Type A trader or A2 Far Trader options

[madmike]

Gearing up for my first classic Traveller campaign for nearly 25 years. Still a few months out from start yet and it also looks like the D&D group we are part of are keen for me to run a CT campaign as well, whilst the DM (son in law) is away on sea duty (RAN).

So, I have settled on a choice of starship for the adventurers, being either the Type A trader or the A2 Free Trader.

There a six players in the group so I am angling at a six crew ship, with the ability to carry a moderate cargo load and 2-4 passengers to turn over payment for the starship.

My wife rolled a character from LBB7, mustering out as a CMO(surgeon), so she has requested a small medbay on the ship and the group also asked for a 20 tonne launch as well.

Tricksy issues. I am going to draw up either trader in AutoCAD and play around with internal accommodation arrangements (the standard A2 arrangement is not what I like). In either case a 20T ships launch can be either external mounted dorsally or ventrally, recessed somewhat to maintain streamlining.

In previous and long ago campaigns I ran or had a character in, these issues never arose as we were all military or Navy.

Love some pointers, thoughts, data or deckplans to assist my thought processes. Apart from the Type S, these two designs would have to be the most used.

Here is the HG stats of my A2x Far Trader to get the ball rolling somewhat.

A3x - 2422221-100000-30002-0 Mcr 96.14 200 Tonnes
Bat Bear 1 1 Crew 5
Bat 1 1 TL 13
Cargo: 35.000 Passengers: 4 Crew Sections: 1 of 5 Low: 4 Fuel: 44.000 EP: 4.000 Agility: 1
Craft: 1 x 3T Air/Raft, 1 x 20T Launch
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification

Architects Fee: MCr 0.891 Cost in Quantity: MCr 71.312

Architects Fee: MCr 0.961 Cost in Quantity: MCr 76.912

 

[MCEvans]

Why and what does the group need a 20Td launch for?
If it is for group travel without the ship, give a 2nd Air/Raft or a G-carrier.
Either option is cheaper and gives more cargo space, and unless the group has a PC that has at least Trader-2 & Broker-2 they will want as much cargo space as possible.

 

[madmike]

Why and what does the group need a 20Td launch for?
If it is for group travel without the ship, give a 2nd Air/Raft or a G-carrier.
Either option is cheaper and gives more cargo space, and unless the group has a PC that has at least Trader-2 & Broker-2 they will want as much cargo space as possible.

Lori's character has Trader-2 and Broker-1, so some speculative and high price commodity trading are going to have to be on the cards.

I like the challenge :devil: Though I do agree about the non requirement of the launch. But, if a safari ship has one, why not a far trader?

 

[mike wightman]

Why not give them a 400t type R subsidised merchant?

It has the 20t launch and the crew of 6 requirement.

 

[madmike]

Why not give them a 400t type R subsidised merchant?

It has the 20t launch and the crew of 6 requirement.

Very tempting, but after long though and some group discussions after RQ, a smaller ship was settled on.

The group do not really want to haul lots of passengers either, so the extra space is a waste. Adventuring is the name of the game for them.

As I said, some time out before the campaign starts so trying to thrash out the best options. The type R is a good option though.

I am really trying to see members ideas on A2 or type A designs though.

 

[Tobias]

Here's my variant. Compared to yours, it lacks the 2G maneuver drive and the armor, but has considerably more cargo capacity - which you'll need if you have monthly payments to make. These ships cost about MCr 0.3 in monthly payments. With a mere 35 tons of cargo, it will be impossible to meet that even by speculative trade.
Also, I use a needle/wedge configuration. You'll want full streamlining.

Ship: Hachimaki
Class: Hachimaki
Type: Free Trader
Architect: Tobias
Tech Level: 13

USP
A-21212R1-000000-30003-0 MCr 91.020 200 Tons
Bat Bear 1 1 Crew: 5
Bat 1 1 TL: 13

Cargo: 62.000 Passengers: 4 Fuel: 44.000 EP: 4.000 Agility: 1
Craft: 1 x 20T Launch
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification

Architects Fee: MCr 0.910 Cost in Quantity: MCr 72.816

HULL
200.000 tons standard, 2,800.000 cubic meters, Needle/Wedge Configuration

CREW
Pilot, Engineer, Medic, 2 Gunners

ENGINEERING
Jump-2, 1G Manuever, Power plant-2, 4.000 EP, Agility 1

AVIONICS
Bridge, Model/1bis Computer

HARDPOINTS
2 Hardpoints

ARMAMENT
1 Triple Missile Turret organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3), 1 Dual Beam Laser Turret organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3)

DEFENCES
None

CRAFT
1 20.000 ton Launch (Crew of 0, Cost of MCr 0.000)

FUEL
44.000 Tons Fuel (2 parsecs jump and 28 days endurance)
On Board Fuel Scoops, On Board Fuel Purification Plant

MISCELLANEOUS
7.0 Staterooms, 4 Middle Passengers, 62.000 Tons Cargo

USER DEFINED COMPONENTS
None

COST
MCr 91.930 Singly (incl. Architects fees of MCr 0.910), MCr 72.816 in Quantity

CONSTRUCTION TIME
57 Weeks Singly, 46 Weeks in Quantity

 

[shield]

If you want full streamling use the flattened sphere configuration (if you are using High Guard) its a lot cheaper and I don't think you are worried about meson gun fire.

Have you considered an extended merchant. There are a couple of designs for 300tn traders - some of which are standard traders with a 100tn section dumped in the middle, or the J2 version of the Type R, with passenger numbers reduced to allow for the extra fuel tanks.

 

[Tobias]

If you want full streamling use the flattened sphere configuration (if you are using High Guard) its a lot cheaper and I don't think you are worried about meson gun fire.

This doesn't look like a flattened sphere to me, so no:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Gallery/images/8518/1_A1011GRAY00.jpg

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Have to agree that a boat on a small ship is impractical. How about a g-carrier?

 

[far-trader]

This doesn't look like a flattened sphere to me, so no:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Gallery/images/8518/1_A1011GRAY00.jpg

However, the Solomani Type A is a flattened sphere

EDIT: An old gallery cutnpaste montage I threw together...

http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Gallery/index.php?n=411

And it is already J2, M2, P2, and includes a 20ton launch. It is 400tons and lacks an Air/Raft (easy add), has more cargo and passenger capacity, but otherwise I think it fits your game's needs madmike. Worth a look anyway I think if you can find it

 

[far-trader]

...But, if a safari ship has one, why not a far trader?

Well, first off a trader needs to pay it's way and a superfluous launch eats up a lot of cargo space and costs more money to buy. Bad deal all around. While the safari ship has a legitimate need for an away boat and can charge a lot more to cover it's expenses...

...but if you're familiar with the safari ship why not just use that? Let the characters have inherited/bought a well used safari ship (40 years old, second mortgage at 50% the original cost), but not interested in or able to get charters* resort to using it as a makeshift speculative trader. It has your J2 and launch, and air/raft, and low cargo and passenger capacity. It's a cool deckplan and looking ship to boot. There are even some excellent corrected fan deckplans out there, including a merchant conversion to give you some ideas:

http://www.sff.net/people/kitsune/traveller/

EDIT: Using the above deckplan, you have 6 staterooms for the characters/crew, the small aft passenger stateroom to convert to a medical bay, and leaving just 2 staterooms for the occasional passengers. The launch normally takes up the center of the lower deck with the original capture tanks and cargo to either side. Now all open for easier access.

* or perhaps they get the occasional desperate charter willing to ignore the age and failing systems for a discounted rate (adventures)

EDIT 2: I can even legitimately see adding armour etc. to a rebuilt HG version of the safari ship given it's missions, while a trader with armour is another bit of a game breaker for me.

 

[Tobias]

However, the Solomani Type A is a flattened sphere

Yeah, yeah, I know...

The Solomani trader doesn't look too shabby either, but magmagmag's interpretation of the Type A is just so awesome.
I'm pretty sure he had deckplans for it on his sadly defunct website.

 

[Bob Weaver]

MadMike,

Have you seen the Freelance Traveller support site? Over there you can find among all the other good stuff, an article by Ken Pick which evaluates the commercial efficiency of starship models. If your player group wants to concentrate on adventuring and not depend on lots of cargo trading for financial support, you'll want a ship that will turn a profit from generic cargo hauling.
Here's the link to Ken's article analyzing the viability of the standard Type A and his several variants: http://www.freelancetraveller.com/features/shipyard/classic/ken-pick/alstretch.html
There aren't any deckplans to go with the descriptions, but making those up is half the fun!

Cheers,

Bob W.

 

[atpollard]

This doesn't look like a flattened sphere to me, so no:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Gallery/images/8518/1_A1011GRAY00.jpg

No, it is clearly a close structure ... which can't be streamlined in High Guard (IIRC).

 

[far-trader]

No, it is clearly a close structure ... which can't be streamlined in High Guard (IIRC).

Right you are, partially streamlined for a close structure, which means it should have that launch madmike wants

...mmm, worms, yum, let's open another can!

Personally though I call the Beowulf a wedge to keep it streamlined, and I think a fair argument can be made for that, or a cone.

More to your game and desires madmike, how about that? Re-design the ship around the idea it is an unstreamlined hull and so it needs that launch for ground interface. That way the launch is justifiable (and in HG you can, with a not too fancy design, make it break even or better over a streamlined hull, iirc, with the right choices for ship and launch) for a cost benefit conscious merchant.

 

[far-trader]

Another creative idea, take the Free-Trader, upgrade it to a Far-Trader but...

...it needs extra fuel, which come as strap on tanks externally, spoiling the streamlining (it can jettison the tanks to recover streamlining, and increase the performance, maybe J3, 3G), which again needs more drives (to get to that J2, 2G desired), which cuts into the old staterooms/lowberths reducing the passenger capability.

And, now being unstreamlined it has to piggyback a launch (or cutter*) for ground interface, which means a little more drives too.

A right proper Frankenship with dtons of "adventure" built in :devil:

 

[madmike]

Hmmmm

Looking at the Freelance Traveller link, not many smaller trader starships break even.

Might look at options to lighten the load somewhat on the party, with perhaps any trade providing purely income and not mortgage repayments. That will not, I feel cause a problem as if they do not trade they cannot provide upkeep on running expenses and crew pay.

I cannot get the flying sub issue divorced from the safari ship at current.

 

[Dragoner]

I remember reading somewhere that starship economics is designed for the small ships not to break even, thus forcing the players into extracurricular activities to make ends meet.

 

[Tobias]

No, it is clearly a close structure ... which can't be streamlined in High Guard (IIRC).

It is quite clearly a needle/wedge. More clearly so than other ships which have been classified as such: The SDB for example.

RPersonally though I call the Beowulf a wedge to keep it streamlined, and I think a fair argument can be made for that, or a cone.

The Beowulf is a wedge. The Type S is classified as a cone, and so is the Type R.

 

[madmike]

Right

After having a good second look at the Freelance Traveller site section of stretched traders and the Commercial Efficiency Ratio (CER), I have firmed up on a 300t ship. The classic A2 trader shape is still one I like, so I will modify that deck plan instead of stretching the Beowulf class.

Not having much luck getting HG stats equalling the data on the web page, but I will keep trying. I have dropped the launch idea as simply not required.

HG info thus far is;

A3x - 31222S1-030000-30003-0 Mcr 146.13 300 Tonnes
Bat Bear 1 1 Crew 5
Bat 1 1 TL 13
Cargo: 125.000 Crew Sections: 1 of 8 Low: 1 Fuel: 80.000 EP: 6.000 Agility: 1
Craft: 1 x 3T Air/Raft
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification
Architects Fee: MCr 1.46 Cost in Quantity: MCr 116.904

Problems compared to the original Freelance Traveller article are cost, cargo capacity and thus the CER. Perhaps I am making too much of this in light of my post above.

That said, I would still love to see some A2 deckplans as mentioned in my OP. It is a pity the basic designs are not available in DXF format so as to drop into AutoCAD. Asking too much there I know