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Imperial stargates

I can see a few serious problems in allowing jump gates.

1) It, sooner or later, would destroy the setting. No more communication at the speed of "old" jump (J1-J6)

I mostly agree with you in this, but let me comment some of your points:

2) How long before a government eliminates jump drives in private ships?

This will depend on the gates efficiency. If they are too expensive, most trade (mainly the one with non perisheable products) will be too unproffitable if using them, while jump ships will still be able to take it.

How long for the planes to take the ships off transport busines :devil:?

F) Skipping just isn't an option

I asume that's just for gate-using ships. And then the power (and so fuel) needs are so reduced that this might not be a problem.

H) Gate using Navies are pretty much unbeatable

On the defense (using them for the equivalent to interior lines) this might be true, but on offensive, as you don't have gates at the end point, they sill not change anything. And be sure they will be prime targets once an hostile fleet arrives...

In this view, I see the hoop drives (for what I've read about them, I have not read T5) more setting destroyers than those very limited gates :CoW:
 
...On the defense (using them for the equivalent to interior lines) this might be true, but on offensive, as you don't have gates at the end point, they sill not change anything. And be sure they will be prime targets once an hostile fleet arrives...

In this instance, it's useful to examine the specific strategic picture.

The Imperium's depots - the best place for a military gate - are very well defended and set back a ways from the usual fronts. Presence of a gate would make them impossibly well-defended: opposing fleet jump in, and the entire strength of your empire pops in a few turns later while the local defenders struggle to hold the attackers at bay. Add to that the fact that the opposing fleet has a number of star systems to get through before it gets to Depot, and it becomes pretty much impossible for the opposing force to defeat a Depot without doing something beforehand about the gate or the fleet that's going to be coming through it; there's no hope for surprise.

Offensively, it is simply a question of weight and the ability to apply it where needed, when needed. The Imperium is the most powerful of the empires in that immediate region. Its greatest weakness is its inability to concentrate power, owing to the great distances and long travel times involved. This system would allow it to concentrate power, bringing overwhelming force to one small region. As the depots asset back a ways from the front, the effect would not be immediate and surprise could not be obtained. However, if the Imperium is the sole empire with the technology - and if it's TL15 technology, it will have the lead on everyone except those Fungi-from-Yuggoth folk, if I remember correctly - then the lack of surprise will be irrelevant since the Imperium can bring overwhelming force against a single sector while the opponent, even with forewarning, is struggling to bring his forces up to respond.
 
In this instance, it's useful to examine the specific strategic picture.

The Imperium's depots - the best place for a military gate - are very well defended and set back a ways from the usual fronts. Presence of a gate would make them impossibly well-defended: opposing fleet jump in, and the entire strength of your empire pops in a few turns later while the local defenders struggle to hold the attackers at bay. Add to that the fact that the opposing fleet has a number of star systems to get through before it gets to Depot, and it becomes pretty much impossible for the opposing force to defeat a Depot without doing something beforehand about the gate or the fleet that's going to be coming through it; there's no hope for surprise.

I'd need to know some more details before accepting (or refusing) your picture:

Woould those gates allow for contiuous transit (as a bridge would) or would they have to be activated for every ship (as a ferry would)?

In the former case, how many ships would be able to cross it (to keep with the bridge analogy, what's the weight allowance of the bridge)?

In the latter case (the ferry analogy), how long between activations (to allow for the gates to cool off, the space to reset after the stress, the power to build up, whatever it be)?

And see that even if news are immediately sent by the gates (Smart money is that courriers are ready at teach gate, but, again, how long to send them to each receiveing gate?), unless the fletes are already assembled in the depots (some of them would be on patrol, training maneuvers, repairing/reffiting/maintenance, etc...), how long to reach the gate and jump to cross it to the battle?

What effect has the gate on the ship, and how long to recover from it (screens must be down, maneuver probably limited, etc...)?

So, I guess a surprise attack on a gate will not see ships arriving to reinforce in a few turns (at least a few days/weeks), probably giving time for the gate to be damaged/destroyed if the incoming fleet is larger (or at least more powerful) than the deffending one.

But, as those gates would not be in front lines, I don't envision a surprise attack on them to be a possibility, so, in the purely strategic POV, your prediction might be valid.

Offensively, it is simply a question of weight and the ability to apply it where needed, when needed. The Imperium is the most powerful of the empires in that immediate region. Its greatest weakness is its inability to concentrate power, owing to the great distances and long travel times involved. This system would allow it to concentrate power, bringing overwhelming force to one small region. As the depots asset back a ways from the front, the effect would not be immediate and surprise could not be obtained. However, if the Imperium is the sole empire with the technology - and if it's TL15 technology, it will have the lead on everyone except those Fungi-from-Yuggoth folk, if I remember correctly - then the lack of surprise will be irrelevant since the Imperium can bring overwhelming force against a single sector while the opponent, even with forewarning, is struggling to bring his forces up to respond.

Even in this case, how long before the enemies at the opposite side of the Imperium realice their frontiers have been weakended and (knowing they might be the next ones) take advantage of it (while the massed fleet is dispersed in offensive opperations along the active front)?

And see that relying on your predictions, it's quite posible that fleet is kept at smaller numbers, as the concentration capability gives a perception that a smaller fleet sufices...
 
I think...

Gate traffic would be an equation of size/power to use with a Key necessary from each location
How long to recharge between each ship passing?
Is the power only used for sending?
Can ships come through from other destinations simultaneously?
Do smaller ships use less power and therefore recharging can be accomplished faster?
Can more power plants be brought online to recharge faster between ships?
 
To me, the Stargate gates make worlds very vulnerable.

On one of my sector maps, I have several wormholes. Ancient technology.

Some of them are one-way. I'm not sure I'll keep them one-way ot not. The arrows show direction of passage.

They aren't placed at sub-sector capitals, but a system or two away. Most are by themselves.

Vespucian Arm-Column B Sector 3 map
 
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I've had jumpgates in MTU for over a decade.

  • Ancient technology (no ability to replicate at TL15 3I)
  • Relocated to several "key" Depot locations by the Navy. Under complete Admiralty control.
  • Not used for commerce or X-boats
  • Ancient technology has defenses against Virus tech - silicon lifeforms (that are not clearly understood)
  • Top known planned Jump range 36 parsecs.
  • Appears to be self-fueled, can utilize fuel if provided.
  • Jump projector defense system
  • Value priceless
  • There are also a few known stargates with galactic destination points, but that is another thread.
 
I've had jumpgates in MTU for over a decade.

  • Ancient technology (no ability to replicate at TL15 3I)
  • Relocated to several "key" Depot locations by the Navy. Under complete Admiralty control.
  • Not used for commerce or X-boats
  • Ancient technology has defenses against Virus tech - silicon lifeforms (that are not clearly understood)
  • Top known planned Jump range 36 parsecs.
  • Appears to be self-fueled, can utilize fuel if provided.
  • Jump projector defense system
  • Value priceless
  • There are also a few known stargates with galactic destination points, but that is another thread.

Two books I've read recently also have mysterious ancient doohickey gates. "Starrigger" by John DeChancie (Trucks in Spaaace!) and "Probability Space" by Nancy Kress. They exist, they work, no one knows why. People who tamper with them end badly.
 
Can ships come through from other destinations simultaneously?

If so, what safety systems/techniques/strategies are used to avoid collisions when exiting the gate (see that this would put several unccordinated ships too close for any traffic control officer)?
 
Idle speculation time: In a universe without any Rebellion, Imperial scientists invent a stargate. It's a huge ring floating in space that allows ships to jump between different stargates at any distance. Minimum size is so humongous that building one takes a significant fraction of Imperial revenue. Individual worlds just can't afford to finance one. After long deliberation, the decision is made to build one at a time at the rate of one every decade. The first one is built at Capital.

Where are the next ones going?

Hans

Hans,

I may be paranoid, but I wouldn't build the first one at capital but at least J7 away, in fact I'd build them in a depot system, well defended and then use them to rapidly transfer fleets from one domain to another...

regards

David
 
Two books I've read recently also have mysterious ancient doohickey gates. "Starrigger" by John DeChancie (Trucks in Spaaace!) and "Probability Space" by Nancy Kress. They exist, they work, no one knows why. People who tamper with them end badly.

Stargates from TV/movies we're good for small forces. 20 minute connect time, the iris can only take small vehicles (probably could have used ww2 jeeps, but had their mule and Goa'uld starfighters. That's pretty cool.

Jumpgates from B5 allows exit, entry between an alternate space and real space. Loosing your direction beacon can be fatal. It seems these devices are activated (reserved) before using, like an airport runway. I like that, but I'm also fond of keeping Jump travel very Traveller. FF&S references gates and i think being able to deploy a fleet to a J36 region in one week is pretty cool. If these gates are engineered Depot to Depot (capital to sector capital, whatever) then it changes the flavor of what is Traveller (even Ancients tech). For example, I have replaced x-boat communications, but not with instantaneous communications. I have more solutions for the Ancient Jumpgates during the Rebellion, but not to get on a soap box. I like the TL15-16 Imperium figuring out that they can do a J36 one way without a problem. Better choose the right parsec. ;)
 
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I can see the Imperium wanting to keep jumpgate-stargate technology under their control for many of the obvious reasons stated in the thread but the sheer cost of upkeep and related support would eventually allow such to be 'licensed' or operated by civilian contractors.

That said, the jump-points would be limited to operating between high traffic-densely populated systems, think of such the interstate highway system in our world setting.

A need then for 'local' transport and delivery of goods and passengers would keep independent starship operators in demand as well as profitable for such operators.

And as in MTU, the 'roads' off the beaten path bring adventure and reward in equal measure.
 
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