Hey, guys. New to Traveller. Looks like my kinda thing.

[aramis]

I completely disagree. I started the game with Starter Traveller, and I played for a couple of years with just that before I added any other Traveller supplements or adventures.

The Traveller Book is really all one needs, besides additional adventures, if you don't want to make your own scenarios.

Plus, it's easy and a very complete rule set.

Simple to play. Easy to learn. Complete. I think the Traveller book is probably the best place to start.

TTB has the issue of not having non-military careers besides merchant (which is paramilitary as presented) and mobster (which is the best fit for the "other" career's skillset and risks), and not having a suitable range of military weaponry.

Otherwise, I agree, it's a great starting point.

The needed "completion" books are

• Nonmilitary careers: either of
  • Supplement 4: Citizens of the Imperium
  • Module 3: Spinward Marches Campaign.
• One of the military hardware inclusions:
  • Book 4: Mercenary
  • Snapshot
  • Azhanti High Lightning
  • Striker

Noting the caveat that Striker/AHL replace the combat rules entirely.

 

[flykiller]

DnD is a good way to get into the role playing mindset

well, not a roleplaying mindset, rather a gaming mindset. dnd involves character power development - leveling up, gaining more powers, growing more heroic. this process provides a framework and motivation - the primary framework and motivation - to the game. traveller simply doesn't have this. traveller is about role-playing, the characters do not gain levels or powers but merely interact with the game setting. when people who have played the leveling-up games try to play traveller they are very much taken back at the thought that their characters are semi-fixed, and are a bit puzzled as to how they are to proceed. "well then what are we doing?" is the usual response. the answer "whatever you want" either attracts them (some) or demotivates them (most).

if you're interested in gaming I suggest you ignore dnd and start with traveller. if ever you then play dnd you'll be more of a role-player than a gamer.

 

[whulorigan]

... and mobster (which is the best fit for the "other" career's skillset and risks) ...

I always felt that "Other" could also include ex-government or corporate clandestine operatives/agents as an alternative to outright "ex-criminal".

 

[ffilz]

• Nonmilitary careers: either of
  • Supplement 4: Citizens of the Imperium
  • Module 3: Spinward Marches Campaign.

Noting the caveat that Striker/AHL replace the combat rules entirely.

Are there printings of the Spinward Marches Campaign that actually have the correct tables for the Citizens careers? The scans on the CD-ROM have the skill tables duplicated from the Book 1 careers, which really don't fit the Citizens careers properly...

Frank

 

[welsh]

The Traveller Book is really all one needs, besides additional adventures, if you don't want to make your own scenarios.

I agree. I don't see the "Other" career or the lack of miltary weapons as crippling.

 

[Condottiere]

Gun runner or arms dealer.

 

[creativehum]

I agree. I don't see the "Other" career or the lack of miltary weapons as crippling.

Same here.

And, along with a few others here, I have always seen the "Other" category as being open to a great latitude of interpretation. As the text states: "The exact nature of the career of any specific character in the Other field must be deduced from the skills and benefits received during character generation."

Mobster, gun runner, con man, government agent, thief (two-story or data thief), assassin, and so on.

I'm also somewhat confused about the claim "Other" category doesn't have a "suitable range of military weaponry." I might be misunderstanding the point, but an Other has the same chance as a Scout or Merchant to get a Gun Combat skill.

When adds in the fact that PCs all have default weapon skills of 0, it means the Other PC will suffer no -DMs for handling any weapon, but might lack the +DM from expertise with a particular class of weapons. (But, again, he has the same odds as a Scout or Merchant to end up with expertise with a particular class of firearm.)

 

[whulorigan]

I'm also somewhat confused about the claim "Other" category doesn't have a "suitable range of military weaponry." I might be misunderstanding the point . . .

I think Aramis was making the point up-thread: "a lack of a suitable range of military weaponry" not as a reference to the "Other" Career, but rather as a reference to not having the Ironmongery Section of Book 4 in LBB1-3. LBB1-3 has only mid-tech small-arms and Laser Carbine/Rifle.

 

[creativehum]

I think Aramis was making the point up-thread: "a lack of a suitable range of military weaponry" not as a reference to the "Other" Career, but rather as a reference to not having the Ironmongery Section of Book 4 in LBB1-3. LBB1-3 has only mid-tech small-arms and Laser Carbine/Rifle.

And thus, I was confused. (I see it now. Thanks for clarifying.)

As for that concern, now that I understand it, I don't see that as an issue either.

I mean, it is if you want a Traveller campaign focused on military operations it is. But for the kinds of fiction the original books wanted to emulate, the listed of weapons and gear is fine.

 

[welsh]

The original intent was that you could use existing weapons as a jumping-off point to make your own, too -- a point made several times in JTAS, IIRC. The risk of this is that you can easily create weapons that utterly imbalance combat.

(For the OP: JTAS = Journal of the Traveller's Aid Society, a quarterly (?) magazine that ran for years and is full of ideas.)

 

[aramis]

And thus, I was confused. (I see it now. Thanks for clarifying.)

As for that concern, now that I understand it, I don't see that as an issue either.

I mean, it is if you want a Traveller campaign focused on military operations it is. But for the kinds of fiction the original books wanted to emulate, the listed of weapons and gear is fine.

Star Wars wasn't, but Starship Troopers was in Marc's phronema when CT was written. It doesn't do ST all that well without the Bk 4 weapons. I mean, yeah, Battle Dress is pretty much straight out of Starship Troopers. Marc does note that Star Wars was a good fit...

Similarly, Falkenberg's Legion was, too. Both ST and FL are heavy on the military theme... almost to the point of gun-⌧.

So also the Fuzzy Series and Lensman series by Doc Smith. And the Foundation series by Asimov. And a few dozen others, several of which are military sci-fi, and for which the Bk1 weapons are insufficient. At least, the obviously missing Snub Pistol and grenades.

 

[Reynard]

Just to jump in all opinionated, I'd recommend Mongoose Traveller 2e because.

1) Helps to support the people putting out the game at the moment.
2) It's the edition that new material will be featured.
3)Along with the core rules, Mongoose has been publishing a lot of pre-made adventures which can be important for start up games to make life easer for the beginning referee.

The core book has plenty to get everyone up and playing from ships to equipment to character creation. World building is there if you need to make a universe while the book also features a staring campaign and map of the worlds which many of the adventures you can add are part of. If you need more, you can always pick up the High Guard and Central Supply at your leisure with more supplements to follow.

 

[Ullarsskald1957]

well, not a roleplaying mindset, rather a gaming mindset. (respectful snip)

if you're interested in gaming I suggest you ignore dnd and start with traveller. if ever you then play dnd you'll be more of a role-player than a gamer.

Good distinction, had not thought of it that way. Thank you.

 

[Supplement Four]

I agree. I don't see the "Other" career or the lack of miltary weapons as crippling.

Yep. And an action point combat system (Snapshot or AHL) is definitely not needed.

I'd also wait on Book 4 until I was more familiar with Traveller. Those powerful weapons are not needed. And, I think Advanced Character generation should be held off until a Ref is familiar with Basic Chargen and has run an adventure or two.

 

[creativehum]

when people who have played the leveling-up games try to play traveller they are very much taken back at the thought that their characters are semi-fixed, and are a bit puzzled as to how they are to proceed. "well then what are we doing?" is the usual response. the answer "whatever you want" either attracts them (some) or demotivates them (most).

This is an important point for whichever edition one chooses. "Whatever you want" can be especially crippling if the Players a) have little idea of what the setting is like; b) have little idea of what options are before them.

I've read about many Traveller games that get set up but never continue after character creation, and in many cases it is because the Players have no idea what the could be doing, let alone know that they should be choosing what they are doing.

I think a solid talk before -- either before or after making characters -- is vital when creating characters in Traveller about goals. As flykiller rightly points out, it's about interacting with the environment, but without some sort of agenda it might well fizzle. D&D provides the agenda through the aquistion of XP.

But as the last page of Book 3 (1981) states:

The players themselves have a burden almost equal to that of the referee: they must move, act, travel in search of their own goals. The typical methods used in life by 20th century Terrans (thrift, dedication, and hard work) do not work in Traveller; instead, travellers must boldly plan and execute daring schemes for the acquisition of wealth and power.

"In search of their own goals" is, I think, vital for the open-ended, sandbox style play that I think Traveller was designed to handle. But, again, if the Players don't know much about the setting or what they can pursue, all that will be lost.

Having a discussion a bout this issue means everyone can get on the same page about this matter. What do the characters want? Why are they risking their lives traveling the stars? Are they out to build a fortune? Take vengeance on someone? Build a trade empire? Topple a government?

All sorts of adventures can feed into any of those goals (and more) -- either through the money gained in doing high risk/high reward jobs that will provide resources for moving forward. Or each adventure can be steps along up the rungs of the ladder toward the main goal.

But if the Players know what they are trying to reach -- especially if they have chosen it -- they will own those goals and be committed to them much than if the Referee tries to snag them with "hooks."

Moreover, if the Players and Referee have a talk about the goals the Players want to pursue with their PCs, the Referee can then, within the setting he has created, select the opportunities and obstacles for the PCs that both feed the Player's goals but also excite him as things about the setting he wants to share.

 

[creativehum]

The original intent was that you could use existing weapons as a jumping-off point to make your own, too -- a point made several times in JTAS, IIRC. The risk of this is that you can easily create weapons that utterly imbalance combat.

(For the OP: JTAS = Journal of the Traveller's Aid Society, a quarterly (?) magazine that ran for years and is full of ideas.)

Agreed. And you didn't need to read JTAS to see this.

If you look at how Animals are built, one can simply build more weapons and armor by analogy adding modifiers to existing weapons and armor.

As the Final Word on the last page of Book 3 (1981) notes:

Traveller is necessarily a framework describing the barest of essentials for an infinite universe; obviously rules which could cover every aspect of every possible action would be far larger than these three booklets.

I wouldn't want a game that included everything. It would impose too much on what the game was supposed to be. I like the idea that there's enough there to get going and I can modify (easily) with the tools in books.

 

[rhialto]

This is an important point for whichever edition one chooses. "Whatever you want" can be especially crippling if the Players a) have little idea of what the setting is like; b) have little idea of what options are before them.

"In search of their own goals" is, I think, vital for the open-ended, sandbox style play that I think Traveller was designed to handle. But, again, if the Players don't know much about the setting or what they can pursue, all that will be lost.

Having a discussion a bout this issue means everyone can get on the same page about this matter. What do the characters want? Why are they risking their lives traveling the stars? Are they out to build a fortune? Take vengeance on someone? Build a trade empire? Topple a government?

All sorts of adventures can feed into any of those goals (and more) -- either through the money gained in doing high risk/high reward jobs that will provide resources for moving forward. Or each adventure can be steps along up the rungs of the ladder toward the main goal.

But if the Players know what they are trying to reach -- especially if they have chosen it -- they will own those goals and be committed to them much than if the Referee tries to snag them with "hooks."

Moreover, if the Players and Referee have a talk about the goals the Players want to pursue with their PCs, the Referee can then, within the setting he has created, select the opportunities and obstacles for the PCs that both feed the Player's goals but also excite him as things about the setting he wants to share.

This is where I plan to introduce the "shared sandbox" idea from Beyond the Wall's Further Afield: the Ref and the Players jointly create the sandbox (sub-sector in my case), with the Player's choosing to describe what characteristics a location (system/mainworld) has, and the Ref secretly rolling to see how accurate it is. And by "characteristics" I mean things like the tags from Stars Without Number, which can be layered on top of the UWPs.

 

[flykiller]

it's about interacting with the environment, but without some sort of agenda it might well fizzle.

in my present game I split the difference between "tasking" and "free-form". in return for operational rights to a good ship the characters have an assignment from a noble, but it's very open-ended. "build up trade between this world and imperial worlds". how they go about it is their business. this allows roving contact with many settings, while organizing their activities and giving them a fall-back response if they don't know what to do. I explain traveller as they go - this has worked out well, not least because they find holes in my preparations and conceptions and I can be flexible as things develop.

I think a solid talk before -- either before or after making characters -- is vital when creating characters in Traveller about goals.

along with

1) you can die.
2) there are no levels.

 

[creativehum]

along with

1) you can die.
2) there are no levels.

Absolutely.
When I started my current B/X D&D game I sent out an email making many implicit details of the game and my play style very clear.

The fact that PCs can die was on the list, along with other matters (I would never have "a story", they were free to pursue any goals they wanted, and so on.)

I think there are two points here:

1. Things will go well if the Referee is upfront and clear with the Players about the expectations and parameters of play
2. But that can't happen until the Referee sits down and thinks about what he wants to bring to the table. This is the Referee really deciding, purposefully, what he wants the experience to be, what he wants to bring to the table. Not in terms of "story" (though some Referees will want to bring exactly that), but the overall agenda that sets the expectations and boundaries that exist not only for the Players for the Referee himself.

 

[Celestial]

Just to jump in all opinionated, I'd recommend Mongoose Traveller 2e because.

1) Helps to support the people putting out the game at the moment.
2) It's the edition that new material will be featured.
3)Along with the core rules, Mongoose has been publishing a lot of pre-made adventures which can be important for start up games to make life easer for the beginning referee.

The core book has plenty to get everyone up and playing from ships to equipment to character creation. World building is there if you need to make a universe while the book also features a staring campaign and map of the worlds which many of the adventures you can add are part of. If you need more, you can always pick up the High Guard and Central Supply at your leisure with more supplements to follow.

I second this. If you're trying to get new players for Traveller, the best method IMO is to go with the current and easy available in print version: Mongoose Traveller Second Edition. All you really need is the core rulebook, although High Guard and Central Supply Catalog are very handy, as is the Referee Screen. And if you and/or the players prefer a more "modern" transhuman setting, the Mindjammer rulebook for Mongoose Traveller Second Edition is quite good.