Inquiry to RL military types.

[jawillroy]

I've not been in the military, so I don't know the culture intimately. I had a four-star Admiral visit the shop I work at today and apparently he felt well taken care of, because he presented me with what I later discovered was called a Challenge Coin: a pretty hefty, colorful hunk of brass.

I appreciated the gesture. But how much of a big deal is it for someone in service? Please enlighten me.

 

[rust]

I think you will have looked at this already, but perhaps not, so ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Challenge_coin

 

[jawillroy]

I saw the Wiki, but I wanted to get an independent assessment from someone familiar with the culture. I saw the bit saying that they were being handed out too often and were therefore somewhat devalued (the fact that I, a confirmed civilian, have one from the hand of one of the highest officers in the American Navy is an indicator that this might be true!) I'm mightily intrigued by the custom of challenging. I suspect, though, that if I were to find myself at a bar with a navy crowd and I banged my challenge coin down I might earn myself a fat lip, busted glasses and a shiner. Or am I wrong?

 

[Major B]

I suspect, though, that if I were to find myself at a bar with a navy crowd and I banged my challenge coin down I might earn myself a fat lip, busted glasses and a shiner. Or am I wrong?

I think you're greater danger is having to buy for the crowd. Challenging is best done between those in the same unit - it is a check to see if you brought your coin specific to that unit with you, assuming that all or most have been presented with a coin. But those are old rules...

It seems more prevalent now to award coins only for excellence - or to commemorate a specific event, like a deployment. For example, I bought coins for every one of the soldiers in the company I commanded in Iraq a few years back. If I ever run into them in a bar, I'll throw it down because I'll be happy to buy if they are carrying theirs (and I won't let them buy if they don't because I shouldn't take advantage of my soldiers even if I'm not their commander any more). Its more about comraderie than anything.

But like I said, that's old rules. I haven't been challenged in recent memory. Now most of my coins are in a case in my office.

 

[atpollard]

Now most of my coins are in a case in my office.

Just like Bill Clinton's (I read the wikipedia article). You have something in common with a former US President.

 

[aramis]

It basically means the Adm. felt you deserved a tip, but were in a job where that would be inappropriate. It's roughly equivalent to a public "Thank-you" note on unit letterhead.

At one point they were traded instead of patches. Once DoD realized that it didn't stop patch trading (many GI's carried a spare unmounted patch or two specifically to trade), they slowed down with the coins, but nice presentation quality ones are now used as an "atta-boy"...

 

[CosmicGamer]

I never saw one before or during the first Persian Gulf War. Left the service in 1991. If someone had dropped a coin down, I don't believe anyone I associated with would have had a clue what it was for. If some stranger demanded a drink they would get laughed at - if we were in a good mood.

 

[BlackBat242]

USMC, 6/81-6/89.

Sgt, aircraft maintenance.

Never saw one, never heard of the existence of them.

Something invented after GW1, I expect... despite the legends.

I know several Vietnam vets well (USAF, USN, USMC, and USA), and none of them ever heard of it either.



If someone had laid one down while I was in, we would have asked "what kind of kid's game are you running?".

 

[Fritz_Brown]

I first saw coins in about 1990 or so. It was a fighter pilot thing at the time. (And, it might have been a primarily Navy fighter pilot thing.) The Army has handed them out as incentives for a long time.

I have a few - they are highly prized by me because they were almost all given to me for a job well-done. Display it somewhere nice, or place it in your desk drawer to pull out for show & tell.

 

[sfchbryan]

Basically, they are an "attaboy" from a very important person. You see them handed out more to senior people. (Most of us had already maxed out on awards.) If it is your first, put it in your wallet. When you are at the bar and you get "coined", slam it on the table.

Coining - A type of drinking game with coins. Rules are different in different places, but everywhere I have been, it works like this.....

1 person calls out "coin check". Everybody has to pull out their coin. Anyone without a coin buys a round. If everyone has a coin, then they go by the "rank" of the coin. (the rank is determined by the rank on the coin. (Look at your coin, the Admiral's rank will be on it. Only Flag Officers & Sergeants Majors are supposed to have coins.)

I was in the military for nearly 10 years before i got my first one I retired with about 30. How important they are is dependent on where you are at. I did my last tour at the US Sergeants Major Academy & they were harder to get that an award. On the other hand, I once got one from the Assistant Secretary of Defense for shuttling him around Austin, Tx (Pays to have a Dress uniform at the office & after that, I never had to buy drinks - only folks above mine was the Secretary of Defense, the Vice-President & the President). On the third hand, I was coined by several of my students after they were commissioned as Second Lieutenants at Ft. Benning (Exception to the rule above, OCS has class coins). When I was at the National Guard Professional Education Center, we handed them out to the class leaders for each of the courses that we taught.

 

[Ganidirsii O'Flynn]

Depends on how significant it is to the recipient, really. I know some guys who keep theirs in the pocket of their pajamas, and I know some guys who used it to run a tab at a bar and left it there.

The custom of the service is that there is no greater compliment to pay someone than to give them your challenge coin. It signifies a bond of duty and shared service. As I say, not all folks treat them that way.

As for mine, I'm kind of middle of the road with it. I'm no longer active duty (and haven't been for coming up on 20 years). I carry it when it's appropriate and I try to take care of it. But I don't wear it around all the time, nor do I flash it just for laughs.

I hope that helps, though I wonder if an answer this wishy-washy really does...

 

[jawillroy]

It basically means the Adm. felt you deserved a tip, but were in a job where that would be inappropriate.

That's what I figured for this situation, yeah. The overall context helps, though!

 

[jawillroy]

Display it somewhere nice, or place it in your desk drawer to pull out for show & tell.

That's my current plan. It's particularly appropriate in my case: the reverse of the coin has a silhouette map of South and Central America with a compass rose.

I sell antique maps, y'see.

 

[jawillroy]

If everyone has a coin, then they go by the "rank" of the coin. (the rank is determined by the rank on the coin.

If that's so, and if it's at all appropriate for a civ to participate in the coin game (coin or no) then I should be able to drink for free in the right places. <i>Four stars, fellas! I'm looking at the top shelf!</i>

Nah, I think it belongs on my office shelf. I don't think any of my regular watering holes have much of a military presence, and it doesn't seem appropriate to go hunting them out for drinks!

Really though, it's nice to know my treatment of the man was appreciated.

 

[jawillroy]

I hope that helps, though I wonder if an answer this wishy-washy really does...

No, that helps a lot.

Like I said, I'd appreciated the gesture - but knowing the overall context of the coins helps me appreciate it more. I've sort of given myself a crash course in challenge coins the past day or so; I know enough that what I have here is not so much a unit's challenge coin as a "commander's coin." So between that, and the fact that my service was of a <i>distinctly</i> nonmilitary sort, tells me that while I may have earned the coin to display it I don't think I've earned the cred to actually employ it in the field of drinking.

It strikes me that a relatively comfortable civilian drinking with servicemen by all rights ought to be buying, anyhow.

 

[Ganidirsii O'Flynn]

No, that helps a lot.
It strikes me that a relatively comfortable civilian drinking with servicemen by all rights ought to be buying, anyhow.

Speaking as a guy who has bought a round for the troops on occaision (I live within artillery range of Ft. Lewis), just buy one round. Anything more will a: be kind of condescending and b: likely do some serious damage to your credit rating! :rofl:

 

[jawillroy]

(I live within artillery range of Ft. Lewis)

Strikes me as a particularly good reason to be nice to the troops, especially if they know where you live... ^_-

just buy one round. Anything more will a: be kind of condescending and b: likely do some serious damage to your credit rating! :rofl:

What I'd have figured. Also, it's friendlier to swap rounds, since buying one is itself a pleasure.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

If everyone has a coin, then they go by the "rank" of the coin. (the rank is determined by the rank on the coin. (Look at your coin, the Admiral's rank will be on it.

Huh - never saw that element used. Usually if you challenged and everybody had a coin, then you bought. You lost the challenge, IOW.

Only Flag Officers & Sergeants Majors are supposed to have coins.

I don't think that's the case everywhere. We used unit coins as attaboys to non-unit personnel, unless we really wanted to get higher involved. But, that was in the Air Force.

 

[Higgipedia]

I don't think that's the case everywhere. We used unit coins as attaboys to non-unit personnel, unless we really wanted to get higher involved. But, that was in the Air Force.

The three coins I have are all for helping out another unit or inspections. I was attached to an Infantry Battalion during OIF I and got a coin from the 3/325 AIR as a result. I also got a coin from a CID Battalion for setting up some training for our interrogators and offering some seats to the CID agents.

The last one I got was when we had the CG of SOCCENT come visit our facility last year. I gave the briefing about the interrogation side and he liked it and coined me.

 

[jawillroy]

325th in the 82nd? My grandfather was a Major in the 325th back when it was glider infantry - he was killed near St. Maire Eglise.