 28 3,5
Low Berths 24 12 1,2
Cargo 21
Single Turret Pulse 1 1 1 0,8
Nominal Cost MCr 51,30 Sum: 21 51,3
Class Cost MCr 5,64 Valid ≥0 ≥0
Ship Cost MCr 46,17
Crew & High 2 Crew Bridge 1
Passengers Mid 2 3 Engineers 0
Low 24 Gunners 1
Extra SR 0 Frozen Service 1
# Frozen W 0 0 Flight 0
Marines 0 Marines 0
Estimated Economy of Ship Standard
Ship price Down Payment Mortgage Avg Filled
MCr 46,17 kCr 9 234 kCr 192 100%
Expenses per jump Revenue
Bank Cr 92 340 High Cr 20 000
Fuel Cr 11 000 Middle Cr 16 000
Life Support Cr 16 400 Low Cr 24 000
Salaries Cr 4 800 Cargo Cr 20 000
Maintenance Cr 1 847
Berthing Cr 120
Summa kCr 127 kCr 80
Income potential per jump kCr -47
Yearly yield on down payment -12,6%
Traveller5 gets quite close to it. Assuming the 5t strongroom is to allow some secure cargo beyond mail, the overtonnage rules allow it to be 103.5 tons safely and still land on wilderness surfaces.
Subsidized Freighter FK-AS11 Paya MCr36.5 (MCr 29.2)
Using a 100-ton, TL9 hull, the Paya-class Subsidized Freighter mounts jump drive-A, maneuver drive-A, and power plant-A, giving a performance of jump-1 and 1G acceleration. Fuel tankage supports a 1 parsec jump, at 10t per parsec, and one month of operations. Attached to the bridge is a Computer Model/1. There are 7 staterooms and 24 low berths. Installed weaponry include 1 T1 Pulse Laser. Cargo capacity is 21 tons. The ship has a streamlined hull.
The ship has up to 3 crew, and can carry 5 passengers and 24 low passengers.
Overtonnage: 3.5 tons
Crew comfort: +0
Passenger demand: +0
Subsidized Freighter FK-AS11 Paya MCr36.5 (MCr 29.2)
Using a 100-ton, TL9 hull, the Paya-class Subsidized Freighter mounts jump drive-A, maneuver drive-A, and power plant-A, giving a performance of jump-1 and 1G acceleration. Fuel tankage supports a 1 parsec jump, at 10t per parsec, and one month of operations. Attached to the bridge is a Computer Model/1. There are 7 staterooms and 24 low berths. Installed weaponry include 1 T1 Pulse Laser. Cargo capacity is 21 tons. The ship has a streamlined hull.
The ship has up to 3 crew, and can carry 5 passengers and 24 low passengers.
Overtonnage: 3.5 tons
Crew comfort: +0
Passenger demand: +0
Code:
Tons Component MCr Notes
------- ----------------------------------- ----- --------------------
100 Streamlined Hull, lifters, 1 a/l fr 8 S, lifters, 1 a/l free
1 Landing legs with pads 1
0 AV=9. 1 Kinetic Plate 0
0 AV=0. c Reflec 0
10 Jump Fuel (1 parsec) 0 1 parsec jump, at 10t per parsec
1 Plant Fuel (one month) 0 one month
2 Maneuver Drive-1 (A) 4 1 G
10 Jump Drive-1 (A) 10 J 1
4 PowerPlant-1 (A) 4 P 1
1 Vd T1 Pulse Laser 0.5
1 Computer Model/1 std 1.5
1 Life Support Standard 1 10 person-months
0.5 Med Console 0.5
1.5 Cramped Bridge 0.4 1cc 2op 0ws
0.5 Crew Shared Fresher 0.5 4 crew
4 2x Crew Stateroom 0.2 #2 1 crew
5 Crew Commons 0
21 Cargo Hold Basic 0
12 24x Low Berth 2.4 #24 1 passenger
5 Mail Vault and Strongroom 1 for express contracts
10 5x Standard Stateroom 0.5 #5 1 passenger
12 3x Passenger Commons 0 #3
1 2x Shared Fresher 1 #2 4 passengers
Last edited:
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
"Life support is for the weak!!"
LOL
I also broke down and made it Streamlined. It's within MCr 1 of the High Guard design prices.
Note that the sensor package is completely substandard and barely usable.
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Well, I have sat down and tried to design this with Bk2 rules, and hit a few snags.
Mostly that BK2 A drives give twos, which with appropriate fuel, leave little cargo space. I have no idea if this is canon or not, but I just have to assume that these drives have been dialled-down some how from 2 to 1?
The other is that the 51dt modular cargo/passenger section is actually only 30dt - but hey!
Lastly, since I can't see any pictures of plans, I will need to do my own house ruled ones.
So, given that Fuel is 20, Engineering is 15, Modular section is 30 and Bridge and Quarters are 35.
I am assuming a flat floored semi duck-billed forward section for sensors/bridge/computers ship's locker/2 crew staterooms and fixed 5t for Mail. Then going aft the 30t module, with a flat, diagonal aft, with unimpeded cargo doors. Over the front of the module are stubby swept half-height wings with 10dt fuel in each. Then aft is a full-height "hump" for engineering. It is streamlined.
Just my thoughts.
Mostly that BK2 A drives give twos, which with appropriate fuel, leave little cargo space. I have no idea if this is canon or not, but I just have to assume that these drives have been dialled-down some how from 2 to 1?
The other is that the 51dt modular cargo/passenger section is actually only 30dt - but hey!
Lastly, since I can't see any pictures of plans, I will need to do my own house ruled ones.
So, given that Fuel is 20, Engineering is 15, Modular section is 30 and Bridge and Quarters are 35.
I am assuming a flat floored semi duck-billed forward section for sensors/bridge/computers ship's locker/2 crew staterooms and fixed 5t for Mail. Then going aft the 30t module, with a flat, diagonal aft, with unimpeded cargo doors. Over the front of the module are stubby swept half-height wings with 10dt fuel in each. Then aft is a full-height "hump" for engineering. It is streamlined.
Just my thoughts.
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Spinward Flow
SOC-14 1K
The hull configuration is a flattened saucer.
The bridge is a pod on the starboard side facing forwards.
The first mate is a furry.
She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts kid ...
The bridge is a pod on the starboard side facing forwards.
The first mate is a furry.
She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts kid ...
I think it's worth noting that T5 uses 2%*Pn as baseline power plant fuel allocation for a month (about 2x the LBB5 requirement). Tech Level Stage Effects modify that a bit.
GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
It's an interesting idea, but a bit tight in 100 tons. If someone wants to take the above tonnage breakdowns and determine what is part of the modular section vs what is in the fixed hull, we can lay out the hull.
If you want to "cheat," (AKA this is house rules), the formulae underlying the Drive Performance Table in LBB2 gives you a Jump Drive "1/2A" at 7.5Td and MCr 5, and a Power Plant "1/2A" at 2.5Td and MCr 4; however, it yields nonsense for the maneuver drive (ZERO Td and MCr 2), so set 1Td as the minimum maneuver drive size for plausibility's sake. Drive package is then 10Td and MCr 11.
An alternate interpretation of that house rules thing is to combine the Power Plant and M-Drive, so that the two taken together are 2.5Td and MCr6. However, it can only be used to power the Maneuver Drive or Jump Drive -- not both simultaneously -- and cannot be used to power any other ship component that requires Energy Points in LBB5.
(This interpretation reaches back to first edition LBB2, which kind of implied that the maneuver drive was a thrust-producing accessory to the power plant -- a rocket nozzle or something like that -- and didn't use the power plant for the Jump Drive at all.)
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This 1/2 A sounds like the best "cheat" to make this ship have any chance of working in LBB2 rules.
I presume, anyway, that the very very first JD's would be J1, and this solution supplies that.
But, technology has long since moved on from that, to J2 being the minimum for a 100dt hull. However, Paya are still using the old 1/2A for their ships.
Might in part explain why Paya Shipyards insist on annual (or any sort of) maintenance only being done on either Paya or Inthe.
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AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
Doesn't really matter how large the drives are if you are using a standard hull with fixed engineering compartment.
If you bother with the cost, you really want a standard hull...
Or just use the LBB5 original?
If you are building a small ship LBB2 tries very hard to force you to build the Scout or the Free Trader with minimal variations.
If you bother with the cost, you really want a standard hull...
Or just use the LBB5 original?
If you are building a small ship LBB2 tries very hard to force you to build the Scout or the Free Trader with minimal variations.
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
With LBB2 this is what you get:
or
The basic option is the number of staterooms.
If you want more options, go for a 400 Dt hull or LBB5.
Code:
AL-12222R1-000000-00000-0 MCr 27,0 100 Dton
bearing Crew=1
batteries TL=9
Cargo=20 Fuel=40 EP=2 Agility=2
Single Occupancy LBB2 design 20 30
USP # Dton Cost
Hull, Streamlined 100 Dt 1 100
Configuration Cone 2 3
Scoops Streamlined
Jump Drive A 2 1 10 10
Manoeuvre D A 2 1 1 4
Power Plant A 2 1 4 8
Fuel, #J, #weeks J-2, 4 weeks 2 40
Bridge 1 20 0,5
Computer m/1bis R 1 1 4
Staterooms 1 4 0,5
Cargo 20
Nominal Cost MCr 30,00 Sum: 20 30
Class Cost MCr 3,30 Valid ≥0 ≥0
Ship Cost MCr 27,00or
Code:
AL-2211111-000000-00000-0 MCr 32,9 200 Dton
bearing Crew=3
batteries TL=9
Cargo=122 Fuel=30 EP=2 Agility=1
Single Occupancy LBB2 design 122 36,5
USP # Dton Cost
Hull, Streamlined 200 Dt 2 200
Configuration Cone 2 10
Scoops Streamlined
Jump Drive A 1 1 10 10
Manoeuvre D A 1 1 1 4
Power Plant A 1 1 4 8
Fuel, #J, #weeks J-1, 4 weeks 1 30
Bridge 1 20 1
Computer m/1 1 1 1 2
Staterooms 3 12 1,5
Cargo 122
Nominal Cost MCr 36,50 Sum: 122 36,5
Class Cost MCr 4,02 Valid ≥0 ≥0
Ship Cost MCr 32,85The basic option is the number of staterooms.
If you want more options, go for a 400 Dt hull or LBB5.
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 1K
Give it up guys. The only way to get J1/M1/PP1 out of a 100 ton hull is to use LBB5.80 custom drives ... not LBB2.81 standard drives.
Standard A drives in a 100 ton hull yields J2/M2/PP2 and you basically wind up with a derivative of a Scout/Courier of some kind.
Honestly, the "best build" for the Paya Freighter would be a sort of hybrid Type S through J until reaching M local variant of the Scout/Courier with A/A/A scout drives in a standard hull (so no fuel purification required) with 30 tons of fuel that is J1 with 4 weeks of power plant endurance nominal (so Type J Seeker standard) but which can perform a J2 with 2 weeks of power plant endurance when needed (because Fuel Is Fungible™).
With standard A drives and external towing capacity you start moving into the realm of my Type-ST Scout/X-Courier concept design with a business plan oriented towards external cargo maneuver and jump towing of 1-3 Modular Cutter Modules for transport. With 30 tons of fuel instead of 40 tons, that leaves 25 tons remaining (5 tons of which could be a Mail Vault on a subsidized route) leaving 20 tons remaining for staterooms/low berths/internal cargo.
THAT would make for a more reasonable Paya class Light Freighter which is nominally J1 with an external load, but which can achieve J2 without an external load, giving the ship more destinations than just being limited to the spur of the Spinward Main that Paya is on.
Being able to jump to Feri-Roup, Regina-Yori, Enope-Wochiers, Moughas-Rethe, Paya-Focaline would be a valuable addition to the capabilities of the Paya class Light Freighter without requiring the use of L-Hyd drop tanks to do so. It would probably be best then for the freighter to not have internal space devoted to passenger services so that it can transport 20-25 tons of cargo across J2 and then use external towing of a passenger configured Modular Cutter Module in order to provide passenger service (6 high passengers, 1 steward/medic, 4 low passengers = 7 staterooms + 4 low berths = 30 tons). The other two external Modular Cutter Module slots can then be used for cargo transport (adding another 60 tons of capacity).
Standard A drives in a 100 ton hull yields J2/M2/PP2 and you basically wind up with a derivative of a Scout/Courier of some kind.
Honestly, the "best build" for the Paya Freighter would be a sort of hybrid Type S through J until reaching M local variant of the Scout/Courier with A/A/A scout drives in a standard hull (so no fuel purification required) with 30 tons of fuel that is J1 with 4 weeks of power plant endurance nominal (so Type J Seeker standard) but which can perform a J2 with 2 weeks of power plant endurance when needed (because Fuel Is Fungible™).
With standard A drives and external towing capacity you start moving into the realm of my Type-ST Scout/X-Courier concept design with a business plan oriented towards external cargo maneuver and jump towing of 1-3 Modular Cutter Modules for transport. With 30 tons of fuel instead of 40 tons, that leaves 25 tons remaining (5 tons of which could be a Mail Vault on a subsidized route) leaving 20 tons remaining for staterooms/low berths/internal cargo.
THAT would make for a more reasonable Paya class Light Freighter which is nominally J1 with an external load, but which can achieve J2 without an external load, giving the ship more destinations than just being limited to the spur of the Spinward Main that Paya is on.
Being able to jump to Feri-Roup, Regina-Yori, Enope-Wochiers, Moughas-Rethe, Paya-Focaline would be a valuable addition to the capabilities of the Paya class Light Freighter without requiring the use of L-Hyd drop tanks to do so. It would probably be best then for the freighter to not have internal space devoted to passenger services so that it can transport 20-25 tons of cargo across J2 and then use external towing of a passenger configured Modular Cutter Module in order to provide passenger service (6 high passengers, 1 steward/medic, 4 low passengers = 7 staterooms + 4 low berths = 30 tons). The other two external Modular Cutter Module slots can then be used for cargo transport (adding another 60 tons of capacity).
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 1K
Oh and just as an aside to the above, if you add a single external Modular Cutter Module configured for fuel (so +30 tons of fuel) you wind up with 60 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 30 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 13+5=18 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 3J1 range and still have 30+30=60-18-18-18=6 tons of fuel remaining for a 4th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal only transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 20 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
If you add a single external Modular Cutter Module configured for passengers/cargo plus one external Modular Cutter Module configured for fuel (so +30 tons of fuel) you wind up with 60 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 30 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 16+5=21 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 2J1 range and still have 30+30=60--21-21=18 tons of fuel remaining for a 3-5th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal plus one 30 ton module of transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 50 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
If you add a two external Modular Cutter Modules configured for fuel (so +30 tons of fuel) you wind up with 90 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 60 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 16+5=21 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 4J1 range and still have 30+60=90--21-21-21-21=9 tons of fuel remaining for a 5-6th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal only transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 20 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
If you add a single external Modular Cutter Module configured for passengers/cargo plus two external Modular Cutter Modules configured for fuel (so +60 tons of fuel) you wind up with 90 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 60 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 19+5=24 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 3J1 range and still have 30+60=90--24-24-24=18 tons of fuel remaining for a 4-6th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal plus one 30 ton module of transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 50 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
Such is the flexibility offered by external cargo capacity when it isn't wasted.
If you add a single external Modular Cutter Module configured for passengers/cargo plus one external Modular Cutter Module configured for fuel (so +30 tons of fuel) you wind up with 60 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 30 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 16+5=21 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 2J1 range and still have 30+30=60--21-21=18 tons of fuel remaining for a 3-5th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal plus one 30 ton module of transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 50 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
If you add a two external Modular Cutter Modules configured for fuel (so +30 tons of fuel) you wind up with 90 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 60 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 16+5=21 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 4J1 range and still have 30+60=90--21-21-21-21=9 tons of fuel remaining for a 5-6th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal only transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 20 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
If you add a single external Modular Cutter Module configured for passengers/cargo plus two external Modular Cutter Modules configured for fuel (so +60 tons of fuel) you wind up with 90 tons of fuel capacity for a J1 Freighter (30 tons internal, 60 tons external). Assuming 5 tons fuel consumption per week by the power plant (20/4=5 per week) ... at J1 consuming 19+5=24 tons of fuel per week, you could achieve a 3J1 range and still have 30+60=90--24-24-24=18 tons of fuel remaining for a 4-6th week of endurance at the destination before needing to refuel. You would be limited to internal plus one 30 ton module of transport capacity, but if you're got a buy low/sell high speculative cargo of 50 tons or less onboard, that could be a worthwhile proposition to transport.
Such is the flexibility offered by external cargo capacity when it isn't wasted.
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
Much simpler, and within the rules, is a 10 Dt collapsible tank in the cargo hold to get double jump capability.
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