Inside a Gas Giant

[tjoneslo]

There is a race that lives in the gas giants.

If I were not being completely lazy I would go through the list of sophonts and post the ones that are from a gas giant. I know of at least two off the top of my head.

My question would be, do you think that the smaller brown dwarf stars would (or could) also potentially have life forms as well. Unlike the Gas Giants, there would be no metallic hydrogen layer. But a really good source of energy all the way down.

One of the type of creatures I've not seen is a plasmosynthetic autotroph, or a plant-like creature feeding on the energy of plasma. Which would be an ideal kind of creature living in a slowly cooling brown dwarf star.

 

[Lycanorukke]

One of the type of creatures I've not seen is a plasmosynthetic autotroph, or a plant-like creature feeding on the energy of plasma.

Like the C'tan in 40K?

 

[savage]

If I were not being completely lazy I would go through the list of sophonts and post the ones that are from a gas giant. I know of at least two off the top of my head.
.

Yeah. The wiki is nice but the sophont list is time consuming. I suppose a search might pull them up. Anyhow, I don't recall two, good to know.

 

[Spartan159]

Jgd-ll-jagd and Sheol I'm guessing?

 

[kilemall]

Battle inside a gas giant- the nuke effects are fanciful, but you can probably expect the sensors and high wind. Starts at 07:00.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3gruhq

 

[Lycanorukke]

Battle inside a gas giant- the nuke effects are fanciful, but you can probably expect the sensors and high wind. Starts at 07:00.

One thing I can say. If you can't scratch the enemy ship with weapons fire when you could literally shake hands with the pilot, you need a new targetting computer.

But on the battle side in a GG - in the atmosphere missiles would be useless. The moment they pop out of the launcher they are blown away by winds, or zapped with an electrical surge (fast moving metal object in a charged environment). Even if they survive they would be fighting the wind the whole way to get to the target.

Nukes would be right out - an EMP is bad enough, but think what a EMP in a magnetosphere as powerful as Jupiters would be.

Lasers would be strongly attenuated. Even if you could tune them to find the 'gaps' in the chemical makeup the rapidly changing conditions would make it hard. but they would be the most effective of general weapons.

Mass drivers would be OK at short range, but would suffer wind effects quickly. Particle beams I dont know, but they have never worked well in atmospheres. Meson guns of course are unaffected.

Sensor wise, Trav can use densitometers and neutrino sensors to get scans (I cant remember if they can give locks).

And there wont be salvage. If the engines/anti grav stops for any reason you're on a express elevator to hell. So a GG is a reasonable place to hide, but a crap place to fight in.

 

[aramis]

But on the battle side in a GG - in the atmosphere missiles would be useless. The moment they pop out of the launcher they are blown away by winds, or zapped with an electrical surge (fast moving metal object in a charged environment). Even if they survive they would be fighting the wind the whole way to get to the target.

They'd be fighting the wind no more so than the ships would, and are likely better streamlined.

 

[Lycanorukke]

They'd be fighting the wind no more so than the ships would, and are likely better streamlined.

But are also vastly lighter and dont have unlimited power/fuel.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Here's the classic image from Sagan's COSMOS (although flipped, I think);

http://www.wordsaretoys.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Jovian-Life-II.jpg

 

[coliver988]

I am also reminded of the scene in 2010 where they aerobrake - everything was shaking quite dramatically. Perhaps as tech levels increase, shaking decreases.

And sadly, I had a poster of the theoretical upper atmosphere of Jupiter from the Smithsonian. It too had some interesting gasbags and things floating around. Sadly because I no longer have it .

 

[maksimsmelchak]

Yeah. The wiki is nice but the sophont list is time consuming. I suppose a search might pull them up. Anyhow, I don't recall two, good to know.

I found three quickly using the search function:

1. Domination (Non-canon)
2. Jgd-ll-jagd
3. Sheol

The Inyx might also work...

Hope that helps.

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.

 

[aramis]

But are also vastly lighter and dont have unlimited power/fuel.

Essentially, the wind speed is irrelevant; a ship in a 400 kt smooth wind firing at another ship in that same 400 kt smooth wind are much like aircraft in the same. Yes, it seems that it should matter, but really, it doesn't unless the winds are different between firer and target.

And I tell you true - a DHC-2 Beaver towing a glider at 120 kt indicated airspeed handles EXACTLY the same in a 20 kt headwind as a 20 kt tailwind, as long as you only consider the relationship to the glider. The wind only becomes relevant when trying to coordinate versus items on the ground. (The 20 kt tailwind is almost impossible to take off with, but go the other direction, and that 1 mile of runway is suddenly 3x longer than needed instead of 1x vs still air. )

Shooting missiles in a gas giant is no different an issue. If both target and firer are in the same winds, the missile can safely be fired without considering the wind, for the wind will pretty much carry it along at the same speed as the ships.

 

[savage]

I found three quickly using the search function:

1. Domination (Non-canon)
2. Jgd-ll-jagd
3. Sheol

The Inyx might also work...

Hope that helps.

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.

Thanks I was thinking about Jgd-ii-jagdm in Lishun (since i have a Vland region focus). Had forgotten about Sheol, from GT I believe.

 

[GypsyComet]

Today's science news contained one of those periodic reminders that Traveller's generation systems may actually not be strange enough.

https://earthsky.org/space/oddball-hot-jupiter-has-wildly-eccentric-orbit

 

[aramis]

Today's science news contained one of those periodic reminders that Traveller's generation systems may actually not be strange enough.

https://earthsky.org/space/oddball-hot-jupiter-has-wildly-eccentric-orbit

It's not been strange enough since the first Brown Dwarf was discovered. (The Kuiper Belt can be, mechanically, just a post-neptunian {orbit #10} asteroid belt...)

In fact, I can only think of one stellar system generator stranger than reality... Spelljammer's. People like order in their systems...

 

[G. Kashkanun Anderson]

Today's science news contained one of those periodic reminders that Traveller's generation systems may actually not be strange enough.

https://earthsky.org/space/oddball-hot-jupiter-has-wildly-eccentric-orbit

It's actually entirely possible to generate this planet using the LBB Book 6 rules. The semi-major axis for HD 80606b is .453AU, or roughly Orbit 1. Eccentricity is applied by Referee fiat, so whilst .9336e is not mentioned explicitly, it is allowed by the ruleset. Of course, such a wide orbital sweep clears out anything else inward of Orbit 5, so there can't be any shirtsleeve planets in this system, but I think we all figured that out already.

Interestingly, the part that breaks Book 6 is the Far Orbit G5V binary companion (not mentioned in most of the articles, but it is there) to the G5V primary. As I've always interpreted the Book 6 rules for rolling up companion stars, it's effectively impossible to get a G-Type companion for a G-Type primary.

 

[aramis]

It's actually entirely possible to generate this planet using the LBB Book 6 rules. The semi-major axis for HD 80606b is .453AU, or roughly Orbit 1. Eccentricity is applied by Referee fiat, so whilst .9336e is not mentioned explicitly, it is allowed by the ruleset. Of course, such a wide orbital sweep clears out anything else inward of Orbit 5, so there can't be any shirtsleeve planets in this system, but I think we all figured that out already.

Interestingly, the part that breaks Book 6 is the Far Orbit G5V binary companion (not mentioned in most of the articles, but it is there) to the G5V primary. As I've always interpreted the Book 6 rules for rolling up companion stars, it's effectively impossible to get a G-Type companion for a G-Type primary.

There could be... but it would need to be inclined differently... much like how Pluto has very low interactivity with Neptune.

If the secondary body is in a resonant orbit as well, so that it's always further from the eccentric GG than from the primary...

Again, Pluto comes to mind.... it's usually further from neptune than from the sun when crossing the orbit of Neptune, IIRC. (something about the 3:2 resonance.)

 

[GypsyComet]

It's actually entirely possible to generate this planet using the LBB Book 6 rules.

The wild temperature swings and their implications are beyond any rules we have to date, IIRC, since gas giants are black boxes full of fuel for the most part.

This particular gas giant may well get physically larger during the close pass just due to the behavior of gasses, and don't count on anything but elemental hydrogen and helium in the atmosphere. Those temperatures are likely to crack anything else. If any gas giant was a candidate for a giant diamond in the core it would be this one, as any carbon caught in the early formation or during the outer sweep of each orbit is probably going to be cracked back to elemental form and fall into the interior. If you could survive the trip to whatever metallic hydrogen fluid surface this world may have, you might find some interesting compounds there, but the phase changing that layer goes through makes that depth even more deadly than usual.

You may not need to do much refining of the hydrogen you scoop from this lovely place, but watch your clock and calendar when scooping...