T20 Prestige Classes?
- Thread starter jimTE
- Start date
Nothing to stop you creating your own, a little imagination and the THB can go a long way you know
Anyway if past experience is anything to go by when a player says "I want to be a prestige class" they usually mean "I want to play a class that does 'this, this and this'" and most of the time the published prestige classes don't cover what the player wants so you either say "no, you can't have a prestige class character" or you end up creating such a prestige class yourself for the player in your game...
IMHO Prestige classes should be shoved down a dark hole... I've never viewed them as an aid to helping the player roleplay a character, the only thing I have seen them aid is munchkinism. Admittedly some classes in T20 (eg. psionicists and TAS reporters) work well as prestige classes but all in all I am not convinced.
G
LostWorldsMike
SOC-6
I'll go along with that to a point. I think most published Prestige classes are an aid to munchkinism - especially when taken out of the context for which they were created.
Ideally, PrCs are supposed to be used to flesh out a campaign setting. The TAS reporter does that, but a generic "Powered Armor Goon" PrC would be cheeseball.
The problem lies in publishers having to choose between making a book of PrCs usable in any campaign (and in doing so dilute the roleplaying aspects) and increasing the sales potential; or put together a book of PrCs that are specifically tied into a particular campaign setting (increasing their roleplaying potential), and limiting the book's usefulness to people who don't use that campaign setting.
Anywho. I'm just sayin' that it isn't the concept of PrCs that's flawed, rather it's that most (but not all) PrCs that we've been presented with don't live up to the idea's inherent potential.
notagoodusername
SOC-13
There are a few different takes on the Commando in this thread:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/cgi-bin/Trav/CotI/Discuss/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000428;p=2
I prefer mine, but hey, I would!
As a note, I see the commando as something very differet to the silent killer type classes that are most commonly found in books. There is a place for that type of class, but I don't thinkt hey are commandos in the true military sense of the term.
The other class in the thread is a good one, but falls more into the silent killer Jean-Claude Van Damn type (I tend to call them Black Ops for want of a better term).
Shane
http://www.travellerrpg.com/cgi-bin/Trav/CotI/Discuss/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000428;p=2
I prefer mine, but hey, I would!
As a note, I see the commando as something very differet to the silent killer type classes that are most commonly found in books. There is a place for that type of class, but I don't thinkt hey are commandos in the true military sense of the term.
The other class in the thread is a good one, but falls more into the silent killer Jean-Claude Van Damn type (I tend to call them Black Ops for want of a better term).
Shane
Commando Prestige Class - Revised
(Note: I got this most of this work from Reginald & Shane Mclean)
Here's my take on the Commando Prestige Class (Royal Marines / US Army Rangers -type game-ified a little).
Requirements: To become a Commando, a character must meet the following requirements:
Attributes: Strength 12+, Dexterity 12+, Constitution 14+, Intelligence 10+, Wisdom 10+
BAB: +3
Skills: Hide 3 ranks, Move Silently 3 ranks, Survival 4 ranks, Swim 2 ranks
Feats: Endurance
Other: Must have served at least one term in Army, Marines or Mercenary prior history
Stamina Dice: d10 + Con modifier per level
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Lvl BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 +1 +1 +1 +1 Feat (Alertness)
2 +2 +1 +1 +1 Trained Speciality
3 +3 +2 +2 +2 Feat (Improved Unarmed Strike)
4 +4 +2 +2 +2 Trained Speciality
5 +5 +3 +3 +3 Defensive Roll
6 +6 +3 +3 +3 Trained Speciality
7 +7 +4 +4 +4
8 +8 +4 +4 +4 Trained Speciality
9 +9 +5 +5 +5
10 +10 +5 +5 +5 Trained Speciality
</pre>[/QUOTE]Starting Feats:
Weapon Proficiency (Lasers)
Weapon Proficiency (Swordsman)
Abilites:
Trained Speciality - Many Commandos learn specialised skills useful in thier mission, and cross-train with those in thier team. The Commando receives a Feat or Ability dependant upon his specialisation (must be respective of prerequesites). The same speciality may not be selected twice.
Demolitions - Amount of damage to breach or destroy and object (see THB page 156) is reduced by 20%.
Forward Observer - +3 to Forward Observer and T/Comms skill rolls (must have Forward Observer skill)
Infiltrator - Stealthy Feat
Medic - Surgery Feat (must have T/Medical skill)
Leads the way - Improved Initiative Feat (must have Spot skill)
Point Man - Spot Trouble - The same as the Rogue class ability of the same name(must have Spot skill)
Rifleman - Rapid Shot Feat
Bullseye - Far Shot Feat
Signaller - EW Specialist Feat
Sniper - Sniper Feat
Deadly Striker - Improved Critical Feat
Assassin - Assassin Feat
Team Leader - Tactics Feat (must have Leader skill)
Defensive Roll - The same as the Mercenary class
ability of the same name
Class Skills:
Climb
Combat Engineering
Demolitions
Driving
Forward Observer
Hide
Intimidate
Intuit Direction
Jump
Leader
Listen
Move Silently
Navigation
Pilot
Search
Spot
Survival
Swim
Techincal (Communications, Computers, Medical, Sensors,)
Skill points: (5+Int Bonus) per level
Special:
If any levels of this Prestige Class are taken in Prior History increase all Survival DCs in the following term by 2 and decrease all XP bonus and Decoration DCs by 1.
The Prestige Class may only be taken whilst serving as a commando with a military or mercenary unit. Further levels may be taken only when commando activities or training are being undertaken regularly.
(Note: I got this most of this work from Reginald & Shane Mclean)
Here's my take on the Commando Prestige Class (Royal Marines / US Army Rangers -type game-ified a little).
Requirements: To become a Commando, a character must meet the following requirements:
Attributes: Strength 12+, Dexterity 12+, Constitution 14+, Intelligence 10+, Wisdom 10+
BAB: +3
Skills: Hide 3 ranks, Move Silently 3 ranks, Survival 4 ranks, Swim 2 ranks
Feats: Endurance
Other: Must have served at least one term in Army, Marines or Mercenary prior history
Stamina Dice: d10 + Con modifier per level
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Lvl BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 +1 +1 +1 +1 Feat (Alertness)
2 +2 +1 +1 +1 Trained Speciality
3 +3 +2 +2 +2 Feat (Improved Unarmed Strike)
4 +4 +2 +2 +2 Trained Speciality
5 +5 +3 +3 +3 Defensive Roll
6 +6 +3 +3 +3 Trained Speciality
7 +7 +4 +4 +4
8 +8 +4 +4 +4 Trained Speciality
9 +9 +5 +5 +5
10 +10 +5 +5 +5 Trained Speciality
</pre>[/QUOTE]Starting Feats:
Weapon Proficiency (Lasers)
Weapon Proficiency (Swordsman)
Abilites:
Trained Speciality - Many Commandos learn specialised skills useful in thier mission, and cross-train with those in thier team. The Commando receives a Feat or Ability dependant upon his specialisation (must be respective of prerequesites). The same speciality may not be selected twice.
Demolitions - Amount of damage to breach or destroy and object (see THB page 156) is reduced by 20%.
Forward Observer - +3 to Forward Observer and T/Comms skill rolls (must have Forward Observer skill)
Infiltrator - Stealthy Feat
Medic - Surgery Feat (must have T/Medical skill)
Leads the way - Improved Initiative Feat (must have Spot skill)
Point Man - Spot Trouble - The same as the Rogue class ability of the same name(must have Spot skill)
Rifleman - Rapid Shot Feat
Bullseye - Far Shot Feat
Signaller - EW Specialist Feat
Sniper - Sniper Feat
Deadly Striker - Improved Critical Feat
Assassin - Assassin Feat
Team Leader - Tactics Feat (must have Leader skill)
Defensive Roll - The same as the Mercenary class
ability of the same name
Class Skills:
Climb
Combat Engineering
Demolitions
Driving
Forward Observer
Hide
Intimidate
Intuit Direction
Jump
Leader
Listen
Move Silently
Navigation
Pilot
Search
Spot
Survival
Swim
Techincal (Communications, Computers, Medical, Sensors,)
Skill points: (5+Int Bonus) per level
Special:
If any levels of this Prestige Class are taken in Prior History increase all Survival DCs in the following term by 2 and decrease all XP bonus and Decoration DCs by 1.
The Prestige Class may only be taken whilst serving as a commando with a military or mercenary unit. Further levels may be taken only when commando activities or training are being undertaken regularly.
Okay change of plans. My new Classes will not appear under In my Traveller Universe they will be right here under Traveller for the D20 system.
Sniper is already there and I`m going to post Gambler right now. I am having some trouble with the Slicer though. Apparently I bit off more than I can chew, there is enough material there to fill a whole TA.
Sniper is already there and I`m going to post Gambler right now. I am having some trouble with the Slicer though. Apparently I bit off more than I can chew, there is enough material there to fill a whole TA.
GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
While I'll admit to not having looked at the actual write-ups, I'm a bit dubious about calling anything with a one-word name a "Prestige Class". I might accept the D20Modern term "Expert class" for such things, but (as far at T20 is concerned) I'm firmly in the camp that believes that Prestige classes are all about being noteworthy, not just being a specialist...
Also, as T20 actively encourages multi-classing, one of the (far too) common PrC practices in D&D of using a PrC to make up for the perceived weaknesses of multi-classing is simply not justified in T20.
An ideal set up as far as I'm concerned is to provide a continuum of increasing specialization and noteworthiness. To borrow the above mentioned classes as an example, I'd love to see Commando and Sniper written as "Expert" classes that basically require a level of Army or Marines (or equivalent, but tough to get elsewhere) and be startable *only* during active military service if you use that service as the prereq. If you meet the "non-service" set of pre-reqs, you can take the classes any time. These would be short classes representing the special training of those specialties.
Now, we look at the Traveller background and decide whether or not there are elites among these specialists. The militaries of the Imperium have millions of snipers and commandoes scattered across the stars, but there are only two hundred Ilelish Black Shadows at any one time, and *everyone* has heard of the Crown's Own Sharpshooters...
Similarly, every Imperial citizen knows of the Ministry of Justice, the Imperium-wide "police", but few are aware of the existence of the MoJ's "Special Branch".
Leaving the Imperium, we have the Zhodani Tavrchedl', also called the Guardians of Morality, or the "Thought Police". This strikes me as a good candidate for the "Expert" class type, specializing in detection, analysis, and rectification of unhappy thought. Are these hard-working mental custodians a "Prestige" class? There are literally millions of them in the Consulate, and they are by definition either Nobles or Intendants already. More significantly, is their training sufficiently complex that it requires immense skill (ie. high level and lots of skill ranks) to even begin the training, or are they "simply" specialist telepaths that can have their training represented fully by adding a skill or two to the character's permanent class skill list and tacking on a feat or two? Sounds like an Expert class to me.
Now, if there were a seniority and experience based group within the Tavrchedl' known for a particular reputation, or whom the years have brought unique psionic talents to ("welcome to the Million Minds Club. You will be inducted into the Gestalt this evening.") then there might be a PrC in there as well...
Also, as T20 actively encourages multi-classing, one of the (far too) common PrC practices in D&D of using a PrC to make up for the perceived weaknesses of multi-classing is simply not justified in T20.
An ideal set up as far as I'm concerned is to provide a continuum of increasing specialization and noteworthiness. To borrow the above mentioned classes as an example, I'd love to see Commando and Sniper written as "Expert" classes that basically require a level of Army or Marines (or equivalent, but tough to get elsewhere) and be startable *only* during active military service if you use that service as the prereq. If you meet the "non-service" set of pre-reqs, you can take the classes any time. These would be short classes representing the special training of those specialties.
Now, we look at the Traveller background and decide whether or not there are elites among these specialists. The militaries of the Imperium have millions of snipers and commandoes scattered across the stars, but there are only two hundred Ilelish Black Shadows at any one time, and *everyone* has heard of the Crown's Own Sharpshooters...
Similarly, every Imperial citizen knows of the Ministry of Justice, the Imperium-wide "police", but few are aware of the existence of the MoJ's "Special Branch".
Leaving the Imperium, we have the Zhodani Tavrchedl', also called the Guardians of Morality, or the "Thought Police". This strikes me as a good candidate for the "Expert" class type, specializing in detection, analysis, and rectification of unhappy thought. Are these hard-working mental custodians a "Prestige" class? There are literally millions of them in the Consulate, and they are by definition either Nobles or Intendants already. More significantly, is their training sufficiently complex that it requires immense skill (ie. high level and lots of skill ranks) to even begin the training, or are they "simply" specialist telepaths that can have their training represented fully by adding a skill or two to the character's permanent class skill list and tacking on a feat or two? Sounds like an Expert class to me.
Now, if there were a seniority and experience based group within the Tavrchedl' known for a particular reputation, or whom the years have brought unique psionic talents to ("welcome to the Million Minds Club. You will be inducted into the Gestalt this evening.") then there might be a PrC in there as well...
