Folding Stocks DMs
- Thread starter infojunky
- Start date
creativehum
SOC-14 1K
I had always assumed the weapons can't be used when the stocks are folded. They would have to be removed, right?
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
Just the opposite, it's when the stock is extended and in use, it's not as stable and firm as a full stock hence the DM.
The folding stock is to help conceal or carry a rifle where being able to hide or stow the weapon matters. I would assume it would be VERY unstable to use with the stock folded.
The folding stock is to help conceal or carry a rifle where being able to hide or stow the weapon matters. I would assume it would be VERY unstable to use with the stock folded.
Shadow Shack
SOC-12
It depends on the folding stock, I've fired shotguns with folding stocks that felt as solid as a standard butt stock and I've fired .22 rifles with flimsy plastic folding stocks that rattled before you even pulled the trigger.
Either way, a rifle-sized firearm without a stock loses significant accuracy when you fire it in pistol-mode...with the upside being it is much more maneuverable in tight quarters than it would be with a stock (fixed/extended or otherwise).
Either way, a rifle-sized firearm without a stock loses significant accuracy when you fire it in pistol-mode...with the upside being it is much more maneuverable in tight quarters than it would be with a stock (fixed/extended or otherwise).
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
The CONSOLIDATED CT ERRATA, v0.05 (11/15/10) says:
CHARACTERS AND COMBAT (Book 1, 1981 edition):
Page 41, Folding Stocks (omission): When a folding stock is folded, the weapon is less accurate (DM –1 at all ranges). When the stock is extended, there is no effect.
CHARACTERS AND COMBAT (Book 1, 1981 edition):
Page 41, Folding Stocks (omission): When a folding stock is folded, the weapon is less accurate (DM –1 at all ranges). When the stock is extended, there is no effect.
creativehum
SOC-14 1K
Huh.
Well, for me, this is the most intuitive effect.
Without the folding stock extended, you're using the rifle as big, two handed pistol which, while flashy in movies, is simply not as stable as using the stock as intended.
Now, folks can quibble about stock quality and what not, but that's honestly beyond the scope of the game. If a gun is WORSE with the stock extended, why even have it?
Also, there's a difference between a "folding" stock, and an "adjustable" stock.
Moder ARs have adjustable stocks so the user can get a better fit when firing the rifle, notable to adjust for things such as battle armor. But that's different from a folding stock in that most adjustable stocks, once adjusted, are pretty much kept that way.
Folding stocks are used to reduce overall length, notably for storage, but also for concealment.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I apply the folding stock DMs on the combat matrix to a rifle/carbine/smg fitted with a folding stock that is extended.
Thus a folding stock weapon is less accurate at range than a weapon with a fixed stock.
Leaving the stock folded results in the additional blanket -1DM (note that the combat matrix doesn't include it at close/short range).
Thus a folding stock weapon is less accurate at range than a weapon with a fixed stock.
Leaving the stock folded results in the additional blanket -1DM (note that the combat matrix doesn't include it at close/short range).
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
In my very limited experience a folded stock is handier at very short range, so should get an advantageous DM at least at Close range and perhaps at Short range. On the other hand a folded stock should give a large negative DM at longer ranges.
When the stock is extended I would not give any DM.
When the stock is extended I would not give any DM.
creativehum
SOC-14 1K
Per a note on the weapon table from 1977:
"When a folding stock is installed on a weapon, and is folded, also use the DM shown."
So, per 1977, when unfolded, no DMs. When folded, no DMs at Close or Short. But DM -1 for Medium, Long, and Very Long.
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
My reading of that footnote is the stock is folded to the 'in use' position.
Hence my ruling mentioned earlier.
Hence my ruling mentioned earlier.
Shadow Shack
SOC-12
I read it as a cumulative modifier, that is when folded it gives an additional -1 medium/long/very long range modifier on top of whatever the modifiers are on the weapon itself...when extended it uses the base weapon modifier.
That is how I was reading it.
Timerover51
SOC-14 5K
How does a folding stock effect “reliability”? Accuracy at longer ranges most definitely if folded, but making the weapon less reliable?
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
It's a moving part with springs, clips, locks etc - plenty of stuff that can brake that can't on a fixed stock.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
What's the stock for?
To stabilize the weapon platform which suffers from varying degrees of recoil.
If you're strong and/or large enough, it might not matter if it's folded.
To stabilize the weapon platform which suffers from varying degrees of recoil.
If you're strong and/or large enough, it might not matter if it's folded.
No, stocks are design to stabilize the weapon, regardless of recoil.
A .22 rifle (which has almost zero recoil) will be more accurate than a .22 pistol when mounted by soft, gushy human beings.
Sly Stallone and Arnie would have difficulty stabilizing a pistol as well as they can a rifle. We're not Ransom Rests.
It's basic geometry and simple static structural analysis.
