Thunderbird 2: Concept for a modular freighter.

[Rigel Stardin]

Been watching Thunderbirds on the web and Thunderbird 2 looked like a good project. I've got the basic layout started the wing and boom section almost done. Will have to do some work on that thou (not happy with the way it turning out.). Biggest problem with the design as depicted in the show are as follows:

1. Landing gear: 4 massive jacks which technically do not fit in the wing booms which allow the cargo module to be removed when the craft is on the ground. Idea: put as boom extending from the bow to the stern and using a hoist system to lower the container to the ground before landing.

2: Fuel: Everything in Thunderbirds is power by atomic engines, to convert the vessel to something on par with Traveller, must find more room for fuel. Idea: Cargo containers contain fuel tanks.

Since the design is still in the concept stage, I could use some input at this time...

(Doing house work at present and may not be able to respond for some time. Refer to second quote in my signature.)

 

[sabredog]

Something along the lines of a really big modular cutter?

The Thunderbirds most likely used fission piles for power, so unless you use that for this bird you'll need to ensure some fuel on board the actual ship for the drives. At least enough for the Power Plant to run the M-Drive. If it is going to be ump capable I'd just have that fuel in the cargo pod - a standardized size pod will make that easy enough since the mass will be the same regardless.

You could probably fit the powerplant's fuel in the spoiler above the tail, and maybe some in the wings.

The tricky part will be to find a good balance in the size of the beast and have the pod a useful size for all those nifty vehicles and Thunderbird 4.

 

[sabredog]

If it helps, here is a cutaway of Thunderbird 2.

 

[Vladika]

OK So; hover, open your belly cargo doors, lower ship to ground, undo restraints from cargo to ship, lift ship leaving cargo on ground.

Ship doesn't need legs at all.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

Thanks saberdog, that drawing is very helpful. It also points out the problem with the landing gear. Give me a few hours and I'll have a better boom section to show off.

As it stands right now, I've got a crew of 4: pilot, co-pilot, steward and medic. She'll carry middle passangers and 2 high passangers, no lower berths.

The ship is two decks at present. It will be flatter in shape. No way for the crew to access the engine room during flight. The wings are larger to contain some fuel. Have not started work on cargo container. At least one of the containers will be a portable reseach station. But I'm sure, there can be more modules.

 

[SpaceBadger]

No way for the crew to access the engine room during flight.

Why not? It appears in the diagram view that there could be a path through the cargo module.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

It's an atomic engine. In two of esipodes I've watched, they make a big deal about radiation sheilding around the engines. Which makes the case for not having access to the engines in the drawing Saberdog posted.

I've enlarge the drawing and 24 and 29 are used to clamp the cargo pod to the rest of the ship.

 

[Sir Brad]

If I may the intakes on the engines become fule scoops and most of the jets become fuel tankage, a small access way down each side to the engine room and you have a modular shuttle with smallcraft cabins perfect for use with a Scout Cruiser, the Cruiser jumps from system to system dropping off these guys that do planetary exploration and long term servery , one to three months later it swings back around for pick up

 

[Rigel Stardin]

I'm not against the idea of having access to the engine room when the cargo module is in place. That is why I started this thread to get other people's input.

We are in the proof of concept stage (whether or not I can make the ship resemable the original), a frieghter is the easiest for me to draw. I had original looked at the pictures on the webs believing the TB2 was 3 stories tall, until I saw Saberdog's post, I didn't realize how small it was vs. the portrayal in the shows.

I'm still working on the boom that connects the forward section to the stern.

 

[sabredog]

Yeah, in photos from the show I have you can see Virgil's hat in the window and it shows that the ship is a little smaller than you think. If you see a pic of it launching the Mole or Thunderbird 4 you see the scale better. It is bigger than Thunderbird 1, but smaller than Thunderbird 3.

Still, it was always my favorite since it carried all those cool toys.

For access to the rear drive section, I'd have an emergency access hatch in the cargo pod for getting back there is needed, but not worry about access from the inside if the pod is not carried. T2 is rarely seen flying without a pod - which makes me think that there may be a place for a "service pod" with extra fuel and space for routine cargo - and when she is on the ground then access to the drive spaces is a moot point.

Besides, if you don't have to climb outside the ship in flight and be tied to a tether that may snap in order to be floated in the slipstream back to the spoiler in order to change the fuse before the reactor blows where would the drama and excitement come from?

 

[sabredog]

Here are some pics that show the ship from other angles, relative size to TB3, and the hangar.








And notice the police car next to TB2 for scale here:

 

[Rigel Stardin]

The concept drawing is up on art gallery.

Please tell me what wing you'd like.

 

[sabredog]

C looks right, except I think the chord is too narrow. The end should be wider.

Also, given the length and breadth of the ship the wing size looks overall kind of small, but then it is a Thunderbird and they relied more on cool for lift.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

If you look at the model box you posted you'll see the engine boom is rather small compared to the rest of the drawings.

I noticed that about the wings myself and even thought of using a detla wing configuration.

I'm lost when posting images in a thread

 

[sabredog]

The boom is smaller looking on the boxtop, but the scale is right so it was just to show how TB2 is smaller than most people think. And of course there is always the problem of making everything fit in a design that didn't really ever account for all of its internals - it was just to look good from the outside and the inside workings were never going to be in the show.

You just do what you can and close enough is good enough when working within the constraints of the game's deign rules. Your plans look pretty impressive IMHO.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

In about a minute, I'm going to update the original drawing I posted last night. I have mounted the forward swept wings and they are larger than the original to make it somewhat believable,provide lift and carry fuel.

I'm also tinkering with the idea of connecting the bow and stern with a boom simular to Space 1999 Eagle. It will provide a passageway to the engine compartment as well as provide additional space for fuel. I can also add lifting equipment to lower the cargo pod which will correct the landing gear mistake show in the TV series.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

Well I started to do the little 3-D drawing and discovered the airlock can't go there because of the engine boom bring center lined. So I'm now off to redesign that half of the upper deck. I thought about dropping the boom to ground level but I feel the design is correct in using the centerline boom.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

I just had a thought (Probably been discuss elsewhere), for the sake of this discussion, let's say this ship weighs 200 tons and the cargo module is 100 tons. Could the ship be equipted with drop tanks for the jump drives and then rely on the fuel in the wings for the return trip. Or does the total mass have to accounted for when designing the ship. I don't want the design to be like the Gazelle and cheat the system?

 

[sabredog]

It depends on what the ship is used for: is it going to be supported across systems by wide use of the cargo pods? In that case I'd leave the jump fuel in the pod and treat the ship like a small container ship. It shuttles freight around systems and just trades pods. You come into port, drop off your pod and look over the manifests on pods waiting for shipment and pick one thats going where you are. No pod - you're not going anywhere unless you rent a service pod that has fuel for the jump you want to make.

Or is the ship needing to make jumps when empty? In that case you put some fuel in the wings - maybe enough for jump-1, and then it can make return trips.

Personally, I like the first option - it'll make it competitive with Free Traders in some regions since it can allow for the formation of some kind of FedEx-type shipping business.

 

[Rigel Stardin]

(Off topic) Module cargo container and the ships that move them are one of my pet projects. I've redesigned the Loadmaster and I've posted the Bay class frieghter as well. The only thing I have yet to come up with to complete Loadmaster is a new engine, once I've done that, I'll post the new work and the information I've written on the subject.

(On topic). Watched a few Thunderbids and everytime TB2 comes in for a landing the landing rockets are in the boom and appear to be apart of the magical landing gear. I've redesigned the boom placing the landing thrusters forward of the landing gear. Will most likely post the update tomorrow.

(About the show) I would have loved to have all the vehicle models, my childhood would have been very entertaining and quite imaginitive.