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IMTU: Aging in Traveller

Having read much of this thread, I agree with a great many points made.
My experience with Egyptology includes a significant list of Pharaohs who lived into their late 80's or 90s.

So, the proof is not that technology to a "certain level" doesn't change anything about the "biological endurance" of a given Human.
Those early tech levels simply "clear the path" for individuals to heal better, or better take advantage of the genetic package with which they were born.

IMO, on modern day Terra, we are starting to look into the modification of genes, which "Will" certainly make those changes the earlier tech levels didn't. And that begs the question, "How far 'can we' push out the the lifespan, or expectation of the same?" While it might sound like a good idea to push out those expectations without looking at the ultimate "limits of the material", you have to remember one thing.

No matter how good your process is, your steel will have limits beyond which it will fail.
The same comes into play with the ability of a cell to be replaced within a tissue. We already know the tissues of the body "renew" every seven years, on average. Because of that, I would "personally" consider the limit to be in the 150 to 180 year range. And, I would push out the aging rolls for those raised and living on high tech worlds to anywhere from "Rolls start at 80" or so.

For those not living on a world, it could be argued that every member of the Imperial Navy serving on a base or ship "can get" Tech level 15 treatment consistently. But we have to ask how uniformly that is possible? Imagine if you are serving in the United States Military in bases in the Washington DC area. A General or Admiral will be swept off to the same hospital they take the President of the United States to. A Private, or Airman, or average E-1? They'll go to sick call, then be given treatment in the on-base medical facility. On Minot AFB, that was a clinic. If you suffered something more seriously, they shipped you into the VA Hospital in town. (and no, I am not going to comment here on the things I saw in such a hospital).

And, if you think Minot is bad, consider Thule Air Base (now known as Pituffik Space Base) on Greenland. There are many medical procedures they can't perform there. And, if you want worse, try McMurdo Station down in Antarctica. Arguably, they have some of the most advance sciences on the planet being worked on down there. But, there are many many things they can't do there. Add to that, if you "MUST" have a procedure, you have to wait until they can fly you out to somewhere in the lower-tech but more capable world.

Of course, that falls into the "Once tech advances enough and we have fully robotic surgeries this won't matter" category
And, that's not even considering Androids capable of living in a "charging box" while waiting to deploy for a medical situation.

So, I could posit (and this is my own opinion) that an Imperial military member could likely get "consistent" treatment at tech level 10 "in general", with specific casess being escalated to the android. (Assuming this is not a mass casualty event. Where the androids treat the officers and key personnel while the individual spacers are "kept alive" by the corpsmen.

So, just slapping an "at this tech level" ignores the fact that what happens to world leaders in London, Paris, Tehran, etc can be vastly different than what happens to the average citizen in the same cities. And, those are widly different than even the most wealthy person on a cruise ship, or an adventure tourist or scientist deep in the field. I agree that GPS and mach-5 or suborbital space craft can change that paradigm significantly. But those won't be available everywhere, just as "cost-abusive" medical helicopter services available in much of the United States is not available in large sections of the US.....and will never happen in many countries around the world unless the patient is a national leader.
 
Having read much of this thread, I agree with a great many points made.
My experience with Egyptology includes a significant list of Pharaohs who lived into their late 80's or 90s.

So, the proof is not that technology to a "certain level" doesn't change anything about the "biological endurance" of a given Human.
Those early tech levels simply "clear the path" for individuals to heal better, or better take advantage of the genetic package with which they were born.

IMO, on modern day Terra, we are starting to look into the modification of genes, which "Will" certainly make those changes the earlier tech levels didn't. And that begs the question, "How far 'can we' push out the the lifespan, or expectation of the same?" While it might sound like a good idea to push out those expectations without looking at the ultimate "limits of the material", you have to remember one thing.

No matter how good your process is, your steel will have limits beyond which it will fail.
The same comes into play with the ability of a cell to be replaced within a tissue. We already know the tissues of the body "renew" every seven years, on average. Because of that, I would "personally" consider the limit to be in the 150 to 180 year range. And, I would push out the aging rolls for those raised and living on high tech worlds to anywhere from "Rolls start at 80" or so.

I think that is a good upper limit (and it was about the upper limit of the Vilani, who were long lived, living in an environment with biologically incompatible pathogens).

For those not living on a world, it could be argued that every member of the Imperial Navy serving on a base or ship "can get" Tech level 15 treatment consistently. But we have to ask how uniformly that is possible? Imagine if you are serving in the United States Military in bases in the Washington DC area. A General or Admiral will be swept off to the same hospital they take the President of the United States to. A Private, or Airman, or average E-1? They'll go to sick call, then be given treatment in the on-base medical facility. On Minot AFB, that was a clinic. If you suffered something more seriously, they shipped you into the VA Hospital in town. (and no, I am not going to comment here on the things I saw in such a hospital).

....
So, I could posit (and this is my own opinion) that an Imperial military member could likely get "consistent" treatment at tech level 10 "in general", with specific casess being escalated to the android. (Assuming this is not a mass casualty event. Where the androids treat the officers and key personnel while the individual spacers are "kept alive" by the corpsmen.

So, just slapping an "at this tech level" ignores the fact that what happens to world leaders in London, Paris, Tehran, etc can be vastly different than what happens to the average citizen in the same cities. And, those are widly different than even the most wealthy person on a cruise ship, or an adventure tourist or scientist deep in the field. I agree that GPS and mach-5 or suborbital space craft can change that paradigm significantly. But those won't be available everywhere, just as "cost-abusive" medical helicopter services available in much of the United States is not available in large sections of the US.....and will never happen in many countries around the world unless the patient is a national leader.

This is one of the reasons I posited SOC as a modifier above in my posts.
 
Speaking of Egyptology, you can also extend your life by substituting healthy organs for failing ones.
Absolutely agree.
And, that snaps in perfectly with my comments about rising tech levels.
Organ transplants do not change the long term longevity of the average citizen. They do prevent the "premature death" of an individual due to a faulty organ, or tissue/organ damage due to diseases like Cancer, which attack the DNA of cells in a class or tissue mass.

I especially liked @whulorigan's comments and the "Modifiers by Social Standing" chart proposed.
That supports the one caution I mentioned against assuming everyone gets that "top level" of care. I was, before enlisting in the military, a member of the volunteer EMS/First Aid squad my father also volunteered with. We got to see patients with the same medical challenges delivered to care facilities with widely varied capabilities as they were "pre-triaged" based on their financial capabilities.

The most interesting thing about ancient Egyptian technology is that we have evidence of what we consider extremely advanced medical procedures as far back as 4,000 years ago. This includes evidence of brain surgeries. These are supported by evidence of bone healing in the skulls recovered from certain mummies. Discussion is still on-going regarding questions of prosthetics use during the periods of the various Kingdoms(Old, Middle and New).
The debate there refers to:
1) The prosthetics were actively used
2) The prosthetics were placed so that the mummy would have use of their renewed limb in the afterlife.
 
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