General How do you determine Collateral damage in a fight?

[Spinward Scout]

Say you're a Referee running a fight on a city street. One of the Bad Guys shoots and misses.​

Where does the bullet, needle, or laser go?

Are there rules for this?

How do you determine collateral damage?

How about glancing shots?

Even worse, what about blow-through from a Plasma or Fusion weapon?

 

[Spinward Scout]

Here's what I've come up with so far for MgT2.

Stray Shots
Determining Collateral Damage in a fight
Using Mongoose 2022 Update rules, Effect Results could determine collateral damage if a shot misses.

0
- Glancing Shot
Marginal Success: There's a chance that the shot hits something else after hitting the target. Damage to the Target could be minimal. Something gets hit behind the Target on a 2 on a 2d6 roll. 1 in 36 chance.

-1
- Near Miss
Marginal Failure: The shot misses, but barely. The target might hear the bullet whistle past or there's a sizzling sound in the air. Their hair could be blown round a little. Unless there's a blatant wall or hill behind the target, which would definitely be hit, something significant behind the target gets hit on a 2 or 12 on a 2d6 roll. 2 in 36 chance.

-2 to -5
- Complete Miss
Average Failure: The shot definitely misses. Unless there's a blatant wall or hill behind the target, which would definitely be hit, something significant behind the target gets hit on a 2, 3, 4, 10, 11, or 12 on a 2d6 roll. 12 in 36 chance.

-6 or less
- Wild Shot
Exceptional Failure: The shot goes wild. It might even ricochet off of one thing and hit another thing. Unless there's a blatant wall or hill behind the target, which would definitely be hit, something significant behind the target gets hit on a 2, 3, 4, 5 or 6 on a 2d6 roll and there's a ricochet to something else that gets hit. A 15 in 36 chance. On a 9, 10, 11, or 12 on a 2d6 roll, something significant behind the target gets hit. A 10 in 36 chance.

 

[Condottiere]

Determine (in)accuracy factor of specific weapon.

Fire at barn door.

 

[kilemall]

Situational. If it’s in a forest depending on density some trees get hit and splinter or are cut down depending on caliber. Maybe fires start. Animals flee for the most part.

Urban, I’d be looking at vehicle and wall pen, density of population and surprise at fire. Surprise wears off, sophonts run.

It really matters when firing hull breaching weapons on starships/stations or worse terrestrial/nautical vehicles.

 

[Ulsyus]

Good question!!

What would missing do to drive the adventure on? The main effort as a ref is to deliver the adventure for the players to take part in. My practice has been to ensure the narrative focuses on that, and that collateral damage is noticed to have occurred if it's expositional to the plot. Otherwise it's just more friction and detail for me to have to focus on.

 

[whartung]

Where does the bullet, needle, or laser go?

Up to the Ref.

If it's a story point, shatters the window of the nearby cafe, and bounces off a few of the diners, including the Mayors sister.

If not, it doesn't do anything of consequence.

 

[Spinward Scout]

I'm not saying it has to be significant to the story. But it can add to the storytelling:

1. You hear a cat screech
2. Glass breaking
3. the Wilhelm Scream behind you
4. Ricochet sound for the Wild Shot

And so on...

 

[Grav_Moped]

I'm not saying it has to be significant to the story. But it can add to the storytelling:

1. You hear a cat screech
2. Glass breaking
3. the Wilhelm Scream behind you
4. Ricochet sound for the Wild Shot

And so on...

Example from Boughene Station Blues from back in February (Post 275):

Context:
Police respond to a dine-and-dash at a diner (who was tailing the PC), followed by that PC getting "SWATted" by a second (unrelated) perpetrator with a flash-bang grenade trying to get the responding cops to shoot at the PC.
The "riot-control teacup" (hot tea and hot sauce) was originally intended for the dine-and-dash guy, but still proves useful.

 

[Spinward Scout]

You have an Interstellar House Of Pancakes (IHOP) in your PbP?!? That's awesome!

You could make a humorous table and a Not-so-funny table of what the missed shot does.

 

[Grav_Moped]

You have an Interstellar House Of Pancakes (IHOP) in your PbP?!? That's awesome!

You could make a humorous table and a Not-so-funny table of what the missed shot does.

It was either that or "Waffle Hab-Module"...

The initial handling of the dine-and-dash was thematically inspired by a viral video of a brawl in a Waffle House. As I noted in the OOC thread (#1167, the roll is to determine surprise/initiative)

Waitress (+3 for Steward-3*):

*Catching an apparent dine-and-dash is absolutely a valid application of Steward. Change my mind.

And yes, "funny"/"serious" really do merit different tables, or at least creative interpretation of the "serious" one to get funny results. Examples can be found in comedic Westerns or action-movie parodies. (Bystander takes hit to belt buckle, which absorbs all damage but disintegrates, pants fall, exposing boxer shorts with embarrassing print pattern. That sort of thing. The "serious" version is bystander takes minor wound, goes down screaming.)

I had a specific local restaurant in mind when writing up that scene, so I knew where the missed shots would go generally (and then picked amusing targets from what the real-world example presented).

 

[Spinward Scout]

I think Waffle Hab-Module should go on a moon or asteroid somewhere.

All the belters go there after the bars shut down for the rest period.

 

[whartung]

I'm not saying it has to be significant to the story. But it can add to the storytelling:

But that's the thing, if that's the goal, the Ref need simply embellish the dialog. There's nothing to determine.

Take a classic cowboy fight in a saloon. Chairs busted over heads, bottles of liquor and a bar mirror smashed, people thrown through the front windows. If that's what the ref wants, they just start talking. Nothing to determine, just shout it out heat of the moment.

 

[Spinward Scout]

But that's the thing, if that's the goal, the Ref need simply embellish the dialog. There's nothing to determine.

Take a classic cowboy fight in a saloon. Chairs busted over heads, bottles of liquor and a bar mirror smashed, people thrown through the front windows. If that's what the ref wants, they just start talking. Nothing to determine, just shout it out heat of the moment.

I said it doesn't have to be significant. It could be significant, tho. It could be either.

This could be the:

Outdoors Not-so-funny table

1. Other Party Member (must be behind the Target)
2. Innocent Bystander
3. Emergency Services or City Personnel
4. Vehicle or Public Transport
5. Building or Street Fixtures or Accoutrements
6. Pet or other Animal

An Indoor table would be a lot harder to come up with.

But I gave it a shot:

Indoors Not-so-funny table

1. Chair, Bench, Stool, Bed, or Couch
2. Table, Cupboard, Closet, or Bar
3. Piano, Jukebox, Hologram, or other Music or Communications related item
4. Television, Video game, VR set, Darts, or other Entertainment related item
5. Other Party Member or Innocent Bystander
6. Food or Drink Equipment

 

[mike wightman]

Whenever the players roll dice to resolve a situation I roll 2d in secret.

2-major complication/threat/despair (bane for next resolution)

3-4 some sort of disadvantage/threat

5-9 no additional complications

10-11 some sort of advantage

12 big advantage/triumph (boon for next resolution)

 

[whartung]

Honestly, if you want to have a table to randomly populate an area with stuff, that's all well and good. But it seems to me that it's straightforward for the ref to improvise and "break things at their leisure", having situational awareness of the area.

So, by this I mean they could roll dice or whatever when setting up the bar to PUT a piano or jukebox in to it, but when Things Happen, it should be readily apparent if some blow is destined for the jukebox without have to roll for it. Whether the jukebox starts playing "Night Fever" after someones head is inserted into it, that's a different issue.

 

[Daidoji Dave]

I sometimes remember to use the rules on a minor condition on success with Effect 0 (exactly meeting target number), and turning a miss by 1 into a success with a major condition or drawback. I might also let snake eyes jog my memory for significant collateral damage, but sometimes I just wing it off the scenery and the weapon.

I don't have standardized rules though.