I thought I would love Transhuman Space, David Pulver is one of my favorite game designers. But Chris Shy's artwork ruined it. Truly I was amazed. I'm one of those guys who has never really thought that artwork had any real influence on a game. Oh, maybe add a little gee whiz, but nothing major. Until Transhuman Space. The colors were murky, dark and drab. The illustrations were... well, in my opinion whatever Steve Jackson Games paid they were ripped off. Heck I even have a copy of 'Space Opera' from FGU and if you know what the 1st edition cover of THAT looks like... it's just garish and bad. THS artwork is worse in it's way.
Transhuman Space is 2300AD on drugs
- Thread starter kafka47
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EvilDrGanymede
Guest
That'd be Christopher Shy. Good for horror - absolutely bloody awful for sci-fi. More so because the TS softback corebook was in B&W when it was designed to be in colour initially (which it now is, as the hardback), and Shy's art isn't exactly crystal clear even in colour, certainly not in B&W. Even more so because he obviously failed to read the art notes in many cases and didn't actually render things actually decribed in the setting.
However, take heart - Shy isn't doing the art for the forthcoming books. The latest book - Personnel Files, a 64-page collection of characters - features art by Ramon Perez, that is actually crystal clear, accurate and illustrative, and suits the line MUCH better. And it's a damn fine book anyway. So take a look at that, maybe?
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EvilDrGanymede
Guest
What, you don't believe it's possible, or you don't believe you'd ever do it? Or both?!
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EvilDrGanymede
Guest
Well, that's kinda the point of transhumanism, really
Given that I think you said that you found several aspects of the setting to be disturbing, I'd suggest that his style comes closer to the "dark future" vibe of the setting that you're getting. But that's not actually what the setting is - it's not designed from the start to be a dystopia (like say, Cyberpunk); it's a hard sf future with aspects that may appeal to some, but may repulse others.
The problem is that Shy seemed to be drawing it as a horror sci-fi game rather than the hard sci-fi game it's supposed to be. I'm of the opinion that "mood pieces" do not belong in hard sf artwork, and much of Shy's art was geared toward that style rather than basic illustration, which is much more appropriate for the genre. And also, he didn't draw much that was actually in the setting either, which certainly didn't help. It would have been interesting to see how it would have turned out if he did actually stay faithful to the setting with his art. But his style still wouldn't have worked though - for one thing, space isn't blue as he draws it, it's black. And it's not murky or blurry either. Hard sf is supposed to depict a realistic setting, and his style simply doesn't mesh with that. IMO.
I agree that a Hard SF ought not to colour space Blue, unless it is there to emphasis the grandeur of it. I like the darkness that is conveyed through the different architecture and style that comes with cyberpunk. If everything would be strict line drawings, then I think we would end up with Terradyne or early GURPS Space.
Sure, it is not likely that we are going to see a total break with the past, as suggested in some of Shy's work. But, I think the idea to give the impression something is really different here. Imagine what was the impression of immigrants from some backwater in the 1920s and arriving in New York. The result is the same, as the Science Fiction of the period depicts. There is a sense of wonder associated with the collision of modernity and tradition.
Likewise, to point out the background to the milieu is not like "Minority Report" (sans Psi), it is much more like Robinson, Gibson and Stirling...that is cyberpunk. To draw realistically would require a Space Artist, not a Gaming artist. I hope that Traveller can again achieve that balance, for me, as in seen in past threads. I do like realistic but not cartoonish.
So take Shy's work, as a way invoking wonder with the Spectactular not the speculative. I would not recommend it for Milieu 2100 but certainly some of the ruined cities of the 3I, post-Black War...why not. The future need not be shiny and clean, that I think is the image of the 1950s. If anything, we have seen the displacement and the environmental crisis that mankind now faces makes the cyberpunk appearance more realistic.
Sure, it is not likely that we are going to see a total break with the past, as suggested in some of Shy's work. But, I think the idea to give the impression something is really different here. Imagine what was the impression of immigrants from some backwater in the 1920s and arriving in New York. The result is the same, as the Science Fiction of the period depicts. There is a sense of wonder associated with the collision of modernity and tradition.
Likewise, to point out the background to the milieu is not like "Minority Report" (sans Psi), it is much more like Robinson, Gibson and Stirling...that is cyberpunk. To draw realistically would require a Space Artist, not a Gaming artist. I hope that Traveller can again achieve that balance, for me, as in seen in past threads. I do like realistic but not cartoonish.
So take Shy's work, as a way invoking wonder with the Spectactular not the speculative. I would not recommend it for Milieu 2100 but certainly some of the ruined cities of the 3I, post-Black War...why not. The future need not be shiny and clean, that I think is the image of the 1950s. If anything, we have seen the displacement and the environmental crisis that mankind now faces makes the cyberpunk appearance more realistic.
Happy to report that I just got my copy of Personnel Files and In the Well today.
It would seem that SJG is trying to applease the Sly fans, amongst Transhuman Spacedom and the traditional GURPS Toon fans. Personnel fans is strictly old-style GURPS, which has character templates that I will steal for my Traveller games...
Whilst, In the Well, represents more of the fine artwork of Sly and others dedicated to pushing the envelope of a darker future. I have yet to see Alpha Centura, but, here's hoping that First Contact or the Interstellar Wars milieu will be a least half as good as what is now appearing in TS. And, that is where Ladies and Gentlemen, we will have a winning product.
My appologies to BG, as much of his later stuff, when I looked in T20 was not too anime but, eternal vigilance will be required...don't drift over to the Japanese side. Take cues from what Seeker Gaming System is/has been releasing...and add a darker feel, and we got T20 as a winning product!
It would seem that SJG is trying to applease the Sly fans, amongst Transhuman Spacedom and the traditional GURPS Toon fans. Personnel fans is strictly old-style GURPS, which has character templates that I will steal for my Traveller games...
Whilst, In the Well, represents more of the fine artwork of Sly and others dedicated to pushing the envelope of a darker future. I have yet to see Alpha Centura, but, here's hoping that First Contact or the Interstellar Wars milieu will be a least half as good as what is now appearing in TS. And, that is where Ladies and Gentlemen, we will have a winning product.
My appologies to BG, as much of his later stuff, when I looked in T20 was not too anime but, eternal vigilance will be required...don't drift over to the Japanese side. Take cues from what Seeker Gaming System is/has been releasing...and add a darker feel, and we got T20 as a winning product!
Is anyone else as disturbed by the mind-uploading and seemingly unregulated, rampant biomodification aspects of Transhuman Space as I am?
Why not even in Traveller, they have Matter Transporters at Tech Level 16. If Matter Transporters work somewhat like the do in Star Trek, it should be a simple matter to dematerialize a person and upload the entire person's molecular patter into a computer instead of rematerializing him at a real destination. TL 16 also has AI, so it should be possible to have a virtual reality simulation with an uploaded person's molecular pattern running inside. The computer would simply keep track of every atom, electron, and photon of that person as it moves around with the simulation. When the person is done with virtual reality, he can be downloaded to the Matter Transporter and rematerialize back into a physical body. Kind of like a Star Trek Holodeck only better. Now what can this uploading accomplish?
Imagine a Tech Level 16 space ship in a Universe where faster than light travel is impossible. Say you want to go to Alpha Centauri. Normally it would take about 5 years accelerating at 1 g half the way and deccelerating the other half. the crew would have to carry 5 years of consumables. With the Matter Transporter Uploading device you simply upload yourself into the ship's computer core and you find yourself in a virtual ships Bridge. Lets say something like gravity control doesn't exist. In the virtual bridge and crew cabins you just simulate a 1 G gravity field. The spaceship can then accelerate toward its destination at 100 G while the crew simuloids feel only a computed 1 G field. If the trip is still to long for them, they can just slow down the speed at which their own simulation is run so that the entire trip duration seems like one week. The ship then slams into the atmosphere of the destination planet and crashes into the planet's surface at a hard 100-G landing, but the ship can take it, its tough. the ship then downloads the crew through the matter Transporter to conduct a survey of the planets surface. When they are done, they use their matter Transporter to beam directly the 4.4 light years back to Earth. The entire trip duration takes about 12 years back on Earth.
Why not even in Traveller, they have Matter Transporters at Tech Level 16. If Matter Transporters work somewhat like the do in Star Trek, it should be a simple matter to dematerialize a person and upload the entire person's molecular patter into a computer instead of rematerializing him at a real destination. TL 16 also has AI, so it should be possible to have a virtual reality simulation with an uploaded person's molecular pattern running inside. The computer would simply keep track of every atom, electron, and photon of that person as it moves around with the simulation. When the person is done with virtual reality, he can be downloaded to the Matter Transporter and rematerialize back into a physical body. Kind of like a Star Trek Holodeck only better. Now what can this uploading accomplish?
Imagine a Tech Level 16 space ship in a Universe where faster than light travel is impossible. Say you want to go to Alpha Centauri. Normally it would take about 5 years accelerating at 1 g half the way and deccelerating the other half. the crew would have to carry 5 years of consumables. With the Matter Transporter Uploading device you simply upload yourself into the ship's computer core and you find yourself in a virtual ships Bridge. Lets say something like gravity control doesn't exist. In the virtual bridge and crew cabins you just simulate a 1 G gravity field. The spaceship can then accelerate toward its destination at 100 G while the crew simuloids feel only a computed 1 G field. If the trip is still to long for them, they can just slow down the speed at which their own simulation is run so that the entire trip duration seems like one week. The ship then slams into the atmosphere of the destination planet and crashes into the planet's surface at a hard 100-G landing, but the ship can take it, its tough. the ship then downloads the crew through the matter Transporter to conduct a survey of the planets surface. When they are done, they use their matter Transporter to beam directly the 4.4 light years back to Earth. The entire trip duration takes about 12 years back on Earth.
Personnel Files, unfortunately, is not the best product. I was hoping that SJG would have learnt something from BITS when doing their character driven plots. Sadly, it sinks right down to "Cat Man" - hybrid between Cat and Human.
Fortunately, In the Well, is a superior product, just wish that the artwork was in colour, maybe that is Transhuman Step II, re-release but with the Sly work in colour like the mainbook. (although, I do agree with a previous poster who states Space is not blue). For sheer beauty, and invoking the best of Space Art, Sly is climbing his way to being a top illustrator.
Hopefully, SJG and Hunter might invest in some of the software that Rob Prior reviewed in the latest JTAS for their Alien Worlds, as if I could, I would...
Fortunately, In the Well, is a superior product, just wish that the artwork was in colour, maybe that is Transhuman Step II, re-release but with the Sly work in colour like the mainbook. (although, I do agree with a previous poster who states Space is not blue). For sheer beauty, and invoking the best of Space Art, Sly is climbing his way to being a top illustrator.
Hopefully, SJG and Hunter might invest in some of the software that Rob Prior reviewed in the latest JTAS for their Alien Worlds, as if I could, I would...