Which Edition? Differences between CT and Mongoose

[Baron]

I'm a confirmed fan of Classic Traveller, and I really dislike learning new systems. I may have a chance to join a live game, but it looks like the system they'll use will be Mongoose. Can anyone describe or point me to a comparison of my beloved CT with (I guess) the latest edition of the Mongoose version? How much is truly different? Thanks.

 

[Brandon C]

I'm a confirmed fan of Classic Traveller, and I really dislike learning new systems. I may have a chance to join a live game, but it looks like the system they'll use will be Mongoose. Can anyone describe or point me to a comparison of my beloved CT with (I guess) the latest edition of the Mongoose version? How much is truly different? Thanks.

You are showing up one edition too late

I think you would have liked 1e since it mostly builds on the CT framework.

2e, OTOH, takes some radical departure from CT.

 

[Spinward Scout]

The skill use in MgT2 is similar with 8+ being an Average roll. But it's missing some CT skills and several skills are handled different in MgT2. I can't comment on the weapon damage - it's been so long since I looked at CT damage charts. Other than that, UPP is the same (except they call it Intellect instead of Intelligence). UWPs are the same. I'm told you can port over the CT adventures pretty easy.

It's still a 2d6 system. Some of the feel is a little more MegaTraveller, tho. To me, anyway.

 

[Fovean]

Character generation stands out as the career path provides a specific backstory event every term, as well as pre-career education offerings for all characters. If you miss a Survival roll you have a bad event, get injured and possibly discharged/fired but not killed. If you know LBB4+ char gen it will feel familiar.

Specific NPCs are tied to your backstory career via events and manifest as contacts, rivals, allies and enemies.

Ending up with a ship is a little different but the mortgage rules are essentially the same. You can also end up with medical debt due to an event in the service. But there’s also more and varied material mustering benefits and gadgets for the characters, including implants like subdermal armor and wafer jacks.

I love Mongoose, and 2e is better than 1e IMO. It’s not perfect but once you start playing it will feel very natural to you as it is modeled closely on CT. And material, (N)PCs, ships, deckplans, all translate very easily. Lots of great OTU support material if you like.

 

[Baron]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

 

[robject]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

Probably it's the difference between a gaming group that meets regularly versus no group and no meetings. Or a gaming group of 20-somethings versus a gaming group of 50-somethings.

Seriously, though, it may depend on your perspective. I suspect that a younger crowd, as well as people who come from a non-Traveller background, will find Mongoose more accessible. There's nicer graphics, glossier books, maybe even more narrative and, dare I say it, safer. There's fewer skills, in line with modern RPGs that appear to deemphasize skills a bit in favor of other doodads that apparently flesh out your character. Again, feels a bit more narrative than CT.

All that is subjective, however. The rules are traditional RPG, and feel kind of like MegaTraveller as an earlier poster mentioned.

I think Mongoose has added some good content, but in general I prefer CT. Actually I prefer T5 with other modules thrown in for setting info, including CT and MgT, but meh.

 

[Baron]

Thanks for the reply. My thought would be that the latest and prettiest book usually wins, even though I find that deplorable. Funny, I'd be happy to try T5 or its systems tacked onto CT. And yeah, I literally threw MegaTraveller away, so that's not a selling point! ;-) If I have to, I'll go with this Mongoose game because it's been decades since I got to be a player in a face-to-face Traveller game, but I'm afraid that if I do, I'll give up after a few sessions. <sigh> But I really appreciate the feedback, thanks.

 

[kilemall]

You can get your feet wet for cheap by downloading Cepheus Engine, based on the open source components of MgT1E. Should get you a feel for it without investing $50+.

 

[Baron]

Yep, have that on on the hard drive, good point.

 

[mike wightman]

At the actual gaming table these are the things you will notice:

MgT characters have a better backstory from their character generation - but who generates characters every session? CT is faster and leaves a lot of the characterisation to the player and ref.

MgT characters will have more skills and those skills are not as broad as CT in some instances.

Event resolution - ref makes up a target number based on perceived difficulty and player rolls 2d. Usual target number is 8+, stats, skills, tools, environmental DMs can apply. If you can referee CT then you can referee MgT
MgT has one departure to task rolls and that is the boon/bane die mechanic.

Armour acts as damage reduction in MgT.

 

[rhialto]

Cepheus Engine is closer to MgT 1e, not the latest (2e). I wouldn't bother buying 2e until you've tried it. I like some of the ideas from MgT 1e (e.g., multiple careers, more advanced tech than the '70's & '80's), and played it for a while. I then participated in the 2e playtest, and bailed after seeing where it was headed. But you should recognize the CT roots it has.

 

[Quint]

I'd agree with looking at CE a try. It's what I'm using at the moment, you're also able to buy an document that you can edit to your hearts content (and add careers, equipment, etc.)


You could certainly incorporate elements of MgT 1E (term events) if you like, it's easy enough to do so.

 

[ffilz]

Thanks for the reply. My thought would be that the latest and prettiest book usually wins, even though I find that deplorable. Funny, I'd be happy to try T5 or its systems tacked onto CT. And yeah, I literally threw MegaTraveller away, so that's not a selling point! ;-) If I have to, I'll go with this Mongoose game because it's been decades since I got to be a player in a face-to-face Traveller game, but I'm afraid that if I do, I'll give up after a few sessions. <sigh> But I really appreciate the feedback, thanks.

As a player, your experience with MgT2 will depend on what it is that made you like Classic Traveller.

I'm a die hard CT (1977 Books 1-3, plus carefully chosen other bits) GM, but I've played in a MgT (I forget if the games I actually played were 1 or 2) game and enjoyed it just fine.

As noted, each version of Traveller has a different skill set, with all versions after CT Book 1 having a wider range of skills (many narrower, others like gun combat may be wider) and a philosophy change towards the skills on the character sheet defining what the character can do rather than what the character is particularly good at. Arguments can probably be had about this philosophy change... The newer games may also encourage other GM style differences that may get to you, but the same GM might do the same thing with CT also...

So my suggestion, try the game with an open mind. If you click with the way the GM runs the game, the specific version of Traveller being played shouldn't matter much. In other words, you're far more likely to not like the game because of the GM than which rule books are on the table...

Frank

 

[Baron]

In other words, you're far more likely to not like the game because of the GM than which rule books are on the table...

Frank

Frank, you win the internet today. Wise words.

 

[aramis]

CE and MGT 2 go in very different directions; both have their merits... and their flaws.

Since CE can be examined for free, it edges out ahead IMO.

 

[GypsyComet]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

Remember, a lot of Traveller is modular. If there is a piece of CT that you find incomplete or frustrating, look at how other editions, including Mongoose v1 or CE, handle that piece.

If I were dead set on CT as my core but was open to finding solutions elsewhere for a few nagging problems, I would look at Mongoose v1, CE, or TNE for the Ship Shares and Old Ships bits, and at the Career Events, career chaining, and medical debt portions of Mongoose V1 (most of which are developments of ideas in TNE). I would also evaluate the Patron systems in every edition, and the NPC Broker handling in Mongoose.

 

[estar]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

To me 1st edition MgT felt like a cleaned up and reorganized CT. Like what I was hoping MegaTraveller would have been. Although these days I like the Cepheus Engine better as it is more terse and to the point.

 

[aramis]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

fundamentally, MGT 1E:

It's got a clear unified resolution mechanic. CT does not.
It's got a more interesting character generation, in that it provides more information with only a tiny bit more effort.
Uses armor as damage reduction instead of deflection.
Has ship armor.
You can easily use CT Bk2 ship designs and plans and be within 10%. Bridge tonnage for small ships halved, and for big ones, capped at 30 Td.

It's a more consistent to itself set of mechanics, albeit a bit less modular because of that.

 

[Brandon C]

It's worth noting that 1e also had several games using the core rules, such as 2300 AD and Babylon 5 (and the too-short Cowboys and Xenomporphs). Unfortunately all are out of print now, but you can still find some around.

 

[rhialto]

OK, I can't resist asking this. Really not trolling, just frustrated. What's the point of switching? What morefun does MgT provide, in and of itself, that CT is lacking? Maybe the potential GM and I can thrash it out and settle on one or the other.

The degree of "morefun" will vary: I played MgT 1e for a few years, but found I preferred CT's more nebulous/ambiguous/flexible rules, supplemented with some of the ideas from MgT 1e. But I am one of those that prefers to start with a small, simple core (CT) and add to, rather than a more complicated core (MgT) and subtract. Just a couple of examples:

• Chargen: I like multiple careers in MgT, don't like the events every term (I'd rather the player fill in the gaps); I've added multiple careers to my CT game
• Combat: don't like the MgT system at all (dynamic initiative, armor as subtracting static damage), but the two stats at 0 = Unconscious instead of CT's one stat at 0 = Unconscious is a useful CT houserule for tougher PCs

I think your best bet is to look at CE for some of the same inspirations borrowed from MgT 1e, in addition to just trying MgT 2e. Only you can answer the morefun with a real value, rather than conjecture.