The UGM Task Library

[Fritz_Brown]

Just to stir the pot, sometimes EDU is a detriment, rather than an advantage. Pilots have been known to break planes because they said "I knew it couldn't be that because it wasn't in the manual." Whereas, the smart pilot gets to write the new entry to the manual because he diagnosed it properly and saved the plane.

BTW, you have characters that have common sense in YTU? Boy, it must be easy to ref them!

 

[Fritz_Brown]

Just to stir the pot, sometimes EDU is a detriment, rather than an advantage. Pilots have been known to break planes because they said "I knew it couldn't be that because it wasn't in the manual." Whereas, the smart pilot gets to write the new entry to the manual because he diagnosed it properly and saved the plane.

BTW, you have characters that have common sense in YTU? Boy, it must be easy to ref them!

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Fritz88:
Just to stir the pot, sometimes EDU is a detriment, rather than an advantage. Pilots have been known to break planes because they said "I knew it couldn't be that because it wasn't in the manual." Whereas, the smart pilot gets to write the new entry to the manual because he diagnosed it properly and saved the plane.

Sounds like that pilot used the Universal Game Mechanic and rolled a Critical Failure.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Fritz88:
Just to stir the pot, sometimes EDU is a detriment, rather than an advantage. Pilots have been known to break planes because they said "I knew it couldn't be that because it wasn't in the manual." Whereas, the smart pilot gets to write the new entry to the manual because he diagnosed it properly and saved the plane.

Sounds like that pilot used the Universal Game Mechanic and rolled a Critical Failure.

 

[Fritz_Brown]

No, he was an idjet. So full of book larnin' he couldn't think.

Here's something to think about, re: Crit Failures. The old saying goes, "When its your time to go, its your time to go." Have you thought about, "What if it's my pilot's time to go?" Now, apply to crit failures........

 

[Fritz_Brown]

No, he was an idjet. So full of book larnin' he couldn't think.

Here's something to think about, re: Crit Failures. The old saying goes, "When its your time to go, its your time to go." Have you thought about, "What if it's my pilot's time to go?" Now, apply to crit failures........

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
I think we're in agreement except that I don't see piloting as a natural IQ kind of thing since people have to "learn" how to do it, go to flight school, get certified or a license...etc. I definitely see it as an EDU based skill (most of the time).

Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

I should note that I don't "tie" a stat with any particular skill as seen in most Traveller rules systems (MT and T4 come to mind).

In this I completely agree with you - even Melee Combat Skills could sometimes be based on STR (big blades) and sometimes on DEX (daggers/"blades").

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
I think we're in agreement except that I don't see piloting as a natural IQ kind of thing since people have to "learn" how to do it, go to flight school, get certified or a license...etc. I definitely see it as an EDU based skill (most of the time).

Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

I should note that I don't "tie" a stat with any particular skill as seen in most Traveller rules systems (MT and T4 come to mind).

In this I completely agree with you - even Melee Combat Skills could sometimes be based on STR (big blades) and sometimes on DEX (daggers/"blades").

 

[Golan2072]

Object Damage and Repairs
Many of you are familiar with the MT mishap/damage system, i.e. superficial-minor-major-destroyed; I am going to suggest something simpler for the UGM.

Ship, Vehicle and Robot damage is done by rolling on the combat damage tables - Ships on HG, Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system (which I'll later adapt to UGM), robots on LBB8. Repair UGM tasks for ships/vehicles/robots will be posted later.

When the referee decides that an object is damaged due to any game circumstances (explosions, EMP, falling, Spectacular Failures and so on), the referee has two choices. Either he sets a difficulty DM to repair the damage (usually DM-4 to DM+4) or he determines the extent of damage randomly (especially suggested for combat damage and Spectacular Failures), as following:
1) Roll 2D6
2) If the "natural" result is exactly 2, the object is utterly and irrepairable destroyed (subject to referee change, ofcourse); if the "natural" result is exactly 12, the object isn't damaged (only a surface scratch that doesn't interfere with the operation).
3) Otherwise, substract 7 from the result, giving you a number between -4 and +4 - which is the Difficulty DM to repair.

Repair Tasks use the relevant skill (Electronics for electronic devices, Gravitics for Air/Rafts etc) and, usually the EDU characteristic (or DEX for very delicate systems, or INT for improvisations), and, ofcourse, requires the appropriate tolls (DM-1 to DM-6 for inappropriate tools).

 

[Golan2072]

Object Damage and Repairs
Many of you are familiar with the MT mishap/damage system, i.e. superficial-minor-major-destroyed; I am going to suggest something simpler for the UGM.

Ship, Vehicle and Robot damage is done by rolling on the combat damage tables - Ships on HG, Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system (which I'll later adapt to UGM), robots on LBB8. Repair UGM tasks for ships/vehicles/robots will be posted later.

When the referee decides that an object is damaged due to any game circumstances (explosions, EMP, falling, Spectacular Failures and so on), the referee has two choices. Either he sets a difficulty DM to repair the damage (usually DM-4 to DM+4) or he determines the extent of damage randomly (especially suggested for combat damage and Spectacular Failures), as following:
1) Roll 2D6
2) If the "natural" result is exactly 2, the object is utterly and irrepairable destroyed (subject to referee change, ofcourse); if the "natural" result is exactly 12, the object isn't damaged (only a surface scratch that doesn't interfere with the operation).
3) Otherwise, substract 7 from the result, giving you a number between -4 and +4 - which is the Difficulty DM to repair.

Repair Tasks use the relevant skill (Electronics for electronic devices, Gravitics for Air/Rafts etc) and, usually the EDU characteristic (or DEX for very delicate systems, or INT for improvisations), and, ofcourse, requires the appropriate tolls (DM-1 to DM-6 for inappropriate tools).

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

Ask yourself this: When a pilot inputs a course, flying from orbit to 100 diam, is it more important that the character rely on his DEX (I'm betting that the thing is many times on autopilot) or his EDU (he knows how to apply his piloting skill for the most efficient, time-wise and travel-wise, trip).

I'd say it's EDU.

Rough landing on a crater moon? Sure, I'd say DEX would be a vialble choice for a task governor for piloting.

But, typical laster-guided landing on a high tech world? Or simple trip, in a straight line, from world-to-moon insystem, or 90% of most piloting, it's got to be a character's education and training as a pilot (EDU and Pilot skill), not his manual dexterity (DEX and Pilot skill), that he relies on most of the time.

I bet that many times, the pilot doesn't even have his hand on the "stick". I bet that's only used when manual control of the craft is needed (DEX based rolls).

A Traveller pilot, on a high tech vessel, is probably more about programming the navigator's flight path, choosing when to "burn" when when to "coast", and (most of the time) sitting infront of a holodynamic board watching the read-outs. It's Education based.

That's the way I envision Traveller pilots doing their jobs, anyway.

There will be some occassions when DEX is important, but most of the time, it's EDU that helps a character do well on his piloting task.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

Ask yourself this: When a pilot inputs a course, flying from orbit to 100 diam, is it more important that the character rely on his DEX (I'm betting that the thing is many times on autopilot) or his EDU (he knows how to apply his piloting skill for the most efficient, time-wise and travel-wise, trip).

I'd say it's EDU.

Rough landing on a crater moon? Sure, I'd say DEX would be a vialble choice for a task governor for piloting.

But, typical laster-guided landing on a high tech world? Or simple trip, in a straight line, from world-to-moon insystem, or 90% of most piloting, it's got to be a character's education and training as a pilot (EDU and Pilot skill), not his manual dexterity (DEX and Pilot skill), that he relies on most of the time.

I bet that many times, the pilot doesn't even have his hand on the "stick". I bet that's only used when manual control of the craft is needed (DEX based rolls).

A Traveller pilot, on a high tech vessel, is probably more about programming the navigator's flight path, choosing when to "burn" when when to "coast", and (most of the time) sitting infront of a holodynamic board watching the read-outs. It's Education based.

That's the way I envision Traveller pilots doing their jobs, anyway.

There will be some occassions when DEX is important, but most of the time, it's EDU that helps a character do well on his piloting task.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it. </font>[/QUOTE]It was discussed in this thread; the download link does not work anymore, however, and I can't seem to find it on any of my HDs (only hardcopy print and older DOC versions), so we should talk to Piper about re-uploading the file, or sending it to me (I can host it).

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

Ask yourself this: When a pilot inputs a course, flying from orbit to 100 diam, is it more important that the character rely on his DEX (I'm betting that the thing is many times on autopilot) or his EDU (he knows how to apply his piloting skill for the most efficient, time-wise and travel-wise, trip).

I'd say it's EDU.

Rough landing on a crater moon? Sure, I'd say DEX would be a vialble choice for a task governor for piloting.

But, typical laster-guided landing on a high tech world? Or simple trip, in a straight line, from world-to-moon insystem, or 90% of most piloting, it's got to be a character's education and training as a pilot (EDU and Pilot skill), not his manual dexterity (DEX and Pilot skill), that he relies on most of the time.

I bet that many times, the pilot doesn't even have his hand on the "stick". I bet that's only used when manual control of the craft is needed (DEX based rolls).

A Traveller pilot, on a high tech vessel, is probably more about programming the navigator's flight path, choosing when to "burn" when when to "coast", and (most of the time) sitting infront of a holodynamic board watching the read-outs. It's Education based.

That's the way I envision Traveller pilots doing their jobs, anyway.

There will be some occassions when DEX is important, but most of the time, it's EDU that helps a character do well on his piloting task. </font>[/QUOTE]I think you've proven your point; I'll edit my posts to fit with it; but still, piloting without a functioning computer (one of the reasons to roll a task when landing/taking off) will probably work on DEX or INT.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it. </font>[/QUOTE]It was discussed in this thread; the download link does not work anymore, however, and I can't seem to find it on any of my HDs (only hardcopy print and older DOC versions), so we should talk to Piper about re-uploading the file, or sending it to me (I can host it).

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Hmmm... But isn't that Flight School training summed up in the Pilot-1 skill?

Ask yourself this: When a pilot inputs a course, flying from orbit to 100 diam, is it more important that the character rely on his DEX (I'm betting that the thing is many times on autopilot) or his EDU (he knows how to apply his piloting skill for the most efficient, time-wise and travel-wise, trip).

I'd say it's EDU.

Rough landing on a crater moon? Sure, I'd say DEX would be a vialble choice for a task governor for piloting.

But, typical laster-guided landing on a high tech world? Or simple trip, in a straight line, from world-to-moon insystem, or 90% of most piloting, it's got to be a character's education and training as a pilot (EDU and Pilot skill), not his manual dexterity (DEX and Pilot skill), that he relies on most of the time.

I bet that many times, the pilot doesn't even have his hand on the "stick". I bet that's only used when manual control of the craft is needed (DEX based rolls).

A Traveller pilot, on a high tech vessel, is probably more about programming the navigator's flight path, choosing when to "burn" when when to "coast", and (most of the time) sitting infront of a holodynamic board watching the read-outs. It's Education based.

That's the way I envision Traveller pilots doing their jobs, anyway.

There will be some occassions when DEX is important, but most of the time, it's EDU that helps a character do well on his piloting task. </font>[/QUOTE]I think you've proven your point; I'll edit my posts to fit with it; but still, piloting without a functioning computer (one of the reasons to roll a task when landing/taking off) will probably work on DEX or INT.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
I think you've proven your point; I'll edit my posts to fit with it;

Whenever I think of a task for my players, I always ask myself, "Which of the six attributes will the character rely on most when attempting this task."

Sometimes the answer surprises me.

But, brother Emp, it's YOUR game. Pick the one that suits you best. I was just explaining my take on it and what I do in my game.

but still, piloting without a functioning computer (one of the reasons to roll a task when landing/taking off) will probably work on DEX or INT.

Sure, there will times when EDU is not used with piloting. Absolutely.

A character sees an enemy vessel perform a maneuver on the sensors--it's a maneuver that will put the craft in perfect striking range. Heck I'd give a pilot character a chance to recognize this--and it'd prolly be a pilot roll governed by INT.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
I think you've proven your point; I'll edit my posts to fit with it;

Whenever I think of a task for my players, I always ask myself, "Which of the six attributes will the character rely on most when attempting this task."

Sometimes the answer surprises me.

But, brother Emp, it's YOUR game. Pick the one that suits you best. I was just explaining my take on it and what I do in my game.

but still, piloting without a functioning computer (one of the reasons to roll a task when landing/taking off) will probably work on DEX or INT.

Sure, there will times when EDU is not used with piloting. Absolutely.

A character sees an enemy vessel perform a maneuver on the sensors--it's a maneuver that will put the craft in perfect striking range. Heck I'd give a pilot character a chance to recognize this--and it'd prolly be a pilot roll governed by INT.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it. </font>[/QUOTE]The PDF file is now available from here.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by WJP:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Vehicles on Piper's "LBB Vehicles" system

Where is this...I'd like to take a look at it. </font>[/QUOTE]The PDF file is now available from here.