I just searched comments of the guy you listed. Yes, the guy appears to be a pariah over there due to his/her posts.
TRAVELLER 5 - My Thoughts And Comments
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I just searched comments of the guy you listed. Yes, the guy appears to be a pariah over there due to his/her posts.
I understand what you said and hear you, I was only trying to get players to open up to giving T5 a chance is all. I was reading all the negative stuff prior to me even posting anything and I guess it finally hit a nerve for me.
Look I have played alot of Traveller over the past 37 years. My current group of 7 players have played now for almost 11-13 years straight every other week throughout those years. I have been the GM for that total time, the only gamer that left me died in a car accident. So my game has survived a pretty long time. Now I started playing Traveller some 37 years ago when I was 12. I have played ever since, and collected tons and tons of Traveller items. About 25 years ago, I started to come up with my many own house rules and developed my own rules set that I have used ever since.
I have tried to tell others on that site about my system, but they simply are uninterested in even considering anything not written by or for Mongoose Traveller as core rules. I guess I called a few of the more vocal snotty ones "closed Minded", "followers", "that would jump off a cliff if everyone else did it too". For me that is not being creative think on their own.
The rest of my gamers are all in their mid to late 40s or 50s like me and each of them also run their own gaming group on the week we do not play (every other) and they all use my house rules as well too with some minor changes of their own. We kind of look at it as "Our House rules" and we all contribute, but it is based off of my basic system using d100 / percents rolls to resolve issues. Everything is a d100 roll, skills, attack vs defense for combat, and so on.
I did not try to push my system on anyone, but it is extremely quick to pick up and use and understand. I have used it a long time, and it does work. I have told of my rules and even explained different parts of it in threads, but never pushed it. Heck I am always open to looking at anything, it might have a idea that maybe might be better to use. I always try to keep a open mind and that was what I was always trying to get accross to others over there. That seems to not to go over well, and to some they only can see what is written in the Mongoose rules and that is the only way to do things. Then some of these guys then get snippy or snotty, and well the rubs me the wrong way.
I guess I should just let it go, beacuse as is always the case many of them in 10 years will not even be gaming anymore anyway.
Look I have played alot of Traveller over the past 37 years. My current group of 7 players have played now for almost 11-13 years straight every other week throughout those years. I have been the GM for that total time, the only gamer that left me died in a car accident. So my game has survived a pretty long time. Now I started playing Traveller some 37 years ago when I was 12. I have played ever since, and collected tons and tons of Traveller items. About 25 years ago, I started to come up with my many own house rules and developed my own rules set that I have used ever since.
I have tried to tell others on that site about my system, but they simply are uninterested in even considering anything not written by or for Mongoose Traveller as core rules. I guess I called a few of the more vocal snotty ones "closed Minded", "followers", "that would jump off a cliff if everyone else did it too". For me that is not being creative think on their own.
The rest of my gamers are all in their mid to late 40s or 50s like me and each of them also run their own gaming group on the week we do not play (every other) and they all use my house rules as well too with some minor changes of their own. We kind of look at it as "Our House rules" and we all contribute, but it is based off of my basic system using d100 / percents rolls to resolve issues. Everything is a d100 roll, skills, attack vs defense for combat, and so on.
I did not try to push my system on anyone, but it is extremely quick to pick up and use and understand. I have used it a long time, and it does work. I have told of my rules and even explained different parts of it in threads, but never pushed it. Heck I am always open to looking at anything, it might have a idea that maybe might be better to use. I always try to keep a open mind and that was what I was always trying to get accross to others over there. That seems to not to go over well, and to some they only can see what is written in the Mongoose rules and that is the only way to do things. Then some of these guys then get snippy or snotty, and well the rubs me the wrong way.
I guess I should just let it go, beacuse as is always the case many of them in 10 years will not even be gaming anymore anyway.
As I explained with the post directly above your post...I do not get along well with the players that refuse to even look at something Not Standard to whatever version they like/play!
Look I defended T5 for people to at least look at and not put it down just because others say so. Ok I give up, I will let them say anything they want over there about it, I will refrain from saying or defending T5.
Enough said about the topic, let others do as they will.
I guess I will just read the rest of my own T5 see what is there and talk amongst my own group of players what we may or may not want to include within our gaming group.
How can we know to trust you when you don't use the correct words? (Your usage implies you meant to use "cite" - v., short for citation - but you used "site" - n., location.
The answer is, one looks at the writing deeper than certain superficialities. Citation forms also vary. "In the book," is a citation, albeit a week and ambiguous one. Footnotes are hard to use on boards, tho' I've used them.
The post that people are complaining about is one who is explaining what he's gathered from others reviews - in academia, this type of writing is called a literature review. In his case, it's a weakly done review of T5 reviews, while Malenfant did a much more academic approach - a tagged link list - over on SJG. For all his problems as a poster, he does do good research.
So? I played since '77 and I wasn't a little kid like you were when I started. What does that have to do with anything?
How do you know? I bet MANY over there have been playing as long as you have.
Anyway, don't take your fights from another Board over here. It's NOT needed.
Wow ...I must say I am amazed! Ok I have publically stated that I was wrong and sorry on the Mongoose board...I will even post what I said over there as well...
2330ADUSA1
Post subject: Re: Traveller 5
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 6:37 pm
Banded Mongoose
Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 8:27 pm
Posts: 236
Location: USA, NJ - East Coast
To the collective group...
I am sorry for trying to express my point of just wanting people to look for themselves at T5, and not base their feelings on what others have had to say.
I yield the point that this is a Mongoose Pub board and respect that most people here perfer to just use core Mongoose Pub rules. So that being said I am sorry for trying to express anything other than the Mongoose point of view. I will stop posting anything about T5, and anything not Mongoose Pub based.
So I yield the field to the collective and once again state that I am wrong and respectfully will stop!
Take care and enjoy the game that you want and play the way you wish to play too.
2330ADUSA1
Post subject: Re: Traveller 5
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 6:37 pm
Banded Mongoose
Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 8:27 pm
Posts: 236
Location: USA, NJ - East Coast
To the collective group...
I am sorry for trying to express my point of just wanting people to look for themselves at T5, and not base their feelings on what others have had to say.
I yield the point that this is a Mongoose Pub board and respect that most people here perfer to just use core Mongoose Pub rules. So that being said I am sorry for trying to express anything other than the Mongoose point of view. I will stop posting anything about T5, and anything not Mongoose Pub based.
So I yield the field to the collective and once again state that I am wrong and respectfully will stop!
Take care and enjoy the game that you want and play the way you wish to play too.
GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
At least I use the same handle on both boards.
I have the same Traveller-playing history you do, and probably close to the same library. I don't wave it around like a rock star. The attitudes you have spent several weeks projecting on the Mongoose board are not helpful. The terms you are using here (and quoted above) to defend yourself make it clear that your patronizing tone is no accident.
Your experience does not make you a troll. Your tone and vocabulary do.
Maybe I am fed up with the comments of others that have lived less amount of time than I have played this game. Actually a number of the more vocal folks are mid 20s in age and Mongoose Pub version is all they have ever played or seen.
Remember it takes two to have a fight, and I guess I have grown fed up over a long period of time watching others make comments that want me to pull my hair out. Usually I do not comment but I guess this whole T5 issue that started about 2-3 months ago really rubbed me the wrong way.
As to the Troll comment, your not me and have not read what I have or had the comments made to you by people that honestly in most cases are not players that have been around the block and seen what we have seen and experienced. Taking the high view is real easy when you have not walked the path I have over the past 2-3 months.
Ah well as I stated on that board I yield to them and will refrain from posting there and will just hang to get details on the release of products. I still will buy the products, but just stop contributing anything there. They can all pat each other on the back and enjoy their collective experiences in Mongoose version of Traveller.
BTW I had to start a new account over there because I lost the password to the account "pennshome723" and no longer have the email account that it pointed too. So I started the old account about the same time back in 2003, when I started my account here. It doesn't really matter as I am done with posting over there as I have stated anyway.
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Avenger Enterprises
SOC-11
I recall the hate-fest when GURPS Traveller was announced (one guy wrote to me ordering me not to write for it, another sent me death threats when I did).
I also recall the hate-fest when T20 was announced. And when Mongoose Traveller was announced. I'll discreetly not mention TNE, and MT was a slightly different situation.
Point is, any new version seems to attract flak from adherents of earlier ones. There are guys still denouncing anything that is not CT as uttermost heresy, and those who think that parts of CT were going too far.
I do think that any consideration of T5 needs to try to filter out the version-wars noises, because those always happen. I'm interested in the accounts of those who have actually tried to use T5 to run a game or build a gameverse or whatever. That explicitly would include those that made a credible effort and found they could not/did not want to use the rules.
But it's that 'credible effort' thing that matters. If you decide to hate it because it's not some other edition, that's not much of a useful opinion, but if you hate it because of some specific thing , well that's valid criticism. Same for those that love it - loving it because you love Traveller and it's Traveller isn't a very useful opinion - at least not to those trying to form an objective impression. Loving it because you used it and liked it... well, that's a different matter.
I guess that all comes down to... I'm not interested in the version wars, but I *am* interested in the experiences of those who have used T5 or tried to.
I also recall the hate-fest when T20 was announced. And when Mongoose Traveller was announced. I'll discreetly not mention TNE, and MT was a slightly different situation.
Point is, any new version seems to attract flak from adherents of earlier ones. There are guys still denouncing anything that is not CT as uttermost heresy, and those who think that parts of CT were going too far.
I do think that any consideration of T5 needs to try to filter out the version-wars noises, because those always happen. I'm interested in the accounts of those who have actually tried to use T5 to run a game or build a gameverse or whatever. That explicitly would include those that made a credible effort and found they could not/did not want to use the rules.
But it's that 'credible effort' thing that matters. If you decide to hate it because it's not some other edition, that's not much of a useful opinion, but if you hate it because of some specific thing , well that's valid criticism. Same for those that love it - loving it because you love Traveller and it's Traveller isn't a very useful opinion - at least not to those trying to form an objective impression. Loving it because you used it and liked it... well, that's a different matter.
I guess that all comes down to... I'm not interested in the version wars, but I *am* interested in the experiences of those who have used T5 or tried to.
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GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
You yourself have mentioned how cliqueish boards get. It is not a new phenomenon. Traveller suffers from edition fatigue to a greater extent than just about any other RPG out there (though poor Gamma World is worse with eight *completely different* editions). Some players will eventually grow beyond one edition, while others will switch whole from one to the next, and others will never change. Can't do much about that.
You are also following another extensive and persistent home system writer in this crowd, by the name of Ken Bearden. Regardless of how good your intentions might be you are the second act, and the audience has heard it all before. Repeatedly. Ad nauseum, even.
I've been trying to get people to look cross-edition for solutions to their single Traveller edition problems for twenty years. It hasn't worked yet, except on those actually writing new editions. Even as a toolbox for other editions T5 has an uphill battle.
Well I have NOT even definde my system over here (least I do not think I have anyway) and will refrian from it as well.
I will just try to be silent again as I have over the years and let others post their thoughts, not wanting to step on anyones toes here as I have done for years now.
I will just try to be silent again as I have over the years and let others post their thoughts, not wanting to step on anyones toes here as I have done for years now.
I note that the thread is not locked at this time (20:31 GMT+2). Has it been reopened or was it never locked, and it is still forbidden to post in it? Because I could easily have responded to one or two earlier posts instead of reading the entire thread first.
Hans
[m;]And on Martin's excellent note, I'm closing the thread because it's heating up.[/m;]
Several posts, including mine, are right at the inside edge of civility, and several others have crossed the line. The thread's got some discussion going on in the mods area.
[m;]Snark and nastiness about other licensed Traveller boards is definitely not something we (Marc, Cryton, Myself, DonM, Robject) want on the boards here.[/m;]
So, I'm locking the thread. Take a bit to chill. Get some fresh air. But don't drag the dirty laundry of Mongoose's boards over here for washing.
[m;]And to cure a misconception while I'm at it[/m;]
If you feel a post is clearly over the line, report it. Even mine. It creates a record - and that record isn't entirely on the board, as it emails the mod team as well - and the mods do chide each other. And Marc is an admin on the board.
Several posts, including mine, are right at the inside edge of civility, and several others have crossed the line. The thread's got some discussion going on in the mods area.
[m;]Snark and nastiness about other licensed Traveller boards is definitely not something we (Marc, Cryton, Myself, DonM, Robject) want on the boards here.[/m;]
So, I'm locking the thread. Take a bit to chill. Get some fresh air. But don't drag the dirty laundry of Mongoose's boards over here for washing.
[m;]And to cure a misconception while I'm at it[/m;]
If you feel a post is clearly over the line, report it. Even mine. It creates a record - and that record isn't entirely on the board, as it emails the mod team as well - and the mods do chide each other. And Marc is an admin on the board.
You got in between him writing the closure post, and both he and I locking the thread.
Also, note that mods and admins can post in closed threads.
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