Modern House Rules for Personal Combat

[robject]

It seems there are two ways of looking at personal combat.

Better. One way is to have separate pen/dmg values, as AHL or MT. This provides a number of benefits, including scale: you can create conglomerate units, and also figure out how much damage your PGMP-14 does to the outer hull of a scout ship. Integrated combat which scales smoothly from the barroom brawl to interstellar slug-fests.

Faster. On the other side is something like the T20/ACQ/T4 system. It's simpler, which means you lose scalability, but personal combat is fast. Assuming most combat is level (person-to-person, or ship-to-ship), it makes sense to have a simple mechanic tuned for these common encounter types. A more complex mechanic -- or translation -- may be needed for scalability, but interface issues tend to be special cases anyhow.

From these two major branches come some related considerations.

Tables. The more tables you have to consult, the closer you come to SpaceMaster(tm). The game is also slowed down. With humans, lookups are distractions, but are preferred by regular and old-hand gamers. Newbies and more casual gamers tend to avoid tables for real-time sequences such as combat.

Levels. CT succeeded wildly when it presented rule-tiers: simpler, faster rules in the main book, and better/scalable rules in the extension. Examples: worldgen, chargen, starship gen.

I suggest that a proper solution looks to the CT tiered model. If it can be done, it would be a reasonable compromise.

Assumption: Modern house rules assumes the use of a task system (which is the subject of another post entirely).

 

[robject]

It seems there are two ways of looking at personal combat.

Better. One way is to have separate pen/dmg values, as AHL or MT. This provides a number of benefits, including scale: you can create conglomerate units, and also figure out how much damage your PGMP-14 does to the outer hull of a scout ship. Integrated combat which scales smoothly from the barroom brawl to interstellar slug-fests.

Faster. On the other side is something like the T20/ACQ/T4 system. It's simpler, which means you lose scalability, but personal combat is fast. Assuming most combat is level (person-to-person, or ship-to-ship), it makes sense to have a simple mechanic tuned for these common encounter types. A more complex mechanic -- or translation -- may be needed for scalability, but interface issues tend to be special cases anyhow.

From these two major branches come some related considerations.

Tables. The more tables you have to consult, the closer you come to SpaceMaster(tm). The game is also slowed down. With humans, lookups are distractions, but are preferred by regular and old-hand gamers. Newbies and more casual gamers tend to avoid tables for real-time sequences such as combat.

Levels. CT succeeded wildly when it presented rule-tiers: simpler, faster rules in the main book, and better/scalable rules in the extension. Examples: worldgen, chargen, starship gen.

I suggest that a proper solution looks to the CT tiered model. If it can be done, it would be a reasonable compromise.

Assumption: Modern house rules assumes the use of a task system (which is the subject of another post entirely).

 

[Golan2072]

My Approach (based on my task system):
A) Initiative rolled once per participant per combat at the beginning of the combat; roll Tactics Skill+Initiative DM+1d6; Leadership skill allows a character with both Tactics and Leadership to bestow his initiative to three people besides him per level in Leadership skill. Initiative DM should be listed on the character sheet and calculated as following during chargen/stat changes:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Condition DM
DEX 4- -2
DEX 5-7 -1
DEX 8-11 +1
DEX 12+ +2
INT 4- -2
INT 5-7 -1
INT 8-11 +1
INT 12+ +2</pre>[/QUOTE]Initiative is re-rolled if codtitions warrant it (i.e. a new group enters the combat, troops dismount from vehicle etc).

B) Attack Sequence (one per round):
B-1) Attack Roll as per my task system.
B-2) Damage Roll on the appropriate (Personnel or Vehicle) Damage Table.


I am also in favor of abandoning the "first hit in combat is more deadly than other hits" LBB1 rule; instead, shooting/swinging at a surprised target should give a positive DM to the attacker.

Penetration and Armor values are from Striker and should fall within "proper use" guidelines; I use the "effective range" values as longer range attenuation is subsumed into negative range DMs.

Attack Roll:

Positive DMs+2d6-Negative DMs; roll 8+ to hit.

Range modifiers are according to LBB1 p.46 and might be either positive or negative, depending on weapon and range.

Positive DMs:
+Weapon Skill
+1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8+
+2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 12+
+1 if the target is large (from horse to light tank size)
+2 if the target is huge (MBT to 200 dton ship).
+3 if the target is a 200+ dton ship.

Negative DMs:
-2 if Obscuration/Smoke exists
-4 if in darkness without night vision/thermo/light source
-2 if the target is evading
-1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8-
-2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 4-
-2 if the attacker is running
-1 if the target is small (dog sized or less)

Damage Roll:

2d6+Penetration+Skill-Armor; then consult the following table:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 or less No Effect
3 exactly Scratch
4-6 Light Wound
7-8 Medium Wound
9-11 Serious Wound
12-15 Death
16+ Utterly Destroyed</pre>[/QUOTE]Penetration
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Laser Pistol 4
Laser Carbine 7
Laser Rifle 9
PGMP-12 20
PGMP-13 25
PGMP-14 25
FGMP-14 34
FGMP-15 34
Revolver 1
Autopistol 1
Body Pistol 0
Snub P. (HE) 1
Snub P. (HEAP) 6
Gauss Pistol 4
SMG 2
Shotgun 1 (additional damage rules needed)
Carbine 2
Rifle 3
Auto-Rifle 3
Assault Rifle 3
Accelerator R. 1
ACR (Slugs) 4
ACR (DS) 6
ACR (HE) 3
Gauss Rifle 7
LAG (HE) 3
LAG (KEAP) 8
LAG (Flechette) 2 (additional damage rules needed)
LMG 3
MMG 3
HMG 6
VRF Gauss Gun 21

Claws 3
Teeth 4
Horns 5
Hooves 4
Stinger 5
Thrasher 8
Hands 1
Club 2
Dagger 2
Blade 3
Foil 3
Cutlass 3
Sword 4
Broadsword 7
Hand Axe 6
Battleaxe 8
Bayonet 3
Spear 3
Halberd 5
Pike 2
Staff/Cudgel 2</pre>[/QUOTE]Armor Values
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Jack 1 (against melee only)
Mesh 2
Cloth 5
Flak Jacket 3
Ablat 1 (6 against lasers)
Reflec 10 (against lasers only)
CES 6
Vacc Suit 5
Combat armor 10
Battledress 10</pre>[/QUOTE]Wound Accumulation:
5 (untreated) Scratches become one Light Wound; 4 Light wounds become one Medium Wound; 3 Medium Wouds become a Serious Wound; 2 Serious Wounds becomes a Death result.

Wound Effects
Scratch: No Effect (other than accumulation).
Light Wound: -1 DM to all tasks per Light wound recieved.
Medium Wound: Unconsciousness; one characteristic treated as zero.
Serious Wound: Unconscious; Unstable; two characteristics treated as zero; will die from shock/blood loss in 6d6 minutes if not Stabilized (a Medic (DEX, Average) task).
Death: Acutely and critically wounded; considered dead for all purpuses if extensive medical help (a Medic (DEX, Extreme) task) is not given within 1d6 COMBAT TURNS, and even then recovery is not always guaranteed.
Utterly Destroyed: Roll a new character Period.

Diagnosing and Treating Wounds:
Diagnosing a normal wound is a Medic (INT, Average) task. The referee rolls secretly; success means the accurate wound level is given to the player; failure means that no result is given; a modified roll of 3 or less means that the Referee gives inaccurate data to the player (changing the results one level up or down). Diagnosing poisoning/disease is usually a Medic (EDU, Formidable) task.

Each wound level has a corresponding difficulty level to treat:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Scratch Easy (4+)
Light Wound Average (8+)
Medium Wound Formidable (12+)
Serious Wound Extreme (16+)
Death Hopeless (20+)</pre>[/QUOTE]Recovery:
Recovery is possible once combat has been concluded. Attributes that were "reduced to zero" by combat return to half of their full value after the combat in all cases but a Death result (though Seriously Wounded characters remain unconscious even after stabilization, until treated). Recovery is as listed below (in all cases, a modified task roll result of 2- makes the wound ONE LEVEL WORSE):

Scratch: A Medic (INT, Easy, 10min) task "removes" all scratches for the purpouse of play; this includes sanitizing the scratches, putting antisceptic (sp?) and a bandaids on them; a minimal medical kit (not even an LBB3 MedKit, just a simple first aid kit) is enough for this purpose; if no such aid is given, the scratches are "removed" for all game purposes within one day of full rest.

Light Wound: A Medic (INT, Average, 30min) task and one full day of rest, or three days of full rest (without the treatment) "remove" all Light Wounds and their penalties. A standard Medkit is required for this treatment.

Medium Wound: A Medic (INT, Formidable, 1hour) task and 1d6 days of full rest, or 6d6 days of full rest without the treatment allow the character to recover from Medium Wounds. A MedKit is the bare minimum required for such treatment, though a Basic Facility (i.e. the basic medlab subsumed into the stateroom cost of starships or an avarage community clinic of TL7+ or a TL5+ hospital) would be desired for easier treatment (in game terms: equipment DMs).

Serious Wound: Only a Medic (INT, Extreme, 1day) task performed in atleast a Standard Facility (a specially bought ship Medlab module or a small TL5+ hospital) can allow the recovery of a Seriously Wounded character; the task could be repeated by each time with a -1 DM. Afterwards, the character must rest for 1d6 weeks to fully recover.

Death Result: A character who has recieved a Death Wound and was stabilized could be treated; this treatment must begin within 6 hours after the combat or the character dies (cold sleep could suspend this indefinitely); the treatment must be given in an Extensive Facility (hospital ship or large TL7+ hospital). Failure in this task kills the character. If the treatment succeeds, PERMANENTLY reduce 1d6-(TL abouve 10) from each of the chatacter's attributes; if an attribute is reduced to zero in this way, the character dies. The TL refers to that of the Extended Facility.

Utterly Destroyed: You're kidding, right?

Medical Equipment DMs
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">No Equipment -4
Improvised Equipment -2
Standard MedKit 0
Basic Facility +2
Standard Facility +4
Extended Facility +6
If equipment TL4- -4
If equipment TL5 -2
If equipment TL6 -1
If equipment TL7-9 0
If equipment TL10-11 +1
If equipment TL12-14 +2
If equipment TL15+ +4</pre>[/QUOTE]And yes, a TL15 hospital will make most kinds of medical treatment EXTREMELY EASY. Especially with a well-trained staff. The thing is that most adventurers/soldiers/mercenaries will get wounded quite far away from such a hospital...

Additional Combat rules and Rulings

Automatic Fire
As in LBB4 PP.31-32, though only the two-hit chances (as shown in the LBB1 and 4 range tables) are affected by autofire DMs; Penetration is not. Additional attacks and group hits are as given in these pages. Fully-automatic flechette/shotgun weapons use the Shotgun Group Hit rules, as in LBB1 P.42 rather than the Autofire Group Hit rules in either LBB.

Shotguns/Flechette
All wounds recieved from shotgun/flechette rounds and considered one level higher than normal, e.g. Scratch becomes Light wound, Light Wound becomed Medium Wound etc. Note that even though this rule makes these weapons quite devastating, their penetration is typically extremely low, which means that they are mostly effective against unarmored and lightly armored opponents. Other than that, shotguns perform as described in LBB1 P.42.

Explosive (HE/HEAP) Rounds
Explosives and explosive rounds (HE. HEAP, grenades etc) always cause TWO wounds of the same kind ("No Effect" remains "No Effect") - for example, a HE round hits a character; a modified result of 7 is rolled on the Damage Table; therefor, the character recieves two Medium Wounds. For grenades this rule only exists for direct hits rather than group hit results (i.e. adjacent to the target).

Grenades and Bombs
Hand grenades are thrown as a Throwing (DEX, Avarage) task, have no range modifiers and may only hit targets in Medium range or less (but if a grenade is thrown at a target in close or short range, the thrower gets hit as well...); RAM/Launcher grenades use the range modifiers as in LBB4; all grenades cause additional damage to their main target as the HE/HEAP rounds described abouve; they also hit (but only ONCE) all targets within a tight group with the main target (within Close or Short range of him); their penetration is presented here:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Grenade Penetration
HE Hand 9
HEAP Hand 18
HE RAM 9
HEAP RAM 28
Flechette RAM 2 (uses Flechette damage rules)</pre>[/QUOTE]Plasma and Fusion long-range hits
Plasma and Fusion shots use the LBB1 P.42 Group Hits by Shotguns rules.

Zero-G and Vaccuum Combat
In addition to the Zero-G combat rules in LBB4 P.16 and P.32, any wounds recieved by a character (wearing a protective suit, otherwise he won't be alive anyway) in a vaccuum, corrosive or insidious environment are considered as one level higher than usual; this is cumulative with the shotgun/flechette rules.

Structural Damage and Demolition
Walls, doors and other structural features have both an armor rating and an integrity rating; hitting them is usually not a problem (as they are big and stationary) unless the range is Long or more (then use the normal to-hit procedure with a +2 DM). The armor rating is reduced from a weapon's penetration value, and any remaining penetration is substracted from the integrity rating; if the penetration is lower than the structural armor rating, no damage is done to the structural feature. Structural integrity damage is cumulative; even A SINGLE POINT of structural integrity damage compromises pressure integrity (i.e. causes decompression if the door/wall holds pressure); a 1.5m wide and 3m high hole is created by reducing a feature's structural integrity to zero. So here are a few structural features commonly encountered by Travellers:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Feature Armor Integrity
Normal Door 2 5
Thin Wooden Wall 1 5
Thick Wooden Wall 4 20
Brick Wall 8 30
Concrete Wall 15 50
Heavy Concrete Wall 28 75
Non-Ship Steel Wall 20 50
Ship Interior Wall 2 25
Iris Valve 5 25
Bulkhead/Hatch 10 100
Unarmored Ship Hull 60(?) 250</pre>[/QUOTE]Note that explosives (HE and HEAP) and Energy weapons (Plasma, Fusion or Laser) cause double structural damage (after armor has been substracted from it, ofcourse).

Also note that outside of combat, there is no problem hitting a structural feature from Medium or shorter range; to find out how quickly a weapon will bring down a structural feature, divide the Structural Integrity rating by the effective (i.e. after the substraction of armor) penetration of the weapon to get a number of 15-second combat turns.

Ships and the Combat System
For detailed rules, see Striker Book 2 PP.41-42. if simple rules are desired, treat unarmored ships as having an Armor Rating of 60; each level of High Gaurd Armor Factor increases this by 3 (i.e. a ship with a HG Armor Factor of 3 has 69 Armor in this system); All ship weapons used in planetary ranges (as opposed to Ortillery) use the normal planetary combat system with the Gunnery (Ship Weapons) skill and the Dexterity attribute, but a DM of +2 instead of any range modifier (to account for ship-grade fire control systems); basic Ship missiles have a Penetration of 75 and use Shotgun Group Hit rules; Ship Beam Lasers have a Penetration of 70; Ship Pulse Lasers have a Penetration of 75; Ship Plasma Weapons have a Penetration of 80 hand use Shotgun Group Hit Rules; Ship Fusion Weapons have a Penetration of 100.

Flame Weapons
Light Flamer (1,250 grams loaded; Cr525; TL8): A light flame-throwing weapon operating by pumping highly flammable fuel from its small fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. The fuel is usually synthetic, though hydrocarbons might be in use on certain worlds. A fuel tank holding sufficient fuel for 4 combat rounds of continued operation is inserted into the weapon forward of the trigger guard. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. Light Flamer fuel, but not the fuel tank, is interchangeable with that of Flamer Rifles.
Length: 250mm, Weight, Unloaded: 1,000 grams (a full fuel tank weights 250 grams). Base price: Cr300 (full fuel tank: Cr20). Tech Level 8.

Flamer Rifle (4,500 grams loaded; Cr1,750; TL8): A heavy version of the Light Flamer, the Flamer Rifle operates by pumping highly flammable fuel from its small fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. The fuel is usually synthetic, though hydrocarbons might be in use on certain worlds. A fuel tank holding sufficient fuel for 8 combat rounds of continued operation is inserted into the weapon forward of the trigger guard. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. Flamer Rifle fuel, but not the fuel tank, is interchangeable with that of Light Flamers. Flamer Rifles are equipped with slings to allow ease of carrying.
Length: 750mm, Weight, Unloaded: 4,000 grams (a full fuel tank weights 500 grams). Base price: Cr1,750 (full fuel tank: Cr40). Tech Level 8.

Flamethrower (8,000 grams, including fuel tanks; Cr2,250; TL5): A massive flame-throwing weapon, the Flamethrower operates by pumping highly flammable fuel from a pair of back-mounted fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. At the TL of its introduction, the fuel is made of refined natural hydrocarbons; later versions (TL8+) may use synthetic fuels. Two heavy fuel tanks holding sufficient fuel for 30 combat rounds of continued operation are carried on the user's back. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. The fuel tanks are connected to the Flamethrower with a flexible heavy-duty hose. Flamethrower fuel is rarely interchangeable with that of other flame weapons.
Length: 750mm, Weight of Flamethrower: 2,000 grams. Weight of fuel tanks: 6,000 grams. Base price: Cr2,250 (extra pair fuel tanks: Cr500). Tech Level 5.

Flame Weapon Penetration:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Weapon Penetration
Light Flamer 2
Flamer Rifle 5
Flamethrower 8</pre>[/QUOTE]Flame Weapon Range Modifiers
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Weapon Close Short Medium Long VeryLong
Light Flamer +1 +2 -5 NO NO
Flamer Rifle -4 +2 -3 NO NO
Flamethrower -4 +2 0 NO NO</pre>[/QUOTE]All flame weapons operate in a similar manner – by projecting a stream of flaming liquid towards their target – and therefore use the same set of rules:

1) Ammunition: While Flame Weapons use streams of highly flammable liquid (ignited when it leaves the muzzle) they are treated, for gameplay purposes, as if they shoot a single "shot" per round; a Fuel Tank attached to such a weapon holds a specific number of such "shots".

2) All wounds caused by Flame Weapons are one level more severe that usual (i.e. a "Scratch" result becomes "Light Wound" etc).

3) Group Hits by Flame Weapons: Each "shot" by a Flame Weapon may attack up to three additional individuals adjacent to the original target, provided that they are in a group (herd, pack, band, etc) and are each Human-sized or smaller. In addition, when firing against flying targets (winged animals, flying vehicles) within Close, Short or Medium range, a DM of +2 is allowed.

4) Hits to Flame Weapon Fuel Tanks: Flame Weapons are fueled by tanks containing highly flammable liquid; direct hits to these tanks will cause them to implode. However, since Light Flamers and Flame Rifles use small fuel tanks which are attached beneath them rather than on the user's back, they are very unlikely to be hit by shots or swings generally aimed at him; instead, whenever the user is caught in the blast radius of a Shotgun, another Flame Weapon, a Plasma or Fusion weapon or an explosion, roll 11+ for the fuel tank to explode, causing double normal weapon to their user. On the other hand, Flamethrowers are fueled by large, back-mounted fuel tanks; every shot fired at their user might hit them as well. Whenever a Flamethrower's user is hit in combat, roll 10+ for his tanks to explode, causing double normal damage to the user.

5) Aiming directly at Flame Weapon Fuel Tanks: Considering the previous rule, the fuel tanks used by Flame Weapons make lucrative targets, and characters may attempt to aim at them directly. Since Light Flamers and Flame Rifles use small fuel tanks which are attached beneath them, these tanks incur a -6 DM to hit. On the other hand, aiming at a Flamethrower's fuel tanks is not very difficult, incurring only a -2 DM to hit. If a shot misses the tank, it may still hit the weapon's bearer; in such a case, roll an attack against him as usual.

 

[Golan2072]

My Approach (based on my task system):
A) Initiative rolled once per participant per combat at the beginning of the combat; roll Tactics Skill+Initiative DM+1d6; Leadership skill allows a character with both Tactics and Leadership to bestow his initiative to three people besides him per level in Leadership skill. Initiative DM should be listed on the character sheet and calculated as following during chargen/stat changes:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Condition DM
DEX 4- -2
DEX 5-7 -1
DEX 8-11 +1
DEX 12+ +2
INT 4- -2
INT 5-7 -1
INT 8-11 +1
INT 12+ +2</pre>[/QUOTE]Initiative is re-rolled if codtitions warrant it (i.e. a new group enters the combat, troops dismount from vehicle etc).

B) Attack Sequence (one per round):
B-1) Attack Roll as per my task system.
B-2) Damage Roll on the appropriate (Personnel or Vehicle) Damage Table.


I am also in favor of abandoning the "first hit in combat is more deadly than other hits" LBB1 rule; instead, shooting/swinging at a surprised target should give a positive DM to the attacker.

Penetration and Armor values are from Striker and should fall within "proper use" guidelines; I use the "effective range" values as longer range attenuation is subsumed into negative range DMs.

Attack Roll:

Positive DMs+2d6-Negative DMs; roll 8+ to hit.

Range modifiers are according to LBB1 p.46 and might be either positive or negative, depending on weapon and range.

Positive DMs:
+Weapon Skill
+1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8+
+2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 12+
+1 if the target is large (from horse to light tank size)
+2 if the target is huge (MBT to 200 dton ship).
+3 if the target is a 200+ dton ship.

Negative DMs:
-2 if Obscuration/Smoke exists
-4 if in darkness without night vision/thermo/light source
-2 if the target is evading
-1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8-
-2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 4-
-2 if the attacker is running
-1 if the target is small (dog sized or less)

Damage Roll:

2d6+Penetration+Skill-Armor; then consult the following table:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 or less No Effect
3 exactly Scratch
4-6 Light Wound
7-8 Medium Wound
9-11 Serious Wound
12-15 Death
16+ Utterly Destroyed</pre>[/QUOTE]Penetration
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Laser Pistol 4
Laser Carbine 7
Laser Rifle 9
PGMP-12 20
PGMP-13 25
PGMP-14 25
FGMP-14 34
FGMP-15 34
Revolver 1
Autopistol 1
Body Pistol 0
Snub P. (HE) 1
Snub P. (HEAP) 6
Gauss Pistol 4
SMG 2
Shotgun 1 (additional damage rules needed)
Carbine 2
Rifle 3
Auto-Rifle 3
Assault Rifle 3
Accelerator R. 1
ACR (Slugs) 4
ACR (DS) 6
ACR (HE) 3
Gauss Rifle 7
LAG (HE) 3
LAG (KEAP) 8
LAG (Flechette) 2 (additional damage rules needed)
LMG 3
MMG 3
HMG 6
VRF Gauss Gun 21

Claws 3
Teeth 4
Horns 5
Hooves 4
Stinger 5
Thrasher 8
Hands 1
Club 2
Dagger 2
Blade 3
Foil 3
Cutlass 3
Sword 4
Broadsword 7
Hand Axe 6
Battleaxe 8
Bayonet 3
Spear 3
Halberd 5
Pike 2
Staff/Cudgel 2</pre>[/QUOTE]Armor Values
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Jack 1 (against melee only)
Mesh 2
Cloth 5
Flak Jacket 3
Ablat 1 (6 against lasers)
Reflec 10 (against lasers only)
CES 6
Vacc Suit 5
Combat armor 10
Battledress 10</pre>[/QUOTE]Wound Accumulation:
5 (untreated) Scratches become one Light Wound; 4 Light wounds become one Medium Wound; 3 Medium Wouds become a Serious Wound; 2 Serious Wounds becomes a Death result.

Wound Effects
Scratch: No Effect (other than accumulation).
Light Wound: -1 DM to all tasks per Light wound recieved.
Medium Wound: Unconsciousness; one characteristic treated as zero.
Serious Wound: Unconscious; Unstable; two characteristics treated as zero; will die from shock/blood loss in 6d6 minutes if not Stabilized (a Medic (DEX, Average) task).
Death: Acutely and critically wounded; considered dead for all purpuses if extensive medical help (a Medic (DEX, Extreme) task) is not given within 1d6 COMBAT TURNS, and even then recovery is not always guaranteed.
Utterly Destroyed: Roll a new character Period.

Diagnosing and Treating Wounds:
Diagnosing a normal wound is a Medic (INT, Average) task. The referee rolls secretly; success means the accurate wound level is given to the player; failure means that no result is given; a modified roll of 3 or less means that the Referee gives inaccurate data to the player (changing the results one level up or down). Diagnosing poisoning/disease is usually a Medic (EDU, Formidable) task.

Each wound level has a corresponding difficulty level to treat:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Scratch Easy (4+)
Light Wound Average (8+)
Medium Wound Formidable (12+)
Serious Wound Extreme (16+)
Death Hopeless (20+)</pre>[/QUOTE]Recovery:
Recovery is possible once combat has been concluded. Attributes that were "reduced to zero" by combat return to half of their full value after the combat in all cases but a Death result (though Seriously Wounded characters remain unconscious even after stabilization, until treated). Recovery is as listed below (in all cases, a modified task roll result of 2- makes the wound ONE LEVEL WORSE):

Scratch: A Medic (INT, Easy, 10min) task "removes" all scratches for the purpouse of play; this includes sanitizing the scratches, putting antisceptic (sp?) and a bandaids on them; a minimal medical kit (not even an LBB3 MedKit, just a simple first aid kit) is enough for this purpose; if no such aid is given, the scratches are "removed" for all game purposes within one day of full rest.

Light Wound: A Medic (INT, Average, 30min) task and one full day of rest, or three days of full rest (without the treatment) "remove" all Light Wounds and their penalties. A standard Medkit is required for this treatment.

Medium Wound: A Medic (INT, Formidable, 1hour) task and 1d6 days of full rest, or 6d6 days of full rest without the treatment allow the character to recover from Medium Wounds. A MedKit is the bare minimum required for such treatment, though a Basic Facility (i.e. the basic medlab subsumed into the stateroom cost of starships or an avarage community clinic of TL7+ or a TL5+ hospital) would be desired for easier treatment (in game terms: equipment DMs).

Serious Wound: Only a Medic (INT, Extreme, 1day) task performed in atleast a Standard Facility (a specially bought ship Medlab module or a small TL5+ hospital) can allow the recovery of a Seriously Wounded character; the task could be repeated by each time with a -1 DM. Afterwards, the character must rest for 1d6 weeks to fully recover.

Death Result: A character who has recieved a Death Wound and was stabilized could be treated; this treatment must begin within 6 hours after the combat or the character dies (cold sleep could suspend this indefinitely); the treatment must be given in an Extensive Facility (hospital ship or large TL7+ hospital). Failure in this task kills the character. If the treatment succeeds, PERMANENTLY reduce 1d6-(TL abouve 10) from each of the chatacter's attributes; if an attribute is reduced to zero in this way, the character dies. The TL refers to that of the Extended Facility.

Utterly Destroyed: You're kidding, right?

Medical Equipment DMs
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">No Equipment -4
Improvised Equipment -2
Standard MedKit 0
Basic Facility +2
Standard Facility +4
Extended Facility +6
If equipment TL4- -4
If equipment TL5 -2
If equipment TL6 -1
If equipment TL7-9 0
If equipment TL10-11 +1
If equipment TL12-14 +2
If equipment TL15+ +4</pre>[/QUOTE]And yes, a TL15 hospital will make most kinds of medical treatment EXTREMELY EASY. Especially with a well-trained staff. The thing is that most adventurers/soldiers/mercenaries will get wounded quite far away from such a hospital...

Additional Combat rules and Rulings

Automatic Fire
As in LBB4 PP.31-32, though only the two-hit chances (as shown in the LBB1 and 4 range tables) are affected by autofire DMs; Penetration is not. Additional attacks and group hits are as given in these pages. Fully-automatic flechette/shotgun weapons use the Shotgun Group Hit rules, as in LBB1 P.42 rather than the Autofire Group Hit rules in either LBB.

Shotguns/Flechette
All wounds recieved from shotgun/flechette rounds and considered one level higher than normal, e.g. Scratch becomes Light wound, Light Wound becomed Medium Wound etc. Note that even though this rule makes these weapons quite devastating, their penetration is typically extremely low, which means that they are mostly effective against unarmored and lightly armored opponents. Other than that, shotguns perform as described in LBB1 P.42.

Explosive (HE/HEAP) Rounds
Explosives and explosive rounds (HE. HEAP, grenades etc) always cause TWO wounds of the same kind ("No Effect" remains "No Effect") - for example, a HE round hits a character; a modified result of 7 is rolled on the Damage Table; therefor, the character recieves two Medium Wounds. For grenades this rule only exists for direct hits rather than group hit results (i.e. adjacent to the target).

Grenades and Bombs
Hand grenades are thrown as a Throwing (DEX, Avarage) task, have no range modifiers and may only hit targets in Medium range or less (but if a grenade is thrown at a target in close or short range, the thrower gets hit as well...); RAM/Launcher grenades use the range modifiers as in LBB4; all grenades cause additional damage to their main target as the HE/HEAP rounds described abouve; they also hit (but only ONCE) all targets within a tight group with the main target (within Close or Short range of him); their penetration is presented here:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Grenade Penetration
HE Hand 9
HEAP Hand 18
HE RAM 9
HEAP RAM 28
Flechette RAM 2 (uses Flechette damage rules)</pre>[/QUOTE]Plasma and Fusion long-range hits
Plasma and Fusion shots use the LBB1 P.42 Group Hits by Shotguns rules.

Zero-G and Vaccuum Combat
In addition to the Zero-G combat rules in LBB4 P.16 and P.32, any wounds recieved by a character (wearing a protective suit, otherwise he won't be alive anyway) in a vaccuum, corrosive or insidious environment are considered as one level higher than usual; this is cumulative with the shotgun/flechette rules.

Structural Damage and Demolition
Walls, doors and other structural features have both an armor rating and an integrity rating; hitting them is usually not a problem (as they are big and stationary) unless the range is Long or more (then use the normal to-hit procedure with a +2 DM). The armor rating is reduced from a weapon's penetration value, and any remaining penetration is substracted from the integrity rating; if the penetration is lower than the structural armor rating, no damage is done to the structural feature. Structural integrity damage is cumulative; even A SINGLE POINT of structural integrity damage compromises pressure integrity (i.e. causes decompression if the door/wall holds pressure); a 1.5m wide and 3m high hole is created by reducing a feature's structural integrity to zero. So here are a few structural features commonly encountered by Travellers:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Feature Armor Integrity
Normal Door 2 5
Thin Wooden Wall 1 5
Thick Wooden Wall 4 20
Brick Wall 8 30
Concrete Wall 15 50
Heavy Concrete Wall 28 75
Non-Ship Steel Wall 20 50
Ship Interior Wall 2 25
Iris Valve 5 25
Bulkhead/Hatch 10 100
Unarmored Ship Hull 60(?) 250</pre>[/QUOTE]Note that explosives (HE and HEAP) and Energy weapons (Plasma, Fusion or Laser) cause double structural damage (after armor has been substracted from it, ofcourse).

Also note that outside of combat, there is no problem hitting a structural feature from Medium or shorter range; to find out how quickly a weapon will bring down a structural feature, divide the Structural Integrity rating by the effective (i.e. after the substraction of armor) penetration of the weapon to get a number of 15-second combat turns.

Ships and the Combat System
For detailed rules, see Striker Book 2 PP.41-42. if simple rules are desired, treat unarmored ships as having an Armor Rating of 60; each level of High Gaurd Armor Factor increases this by 3 (i.e. a ship with a HG Armor Factor of 3 has 69 Armor in this system); All ship weapons used in planetary ranges (as opposed to Ortillery) use the normal planetary combat system with the Gunnery (Ship Weapons) skill and the Dexterity attribute, but a DM of +2 instead of any range modifier (to account for ship-grade fire control systems); basic Ship missiles have a Penetration of 75 and use Shotgun Group Hit rules; Ship Beam Lasers have a Penetration of 70; Ship Pulse Lasers have a Penetration of 75; Ship Plasma Weapons have a Penetration of 80 hand use Shotgun Group Hit Rules; Ship Fusion Weapons have a Penetration of 100.

Flame Weapons
Light Flamer (1,250 grams loaded; Cr525; TL8): A light flame-throwing weapon operating by pumping highly flammable fuel from its small fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. The fuel is usually synthetic, though hydrocarbons might be in use on certain worlds. A fuel tank holding sufficient fuel for 4 combat rounds of continued operation is inserted into the weapon forward of the trigger guard. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. Light Flamer fuel, but not the fuel tank, is interchangeable with that of Flamer Rifles.
Length: 250mm, Weight, Unloaded: 1,000 grams (a full fuel tank weights 250 grams). Base price: Cr300 (full fuel tank: Cr20). Tech Level 8.

Flamer Rifle (4,500 grams loaded; Cr1,750; TL8): A heavy version of the Light Flamer, the Flamer Rifle operates by pumping highly flammable fuel from its small fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. The fuel is usually synthetic, though hydrocarbons might be in use on certain worlds. A fuel tank holding sufficient fuel for 8 combat rounds of continued operation is inserted into the weapon forward of the trigger guard. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. Flamer Rifle fuel, but not the fuel tank, is interchangeable with that of Light Flamers. Flamer Rifles are equipped with slings to allow ease of carrying.
Length: 750mm, Weight, Unloaded: 4,000 grams (a full fuel tank weights 500 grams). Base price: Cr1,750 (full fuel tank: Cr40). Tech Level 8.

Flamethrower (8,000 grams, including fuel tanks; Cr2,250; TL5): A massive flame-throwing weapon, the Flamethrower operates by pumping highly flammable fuel from a pair of back-mounted fuel tank, igniting it near the nozzle and projecting a stream of fuel towards the target. At the TL of its introduction, the fuel is made of refined natural hydrocarbons; later versions (TL8+) may use synthetic fuels. Two heavy fuel tanks holding sufficient fuel for 30 combat rounds of continued operation are carried on the user's back. While the weapon fires a continuous stream of flaming fuel, it is considered (for game purposes) as firing one "shot" per round. Replacement of an empty fuel tank requires one combat round. The fuel tanks are connected to the Flamethrower with a flexible heavy-duty hose. Flamethrower fuel is rarely interchangeable with that of other flame weapons.
Length: 750mm, Weight of Flamethrower: 2,000 grams. Weight of fuel tanks: 6,000 grams. Base price: Cr2,250 (extra pair fuel tanks: Cr500). Tech Level 5.

Flame Weapon Penetration:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Weapon Penetration
Light Flamer 2
Flamer Rifle 5
Flamethrower 8</pre>[/QUOTE]Flame Weapon Range Modifiers
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Weapon Close Short Medium Long VeryLong
Light Flamer +1 +2 -5 NO NO
Flamer Rifle -4 +2 -3 NO NO
Flamethrower -4 +2 0 NO NO</pre>[/QUOTE]All flame weapons operate in a similar manner – by projecting a stream of flaming liquid towards their target – and therefore use the same set of rules:

1) Ammunition: While Flame Weapons use streams of highly flammable liquid (ignited when it leaves the muzzle) they are treated, for gameplay purposes, as if they shoot a single "shot" per round; a Fuel Tank attached to such a weapon holds a specific number of such "shots".

2) All wounds caused by Flame Weapons are one level more severe that usual (i.e. a "Scratch" result becomes "Light Wound" etc).

3) Group Hits by Flame Weapons: Each "shot" by a Flame Weapon may attack up to three additional individuals adjacent to the original target, provided that they are in a group (herd, pack, band, etc) and are each Human-sized or smaller. In addition, when firing against flying targets (winged animals, flying vehicles) within Close, Short or Medium range, a DM of +2 is allowed.

4) Hits to Flame Weapon Fuel Tanks: Flame Weapons are fueled by tanks containing highly flammable liquid; direct hits to these tanks will cause them to implode. However, since Light Flamers and Flame Rifles use small fuel tanks which are attached beneath them rather than on the user's back, they are very unlikely to be hit by shots or swings generally aimed at him; instead, whenever the user is caught in the blast radius of a Shotgun, another Flame Weapon, a Plasma or Fusion weapon or an explosion, roll 11+ for the fuel tank to explode, causing double normal weapon to their user. On the other hand, Flamethrowers are fueled by large, back-mounted fuel tanks; every shot fired at their user might hit them as well. Whenever a Flamethrower's user is hit in combat, roll 10+ for his tanks to explode, causing double normal damage to the user.

5) Aiming directly at Flame Weapon Fuel Tanks: Considering the previous rule, the fuel tanks used by Flame Weapons make lucrative targets, and characters may attempt to aim at them directly. Since Light Flamers and Flame Rifles use small fuel tanks which are attached beneath them, these tanks incur a -6 DM to hit. On the other hand, aiming at a Flamethrower's fuel tanks is not very difficult, incurring only a -2 DM to hit. If a shot misses the tank, it may still hit the weapon's bearer; in such a case, roll an attack against him as usual.

 

[Golan2072]

Rationale: Not much rules for basic combat; two 2d6 rolls per attack on personnel (to-hit and damage; a roll to three more if a vehicle/robot is attacked), combat requires character and NPC sheets and only one table (the damage table abouve, and two tables needed if vehicles/robots are involved).

Several simple tables are consulted on chargen/the purchase of new weapons/armor only (LBB1 or LBB4 range matrixes and the abouve Penetration and Armor tables) with the relevant values and them alone listed on the character sheet (armor rating only for armor; the five range modifiers, penetration, skill DM and attribute DM for weapons). Only the character/NPC sheets (I'll make ones which will include the damage table on them) and the dice are nescery for personnel combat - no page flipping, no matrixing. The only artimetic procedure needed is the substraction and addition of a few small numbers.

Special rules apply to special situations; I'll add a small "notes" space on the character sheet so the player could note, for example, the relevant autofire rules if he has an SMG. Structural damage is relevant only if the players want to blow a hole in a wall or to burst open a locked door. And so on. But the basic, people-gunning-at-people or people-hitting-people combat should be easy to learn and use. VERY easy.

 

[Golan2072]

Rationale: Not much rules for basic combat; two 2d6 rolls per attack on personnel (to-hit and damage; a roll to three more if a vehicle/robot is attacked), combat requires character and NPC sheets and only one table (the damage table abouve, and two tables needed if vehicles/robots are involved).

Several simple tables are consulted on chargen/the purchase of new weapons/armor only (LBB1 or LBB4 range matrixes and the abouve Penetration and Armor tables) with the relevant values and them alone listed on the character sheet (armor rating only for armor; the five range modifiers, penetration, skill DM and attribute DM for weapons). Only the character/NPC sheets (I'll make ones which will include the damage table on them) and the dice are nescery for personnel combat - no page flipping, no matrixing. The only artimetic procedure needed is the substraction and addition of a few small numbers.

Special rules apply to special situations; I'll add a small "notes" space on the character sheet so the player could note, for example, the relevant autofire rules if he has an SMG. Structural damage is relevant only if the players want to blow a hole in a wall or to burst open a locked door. And so on. But the basic, people-gunning-at-people or people-hitting-people combat should be easy to learn and use. VERY easy.

 

[Golan2072]

About ground/grav/water/air vehicles, which would you prefer:

1) An abstract damage system as the personnel damage system (or Shadowrun vehicle rules)? That is, vehicle damage listed on the scale of "scratch-light damage-medium damage-serious damage-wreck-destroyed"?

or

2) A table-based, location-based system as in LBB2 (ships) LBB8 (Robots) or in MT (vehicles and robots)?

The first system is far easier to learn and use, meshes well with the personnel combat system and allows quick conversion to the Task System for the purposes of repair (Scratch is an Easy task to repair, Light Damage is Average, Medium Damage is Formidable, Serious Damage is Extreme and Wreck is Hopeless to repair; you can't repair a Destroyed vehicle). Its main disadvantage is the lack of varied details.

The second system meshes well with the starship combat system, is far more varied and yealds interesting results, but is more difficult to learn, requires more tables and rolls and doesn't mesh well with the task system when repairs are required.

Which do you prefer?

 

[Golan2072]

About ground/grav/water/air vehicles, which would you prefer:

1) An abstract damage system as the personnel damage system (or Shadowrun vehicle rules)? That is, vehicle damage listed on the scale of "scratch-light damage-medium damage-serious damage-wreck-destroyed"?

or

2) A table-based, location-based system as in LBB2 (ships) LBB8 (Robots) or in MT (vehicles and robots)?

The first system is far easier to learn and use, meshes well with the personnel combat system and allows quick conversion to the Task System for the purposes of repair (Scratch is an Easy task to repair, Light Damage is Average, Medium Damage is Formidable, Serious Damage is Extreme and Wreck is Hopeless to repair; you can't repair a Destroyed vehicle). Its main disadvantage is the lack of varied details.

The second system meshes well with the starship combat system, is far more varied and yealds interesting results, but is more difficult to learn, requires more tables and rolls and doesn't mesh well with the task system when repairs are required.

Which do you prefer?

 

[mike wightman]

Here's where we got to with the last lot:

1) Initiative

This is determined by:

Dex/4 + highest relevant combat skill + 1d6

Put them in order of highest to lowest and then count down, highest initiative goes first – a tie is simultaneous - "who has twelve? go" "who has eleven? go" etc.

When a character reaches his initiative segment, he may opt to hold his action until later, i.e. he waits until someone else's action and expends it then – just before they act.

There are several permitted actions during a combat turn, examples include:

snapshot - can move and fire - effective range is reduced to Dex in metres, regardless of weapon type

aimed shot – may make a up to a half move - use task/range of weapon or weapon+sight

prepared shot - spend a turn aiming and reduce the task difficulty of your next aimed attack by one level

2) To hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> effective
C S M L VL
natural 8 8 - - - includes daggers, blades, broken bottles etc.
melee 12 8 - - -
handguns 8 8 8 12 16
carbines 12 8 8 12 16 includes smgs, assault rifles
w/sight 12 8 8 8 12
rifle 12 8 8 8 12
w/sight 12 8 8 8 8</pre>[/QUOTE](all longarms are effectively at -4 to hit if within close melee range of your target)

you only get the sight benefit with an aimed, or a prepared, shot.

increase the difficulty again for firing beyond very long range, up to the limit of the weapon.

Weapons can be aimed at unarmoured locations, or more vulnerable locations on whole suit armour, this raises the task by a difficulty level, but halves the AR – or ignores it if an unarmoured location is targeted.


3) Damage

Each weapon has a number of damage dice that are rolled on a successful hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">body pistol 3d
auto pistol 3d
revolver 3d
snub pistol – HEAP 4d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
laser pistol 3d

carbine 3d
smg 3d
laser carbine 4d

rifle 3d
shotgun 4d
autorifle 3d
assault rifle 3d
ACR - DS 3d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
Gauss Rifle 4d - ap
Accelerator Rifle 3d
laser rifle 5d
PGMP12 10d</pre>[/QUOTE]ap = armour piercing (AR is halved round down)
eb = explosive burst
HEAP rounds are armour piercing


Exceptional success (rolling 4 or higher over your target number) gets an additional damage die.

Burst fire adds two damage dice.

Explosive burst rounds get to add an additional damage die for each six rolled on the damage dice.

Armour subtracts from damage dice. On a successful hit roll damage dice, remove one damage die at a time for each point of effective AR until only one die of damage remains. Subtract any remaining AR points from the value of that last remaining die.

The dice should be removed lowest to highest.

Armour ARs are:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">jack (1)
mesh (2)
cloth 5
CEV 6
combat armour 10
ablat 1[6]</pre>[/QUOTE]() = AR is halved vs modern firearms
[] = AR applies vs lasers only

Any damage remaining is applied to the physical characteristics of the wounded party, with the controlling player deciding how the points are allocated.

Strength - damage to muscle
Dexterity - damage to sensory and nervous system
Endurance - organ damage, blood loss


An exceptional success cause all damage to a single characteristic, determined randomly. This represents the massive trauma that can occur if something vital is hit:

Strength - bone hit
Dexterity - head/spine hit
Endurance - major organ punctured/nicked artery

 

[mike wightman]

Here's where we got to with the last lot:

1) Initiative

This is determined by:

Dex/4 + highest relevant combat skill + 1d6

Put them in order of highest to lowest and then count down, highest initiative goes first – a tie is simultaneous - "who has twelve? go" "who has eleven? go" etc.

When a character reaches his initiative segment, he may opt to hold his action until later, i.e. he waits until someone else's action and expends it then – just before they act.

There are several permitted actions during a combat turn, examples include:

snapshot - can move and fire - effective range is reduced to Dex in metres, regardless of weapon type

aimed shot – may make a up to a half move - use task/range of weapon or weapon+sight

prepared shot - spend a turn aiming and reduce the task difficulty of your next aimed attack by one level

2) To hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> effective
C S M L VL
natural 8 8 - - - includes daggers, blades, broken bottles etc.
melee 12 8 - - -
handguns 8 8 8 12 16
carbines 12 8 8 12 16 includes smgs, assault rifles
w/sight 12 8 8 8 12
rifle 12 8 8 8 12
w/sight 12 8 8 8 8</pre>[/QUOTE](all longarms are effectively at -4 to hit if within close melee range of your target)

you only get the sight benefit with an aimed, or a prepared, shot.

increase the difficulty again for firing beyond very long range, up to the limit of the weapon.

Weapons can be aimed at unarmoured locations, or more vulnerable locations on whole suit armour, this raises the task by a difficulty level, but halves the AR – or ignores it if an unarmoured location is targeted.


3) Damage

Each weapon has a number of damage dice that are rolled on a successful hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">body pistol 3d
auto pistol 3d
revolver 3d
snub pistol – HEAP 4d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
laser pistol 3d

carbine 3d
smg 3d
laser carbine 4d

rifle 3d
shotgun 4d
autorifle 3d
assault rifle 3d
ACR - DS 3d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
Gauss Rifle 4d - ap
Accelerator Rifle 3d
laser rifle 5d
PGMP12 10d</pre>[/QUOTE]ap = armour piercing (AR is halved round down)
eb = explosive burst
HEAP rounds are armour piercing


Exceptional success (rolling 4 or higher over your target number) gets an additional damage die.

Burst fire adds two damage dice.

Explosive burst rounds get to add an additional damage die for each six rolled on the damage dice.

Armour subtracts from damage dice. On a successful hit roll damage dice, remove one damage die at a time for each point of effective AR until only one die of damage remains. Subtract any remaining AR points from the value of that last remaining die.

The dice should be removed lowest to highest.

Armour ARs are:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">jack (1)
mesh (2)
cloth 5
CEV 6
combat armour 10
ablat 1[6]</pre>[/QUOTE]() = AR is halved vs modern firearms
[] = AR applies vs lasers only

Any damage remaining is applied to the physical characteristics of the wounded party, with the controlling player deciding how the points are allocated.

Strength - damage to muscle
Dexterity - damage to sensory and nervous system
Endurance - organ damage, blood loss


An exceptional success cause all damage to a single characteristic, determined randomly. This represents the massive trauma that can occur if something vital is hit:

Strength - bone hit
Dexterity - head/spine hit
Endurance - major organ punctured/nicked artery

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:

3) Damage

Each weapon has a number of damage dice that are rolled on a successful hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">body pistol 3d
auto pistol 3d
revolver 3d
snub pistol – HEAP 4d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
laser pistol 3d

carbine 3d
smg 3d
laser carbine 4d

rifle 3d
shotgun 4d
autorifle 3d
assault rifle 3d
ACR - DS 3d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
Gauss Rifle 4d - ap
Accelerator Rifle 3d
laser rifle 5d
PGMP12 10d</pre>

ap = armour piercing (AR is halved round down)
eb = explosive burst
HEAP rounds are armour piercing


Exceptional success (rolling 4 or higher over your target number) gets an additional damage die.

Burst fire adds two damage dice.

Explosive burst rounds get to add an additional damage die for each six rolled on the damage dice.

Armour subtracts from damage dice. On a successful hit roll damage dice, remove one damage die at a time for each point of effective AR until only one die of damage remains. Subtract any remaining AR points from the value of that last remaining die.

The dice should be removed lowest to highest.

Armour ARs are:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">jack (1)
mesh (2)
cloth 5
CEV 6
combat armour 10
ablat 1[6]</pre>[/QUOTE]() = AR is halved vs modern firearms
[] = AR applies vs lasers only

Any damage remaining is applied to the physical characteristics of the wounded party, with the controlling player deciding how the points are allocated.

Strength - damage to muscle
Dexterity - damage to sensory and nervous system
Endurance - organ damage, blood loss


An exceptional success cause all damage to a single characteristic, determined randomly. This represents the massive trauma that can occur if something vital is hit:

Strength - bone hit
Dexterity - head/spine hit
Endurance - major organ punctured/nicked artery [/quote]I think I'll switch over from my complicated "Striker Light" system to your damage system, but still use my "To-Hit" system. That is, To-Hit will be:

Originally posted by SEmployee 2-4601 :

Attack Roll:

Positive DMs+2d6-Negative DMs; roll 8+ to hit.

Range modifiers are according to LBB1 p.46 and might be either positive or negative, depending on weapon and range.

Positive DMs:
+Weapon Skill
+1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8+
+2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 12+
+1 if the target is large (from horse to light tank size)
+2 if the target is huge (MBT to 200 dton ship).
+3 if the target is a 200+ dton ship.

Negative DMs:
-2 if Obscuration/Smoke exists
-4 if in darkness without night vision/thermo/light source
-2 if the target is evading
-1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8-
-2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 4-
-2 if the attacker is running
-1 if the target is small (dog sized or less)

Then damage will be applied as you've suggested, i.e. by dice and with AR removing dice, but without the CT LBB1 "First Blood" rule which I dislike.

Vehicle/ship combat will be similar, with appropriately higher damage and AR values (double/triple HG Armor to get AR?); however, if the AR of a vehicle/ship equals or exceeds the number of dice, the armor stops the attack completely. Each remaining die warrants one roll on either a vehicle damage table I'll create (for vehicles) or the LBB2 tables (for ships). In addition, each vehicle/ship will have Structural Integrity, dependent on size, which could go down on most structure/hull hits; if it goes to zero, BOOM. So, for example, a dagger won't damage a car or a tank but will wound (or even kill) an unarmored person; a pistol or rifle will damage a car (and possibly even cause subsystem damage) but will not harm a tank; a direct hit with a bazooka will rip an unarmored (and probably also armored) person apart, will cause extensive (multi-subsystem) damage to a car (if not blow it apart) and cause moderate damage to a tank (one or two subsystems, especially a low-tech bazooka with a modern tank, as opposed to high-tech anti-armor missiles).

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:

3) Damage

Each weapon has a number of damage dice that are rolled on a successful hit
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">body pistol 3d
auto pistol 3d
revolver 3d
snub pistol – HEAP 4d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
laser pistol 3d

carbine 3d
smg 3d
laser carbine 4d

rifle 3d
shotgun 4d
autorifle 3d
assault rifle 3d
ACR - DS 3d - ap
- HE 4d - eb
Gauss Rifle 4d - ap
Accelerator Rifle 3d
laser rifle 5d
PGMP12 10d</pre>

ap = armour piercing (AR is halved round down)
eb = explosive burst
HEAP rounds are armour piercing


Exceptional success (rolling 4 or higher over your target number) gets an additional damage die.

Burst fire adds two damage dice.

Explosive burst rounds get to add an additional damage die for each six rolled on the damage dice.

Armour subtracts from damage dice. On a successful hit roll damage dice, remove one damage die at a time for each point of effective AR until only one die of damage remains. Subtract any remaining AR points from the value of that last remaining die.

The dice should be removed lowest to highest.

Armour ARs are:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">jack (1)
mesh (2)
cloth 5
CEV 6
combat armour 10
ablat 1[6]</pre>[/QUOTE]() = AR is halved vs modern firearms
[] = AR applies vs lasers only

Any damage remaining is applied to the physical characteristics of the wounded party, with the controlling player deciding how the points are allocated.

Strength - damage to muscle
Dexterity - damage to sensory and nervous system
Endurance - organ damage, blood loss


An exceptional success cause all damage to a single characteristic, determined randomly. This represents the massive trauma that can occur if something vital is hit:

Strength - bone hit
Dexterity - head/spine hit
Endurance - major organ punctured/nicked artery [/quote]I think I'll switch over from my complicated "Striker Light" system to your damage system, but still use my "To-Hit" system. That is, To-Hit will be:

Originally posted by SEmployee 2-4601 :

Attack Roll:

Positive DMs+2d6-Negative DMs; roll 8+ to hit.

Range modifiers are according to LBB1 p.46 and might be either positive or negative, depending on weapon and range.

Positive DMs:
+Weapon Skill
+1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8+
+2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 12+
+1 if the target is large (from horse to light tank size)
+2 if the target is huge (MBT to 200 dton ship).
+3 if the target is a 200+ dton ship.

Negative DMs:
-2 if Obscuration/Smoke exists
-4 if in darkness without night vision/thermo/light source
-2 if the target is evading
-1 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 8-
-2 if DEX (ranged) or STR (melee) is 4-
-2 if the attacker is running
-1 if the target is small (dog sized or less)

Then damage will be applied as you've suggested, i.e. by dice and with AR removing dice, but without the CT LBB1 "First Blood" rule which I dislike.

Vehicle/ship combat will be similar, with appropriately higher damage and AR values (double/triple HG Armor to get AR?); however, if the AR of a vehicle/ship equals or exceeds the number of dice, the armor stops the attack completely. Each remaining die warrants one roll on either a vehicle damage table I'll create (for vehicles) or the LBB2 tables (for ships). In addition, each vehicle/ship will have Structural Integrity, dependent on size, which could go down on most structure/hull hits; if it goes to zero, BOOM. So, for example, a dagger won't damage a car or a tank but will wound (or even kill) an unarmored person; a pistol or rifle will damage a car (and possibly even cause subsystem damage) but will not harm a tank; a direct hit with a bazooka will rip an unarmored (and probably also armored) person apart, will cause extensive (multi-subsystem) damage to a car (if not blow it apart) and cause moderate damage to a tank (one or two subsystems, especially a low-tech bazooka with a modern tank, as opposed to high-tech anti-armor missiles).

 

[mike wightman]

Hmm, we should really try to come up with a way to scale things between charcters - vehicles - starships.

 

[mike wightman]

Hmm, we should really try to come up with a way to scale things between charcters - vehicles - starships.

 

[Golan2072]

Isn't my "one personnel damage dice = one vehicle damage table roll" and high vehicle AR a way to do so?

 

[Golan2072]

Isn't my "one personnel damage dice = one vehicle damage table roll" and high vehicle AR a way to do so?

 

[mike wightman]

Yes, I was just thinking of how to avoid having AR of 5-40 for vehicle scale and 40 plus for starships as it is in Striker an MT, and to a limited extent T4.

In T20 the AR for vehicles is effectively 10 higher against personal weapons, while vehicle weapons get an extra ten damage dice if firing at human scale targets.

Starships scale up the same way from vehicles to starships, personal weapons being totally ineffective against ships.

Could we just give vehicles AR 5-25 (AR max = 5 + TL), while ships go from 10 to 30 (AR max = 10 + TL)?

Then use your idea for one roll per damage die after armour has been subtracted.

 

[mike wightman]

Yes, I was just thinking of how to avoid having AR of 5-40 for vehicle scale and 40 plus for starships as it is in Striker an MT, and to a limited extent T4.

In T20 the AR for vehicles is effectively 10 higher against personal weapons, while vehicle weapons get an extra ten damage dice if firing at human scale targets.

Starships scale up the same way from vehicles to starships, personal weapons being totally ineffective against ships.

Could we just give vehicles AR 5-25 (AR max = 5 + TL), while ships go from 10 to 30 (AR max = 10 + TL)?

Then use your idea for one roll per damage die after armour has been subtracted.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
personal weapons being totally ineffective against ships.

A small craft shouldn't be much more armed than a tank. Anything that can kill a tank should be able to kill a small craft - shoulder-launched anti-armor missiles and heavy man-portable energy weapons included. Anything that can't hurt a tank won't hurt a small craft, though. Small craft with HG armor would be armored like the most armored grav-tanks in the setting, for the very least. So I think that small craft should be in the same category (or a similar one) with vehicles, and perhaps very small ships, too (100-400 dton?).

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
personal weapons being totally ineffective against ships.

A small craft shouldn't be much more armed than a tank. Anything that can kill a tank should be able to kill a small craft - shoulder-launched anti-armor missiles and heavy man-portable energy weapons included. Anything that can't hurt a tank won't hurt a small craft, though. Small craft with HG armor would be armored like the most armored grav-tanks in the setting, for the very least. So I think that small craft should be in the same category (or a similar one) with vehicles, and perhaps very small ships, too (100-400 dton?).