Islands of Tech/Culture on Worlds

[MThompson016]

Inspired by the "Have You Ever Been to Startown" thread, I've got an idea here, and wonder what the brain trust thinks of it.

From the 1840's (roughly) until World War II, Shanghai was divided up three ways, the Chinese city, the International Settlement, and the French Concession. It essentially functioned as a Western, mostly British, but there were strong influences from other nations like an Italian orchestra director, city in the Far East. That includes their treatment of the Chinese.

How often would you think on some worlds, there might be de facto extra territorial enclaves run by and for off worlders? These might have a lot of quality of life items imported that would be out of reach for visitors or the locals. Also, a separate justice system for the off-worlders, and possibly even military units.

 

[McPerth]

Inspired by the "Have You Ever Been to Startown" thread, I've got an idea here, and wonder what the brain trust thinks of it.

From the 1840's (roughly) until World War II, Shanghai was divided up three ways, the Chinese city, the International Settlement, and the French Concession. It essentially functioned as a Western, mostly British, but there were strong influences from other nations like an Italian orchestra director, city in the Far East. That includes their treatment of the Chinese.

How often would you think on some worlds, there might be de facto extra territorial enclaves run by and for off worlders? These might have a lot of quality of life items imported that would be out of reach for visitors or the locals. Also, a separate justice system for the off-worlders, and possibly even military units.

Well, in every IN or IISS base on a planet under TL 15, just to give you a generic example...

I've always assumed they have the capaity to repair (and to some extent replenish) TL15 ships, and, if the starport is good enough, to maintain them, and that requires TL15 equipment. So, in lower TL worlds they have to be TL15 islands...

 

[flykiller]

How often would you think on some worlds, there might be de facto extra territorial enclaves run by and for off worlders?

as often as there is a reason for non-citizen off-worlders to be there. usually the reason is economic/military - the target entity is 1) wealthy and 2) not in control of its own borders and 3) unable to protect itself from predator entities that attach themselves to that target. such conditions are somewhat common but short-lived. scanning the spinward marches one finds that such conditions might be met at efate/louzy and glisten/aki. other locations suggest themselves.

 

[Reban]

How about a MegaCorp enclave?

A cityblock sized compound which houses the on planet factory or local service office that supervises the services and projects on-world.

There would be a core group of off-world corp employees who spend x number of months or years living and working there. There would be the short term specialists and subcontractors.

There would also be the necessary local workers and or service providers that have to travel in and out every day to do their work.

There are lots of good real-world and fiction examples of this kind of compound living.


P.S. the Shanghai Police just cry out to be converted to a Traveller Startown law enforcement or rapid response unit.

 

[robject]

How often would you think on some worlds, there might be de facto extra territorial enclaves run by and for off worlders? These might have a lot of quality of life items imported that would be out of reach for visitors or the locals. Also, a separate justice system for the off-worlders, and possibly even military units.

IMTU this is typical on colonized worlds which also have native intelligent life.

 

[flykiller]

How about a MegaCorp enclave?

that would seem to be redundant.

 

[mike wightman]

Well, in every IN or IISS base on a planet under TL 15, just to give you a generic example...

I've always assumed they have the capaity to repair (and to some extent replenish) TL15 ships, and, if the starport is good enough, to maintain them, and that requires TL15 equipment. So, in lower TL worlds they have to be TL15 islands...

It is now my contention that within the OTU - and certainly within the proto-OTU of the CT rules as written - all type A starports are the TL of the ruling polity. It's the only way I can explain how a civilian ship can get annual maintainance at any world with a type A port regardless of the drives (TL) of the ship.

 

[McPerth]

It is now my contention that within the OTU - and certainly within the proto-OTU of the CT rules as written - all type A starports are the TL of the ruling polity. It's the only way I can explain how a civilian ship can get annual maintainance at any world with a type A port regardless of the drives (TL) of the ship.

I guess when you say ruling polity you mean the Imperium, Consulate, or so, not the ruling polity in the specific world...

If so, I agre partially with you. I asume it has the capcity to act as such, and standard pieces, but it's not fully Policy's (I'll call it Imperial) TL. it cannot build full Imperial TL ships, to give you an example, and repairs in custom ships (or heavy repairs on any higher TL ship) will take longer (and be more expensive), as it has to import specialized pieces.

 

[Quint]

It is now my contention that within the OTU - and certainly within the proto-OTU of the CT rules as written - all type A starports are the TL of the ruling polity. It's the only way I can explain how a civilian ship can get annual maintainance at any world with a type A port regardless of the drives (TL) of the ship.

I don't think I've ever mentally codified it as such, but that certainly makes a fair amount of sense.

D.

 

[kilemall]

I think there is a BIG difference between a repair garage/service and a car factory, so I would alter that to say the A port can repair all TLs but makes ships at the planet's TL.

With the exception of a naval base being there, THEN it builds at the top TL.

 

[aramis]

I think there is a BIG difference between a repair garage/service and a car factory, so I would alter that to say the A port can repair all TLs but makes ships at the planet's TL.

With the exception of a naval base being there, THEN it builds at the top TL.

As would I, and also the CT rules.

Note that almost any wet-naval drydock can mount a wet-naval engine, but few have a facility to scratchbuild one, and most that can still cannot build one above local tech... for lack of supply chains, supplies, and skilled workmen in the right trades. Indeed, few yards exist now besides the highest tech for any given country. And the largest civil construction yards are in the highest tech places - South Korea is a tech leader, and has one of the largest civil yards around.

Boeing and Washington State in the US... just down the road from MicroSoft.

 

[BlackBat242]

How about a MegaCorp enclave?

A cityblock sized compound which houses the on planet factory or local service office that supervises the services and projects on-world.

There would be a core group of off-world corp employees who spend x number of months or years living and working there. There would be the short term specialists and subcontractors.

There would also be the necessary local workers and or service providers that have to travel in and out every day to do their work.

There are lots of good real-world and fiction examples of this kind of compound living.


P.S. the Shanghai Police just cry out to be converted to a Traveller Startown law enforcement or rapid response unit.

See: the current foreign company enclaves in Saudi Arabia - self-contained villages, often walled, for employees of each company - with most high-tech (and a good amount of mid-tech) work in the nation being done by foreign (mostly European/US) companies who bring in the workers from "home".

 

[Reban]

that would seem to be redundant.

Why redundant?

Why do such enclaves develop? To control movement and communication for religious, etnic or economic reasons?

See: the current foreign company enclaves in Saudi Arabia - self-contained villages, often walled, for employees of each company - with most high-tech (and a good amount of mid-tech) work in the nation being done by foreign (mostly European/US) companies who bring in the workers from "home".

Yes modern "company compound" living is a good example, but I was thinking a bit farther back in time.

For example the Dutch enclave of Dejima. Set up to allow the Dutch to trade with the Japanese. While not exactly "run by and for" the outsiders as the OP specified its a good example of an ethnic enclave who's purpose is economic.

Actually its probably important to understand why an enclave develops or exists.

One or both sides usually want to control the movement of ideas (religious, political or economic). Defense is another big factor. Usually the minority group together to feel safer, although the locals may think concentrating the outsiders is a good idea for their own safety. Predjudice may also be a big factor, locals or outsiders may want to remain 'pure'.

In a Traveller context there are some other possible reasons. Environment; if the outsiders need special environmental conditions or find the local conditions adverse they'd naturally group together to pool resources to make a habitable enclave.

Danger; Maybe the outsiders are aliens that are bigger, stronger and more aggressive than the locals or vice versa. Maybe there is something about them, psionic ability for example, that makes them 'dangerous'.

Culture and community; of course there is a much simpler explanation why an enclave develops. People with the same origin or culture tend to flock together and assist each other when they arrive in a foriegn/alien environment. So naturally ethnic enclaves develop.

However the self governing enclave of outsiders should be a rarer thing because they are inherently dangerous. They are defacto colonies of an outside power.

Starports fall somewhat into this category except for the fact that the Imperium professes not to be interested in planetary government..... and its the biggest player in town. Plus any world with an Imperial starport is already an imperial member world.

But consider if you were the Sword Worlds or some other polity, and you allow Zhodani, self administering enclaves on your planets.... haven't you just allowed Zhodani colonies to set up on your planets?

Long story short: there are definitely enclaves of off worlders on most planets. Not all would have extra territoriality (either agreed or defacto). Where this occurs it is a recipe for conflict.

 

[mike wightman]

Look up the original meaning of factory and factor - linked with European trade posts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factor_(agent)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factory_(trading_post)

I wrote up a factor career for CT

 

[flykiller]

How about a MegaCorp enclave?

that would seem to be redundant.

Why redundant?

the popular conception of "megacorps" being sector-spanning entities possessing enormous economic power, and of being owned and run usually by nobles thus possessing enormous political power, and of possessing their own security at significantly advanced levels, would indicate they typically function almost independently of any world on which they may be present. a megacorp facility would resemble a base or a colony more than a simple office complex. it would interface not with any local police force but with the planetary rulers themselves, who would be happy to accede to or be bribed to accept or be forced to tolerate whatever conditions the megacorp required for its presence.

so yeah, the phrase "megacorp" "enclave" seems redundant.

ymmv.