YTU-Tailored Ship Encounter Tables?

[jawillroy]

Or, What's A Free Trader Doing At Yori, Anyway?

I cocked an eye around the boards, and I couldn't find anything in particular like this - maybe someone's already got one?

I've been thinking in terms of setting up a new spread of encounter tables for my (Non-OTU ProtoTraveller) universe. While I don't want to get much more complex than the table in LBB2, I think I'd like to create a little more detail tailored to the specific system that took into account things like world population, and the minimum jump necessary to get there (without extra fuel tank fiddling about.)

There's a table Leroy Guatney did in JTAS which suggests the number of ships in 'port on a given week, based on port type versus planet population. IIRC, he went on to describe his own encounter tables which he said would follow (they didn't. Yay GDW copy editing!)

The Way Of Madness would decree a separate table for each system. Don' wanna.

The Way Of Practical And Wise Refereeing would decree dispensing with tables and implementing ship encounters by GM fiat as necessary to serve The Story.

But The Way Of Heck All I Do Is Solitaire These Days wants a more interesting set of encounter tables than just LBB2, and wonders if someone hasn't already done something I can model from.

 

[far-trader]

All I ever did in this vein was fix the table in Book 2 a little, per the post here:

Errata for book 1-3 Reprints

...copied below to save cross posting:



Starship Encounters (table)

Both books handy (book 2 2nd ed/reprint pg 35 & The Traveller Book pg 75) have a couple problems.

First the +2 for a Naval base in system should only be applied to Class A and B starports per the generation rules of no Naval bases for Class C, D, E, or X systems (which some UWP data sets also have wrong).

This means the entries for a roll of 14 or 15 on the Class C column are invalid as well as the roll of 14 on the Class D column.

Second the rationalization of the P suffix for a Pirate encounter weren't thought out too well. "Oh, so we see a Type T (or C) approaching. Hmm, the system is a Class E starport so they must be a Pirate." Sure it's metagaming at it's worst but the table is just bad that way. The same problem happens with the Type T in a Class D system.

For what it's worth this is the way I recall working out the Book 2 version to fix and streamline the table:

       S t a r p o r t  C l a s s         S h i p  T y p e  N o t e s

2d6    A    B    C    D    E    X         * = roll 1d6 below

 2     -    -    -    -    -    -         DMs = -1 if S Base, +2 if N Base

 3     *    *    -    -    -    -           1 = 20t Launch

 4     *    *    -    -    -    -           2 = 30t Boat

 5     *    *    *    *    -    -           3 = 40t Pinnace

 6     S    Y    *    *    -    -           4 = 95t Shuttle

 7     A    S   (A)  (*)   -    -           5 = 1d3 50t Cutters

 8     Y    A    R    A   (*)   -           6 = 2d3 10t Fighters

 9     R    M   (T)  (C)  (A)  (T)        A = 200t Free Trader

 A     M    S    S   (S)  (T)  (A)        C = 800t Mercenary Cruiser

 B     T    R   (C)  (T)  (S)  (C)        M = 600t Subsidized Liner

 C     S    C    M    S   (C)  (S)        R = 400t Subsidized Merchant

 D     C    A   (S)  (A)   -    -         S = 100t Scout/Courier

 E     T    S    -    -    -    -         T = 400t Patrol Cruiser

 F     S    T    -    -    -    -         Y = 200t Yacht


DMs = +1 if S Base, +2 if N Base; (bracketed) indicates may be pirate

 

[jawillroy]

That's not far from what I've been doing whuen I use the original table: I adjust the rolls on the C and D tables to make up for the Nav thing, and then I roll reaction, basically ignoring "P" notation: a hostile reaction from any ship in a C port or less is going to indicate a dustup. I work out the details of "why" on a case by case basis. (Hostile ship reactions in civilized systems I treat as an occasion for a law check; you've been reported for some real or imagined infraction of system regulations, leading to the summoning of a system cutter or a patrol to board, inspect and fine you.)

But I've wanted to model up something a little more supple.

 

[Spinward Scout]

You don't have MegaTraveller, do you?

In the back of the MT Imperial Encyclopedia is about 6 or 8 Starship Encounter tables broken down into Naval, Scout, Merchant, Civilian, etc... which is probably just what you need. I hear you can get the reprints on CD, tho.

 

[Magnus von Thornwood]

*grins*

You don't have MegaTraveller, do you?

In the back of the MT Imperial Encyclopedia is about 6 or 8 Starship Encounter tables broken down into Naval, Scout, Merchant, Civilian, etc... which is probably just what you need. I hear you can get the reprints on CD, tho.

CDs?! We don't need no stinking CDs! *patooe!*

OK, maybe some, but I am getting (someday) the bound CT books.

 

[coliver988]

also Supplement 7 has additional ship encounter tables:

Express Boat Network
Large Misc Vessels
Merchant encounters
Gunboats
small craft
frontier encounters

each of those tables has where they can occur & various modifiers. I suppose you could also do a meta-table if you want a busier place, and have a table that indicates how many rolls on each table would be required based on basic info (TL, inside/outside the Imperium, etc)

So either the CT-CDROM, find the original (can't have my worn copy!), or the reprints.

I keep wanting to do something like that, with additional info about merchant lines, megacorps stuff, things that may not directly impact the game but give it a living background. But I rapidly lose track...

 

[jawillroy]

You don't have MegaTraveller, do you?

Why, no. Took one look at the player's manual and ran screaming back to my dorm room, to cradle my LBBs in my protective arms.

In the back of the MT Imperial Encyclopedia is about 6 or 8 Starship Encounter tables broken down into Naval, Scout, Merchant, Civilian,

Now, I can see having a basic civilian table for most encounters, with entries for "military" or "scout" leading to subtables... But I think I would want to avoid having 6 or 8 for general use, unless each were maybe tailored to a subsector...

 

[jawillroy]

also Supplement 7 has additional ship encounter tables:

Express Boat Network
Large Misc Vessels
Merchant encounters
Gunboats
small craft
frontier encounters

AH! I seem to recall that was the case, which is good, because I have a copy coming to me in the mail presently.

One does so lose track, I agree.

 

[far-trader]

also Supplement 7 has additional ship encounter tables...

I had totally forgotten about those tables...

...with just cause I might add cynically

I was also going to point out the MT ones and the T20 ones but hey, I sensed a 3LBB tone to the request

It is an idea I've wanted to work up myself now and then, cross-indexed...

System type (main, subsidiary, tertiary)

System remoteness/connectedness (J1, J2,... links, and xboat route y/n)

System traffic (pop and starport)

...and maybe a few other factors. Thing is even for a small ship 3LBB mt universe that gets complicated fast. Change it up to a big ship post 3LBB otu universe, I don't even want to go there

As a ref tool for inspiration when drawing a blank the basic table is fine. As an imagination prod for solo play something more would be nice.

 

[Vile]

You don't have MegaTraveller, do you?

In the back of the MT Imperial Encyclopedia is about 6 or 8 Starship Encounter tables broken down into Naval, Scout, Merchant, Civilian, etc... which is probably just what you need. I hear you can get the reprints on CD, tho.

Are these tables you can read on the MT CD-ROM? I'm still holding off on buying it - although I don't see the PDFs being improved any time soon ...

 

[aramis]

They are on white in the books. So they should be readable.

 

[jawillroy]

...with just cause I might add cynically

Didn't like 'em?

I sensed a 3LBB tone to the request

Yup.

What I'm thinking:
Starport should make a difference.
Population should make a difference.
Navy/Scout bases should make a difference. Maybe not as much as the above. IMTU, the Navy base would make much more impression than a scout base, unless you were in trouble.
Amber/Red zones should make a difference.

Those all should be relatively easy to do.

Minimum normal jump necessary to reach the world should make a big difference, and that's harder. No?

I don't want to expand the number of processes the solo player or ref has to go through that much. I still want one roll. Maybe one table for J1 worlds, one for J2 worlds, one for J3+, then fold the other stuff into that?

Maybe three tables according to minimum jump, each broken down by starport type like the original.
Population should make a difference: maybe a +3 for pop 8,+ -3 for pop 5-.
Maybe add a die to the roll if a Naval base is present.
Amber/Red zones should make a difference: Maybe amber zones have a -3, while red zones roll 3 dice and ignore anything that isn't a military ship getting in your face.

Gotta mess with this, just thinking aloud here.

 

[coliver988]

it also depends on if you have a busy TU or not. While I've never played GT, the GT:Starports gives you the tonnage going through a system based on tech, pop, etc. Based on the tonnage, you can figure ships and stuff at the bulk level. And I think this is Robject's site that does the same sort of thing: http://eaglestone.pocketempires.com/ under the starport section.

But getting it down to a single roll? I suppose if it were for a roll for an encounter which does impact the players in some way, then yes. I keep thinking background (you're coming into a very busy port, there is a 6 hour queue of ships waiting to be processed: 1 Sharushid trader, 2 Tukera liners, 6 10K dT freighters, and several tramp freighters going in, and a constant stream of shuttles going back & forth between low & high ports, as well as the ships leaving the port. You may be able to bump up in the queue if you know any of the traders, or perhaps admin/liason skill. That sort of thing - at a busy starport you frequent a lot, you may have gotten to know some of the port admin people and may be abel to get in/leave faster).

Background traffic is obviously different than actual encounters, so maybe you could do it in a single roll, having tables and/or DMs for tech, population and other factors.

 

[jawillroy]

it also depends on if you have a busy TU or not...

Background traffic is obviously different than actual encounters, so maybe you could do it in a single roll, having tables and/or DMs for tech, population and other factors.

Agreed and agreed. MTU isn't terribly busy, and it's small: the big trade worlds will see weekly traffic in the hundreds of ships, but there's lots and lots of worlds that hardly ever see a ship, and there's certain types of ship that will seen in some systems and not in others. The long-jump ships have fixed, scheduled routes between worlds that can guarantee them full staterooms and holds, or that carry subsidies. In fact, most C ports won't see any merchants much bigger than a subbie, and only a few reckless and/or armed tramps will go anywhere worse. It's really easy to get yourself stranded a few weeks at a D-port as a Traveller IMTU.

 

[far-trader]

also Supplement 7 has additional ship encounter tables...

I had totally forgotten about those tables...

...with just cause I might add cynically

Didn't like 'em?

Well it was just that while the ideas were interesting (incorporate the new ships and apply some system details) I wasn't thrilled with the execution.

No longer tied to starport, or anything really. All the ships could be encountered anywhere (except the xboats table).

While there's a DM for Merchant encounters for remote systems (access requires J2) it doesn't actually eliminate all J1 ships.

Small craft encounters are still described as single ships. Yes, you encounter ONE fighter on patrol ("...A fighter that size couldn't get this deep into space on its own." ).

I was pleased that some ship encounters were now multiples. Disappointed that it was only Navy heavies. But that makes some sense.

Lots less pirates. Though again that may make some sense.

Overall when I looked at it I saw nothing I could use without work and I already had my Book 2 table so I promptly forgot all about it.

And then later, as Spinward Scout notes, MT came out with an expanded set of encounter tables. Much like those in S7, a little improved, a little more expanded, and with much the same problems as the ones in S7. I seem to recall just continuing to use my old Book 2 table

 

[jawillroy]

I already had my Book 2 table so I promptly forgot all about it.

I've started kicking a few ideas around: it's all based on the book 2 table for now, 'cept I've got separate tables depending on the jump access to the system. The J1 table is pretty much the same as a "corrected" LBB2 table; the J2 and J3 tables are sparser and cut out the ships that can't normally make it there.

I'm thinking I might want to change things up a little. My thought is to make the basic chart strictly commercial, and make a separate roll to see if there's a military or scout encounter instead of/in addition to the commercial one. That removes the scout/navy base mod from the table. I'll replace that with a +2/-2 for Hi pop/Low pop worlds respectively.

So by having separate tables, I can vary encounters based on jump accessability. By having a separate mil/scout encounter roll, I'll have more room to simulate for system population.

I'll show you what I get when I figure it all out.

 

[Gadrin]

The Way Of Madness would decree a separate table for each system. Don' wanna.

The Way Of Practical And Wise Refereeing would decree dispensing with tables and implementing ship encounters by GM fiat as necessary to serve The Story.

But The Way Of Heck All I Do Is Solitaire These Days wants a more interesting set of encounter tables than just LBB2, and wonders if someone hasn't already done something I can model from.

Supplement 7: Traders & Gunboats has an encounters section and a few tables that might lead you to a decent compromise, or spark some ideas for a writeup of your own.

3. FAERCI-IANT ENCOUNTERS oops OCR is off on the CD, that's supposed to be MERCHANT ENCOUNTERS -- Encounter occurs in any system. If the system is only accessible by jump-2, apply a DM of +4. If other peculiarities of jump access apply, the referee must modify the table or the encounters.

4. GUNBOATS -- This encounter may occur in any system. The ship involved is one from the Imperial (or other) Navy. Ships on this table will be performing one of the following missions: patrol, escort, transfer, fleet maneuver, or courier.

5. SP.1ALL CRAFT oops another OCR, that's SMALL CRAFT -- This encounter may occur in any system. Small craft may be operating on an
interplanetary basis from local worlds, or they may be operating from a starship parent. Small craft may be performing any of the following missions: courier, survey, courier, transport, trade, or smuggling. The courier mission may be interpreted as a form of errand-running.

6. FRONTIER ENCOUNTERS -- This encounter may occur in any system, but is preferred to occur in low technology, low population systems, or those with travel codes red or amber.

one of which is:
8 Express boat tender in private hands operating as a corsair.

Which I thought was interesting.

Naturally each has a table of more details.

Anyway those may lead you to ideas not only for the ship, but what it's up to...

 

[Mithras]

Great thread!

But a big question.

What do you make happen during a ship encounter? Is it:

a) there is a Type R on the scope ...

b) a Type R initiates conversation, offers advice/asks a question

c) Captain Zane Ibn Rashid of the Type R Golden Gryphon, wishes to trade with you... sort-of like a MMO where ships are players with agendas and needs and can really be interfaced with.


a, b, or c?

 

[far-trader]

What do you make happen during a ship encounter? Is it...

a, b, or c?

d) all of the above

In my take an encounter is noteworthy. There are almost always several ships near the player's ship at any time but most are just going about their business and ignore and are ignored. An encounter means a ship(s) takes an interest in the players or the players have noted something of interest in the other ship(s).

First, after an encounter is indicated, I roll the other ship's status as Inbound or Outbound (50/50), if not Loitering. Which bears more explanation itself. I roll encounter checks at up to three points:

a) between 100d and 10d (where loitering is (1 in 6) uncommon)

b) between 10d and orbit (where loitering is (3 in 6) common)

c) between orbit and ground (where there is no loitering)

Second, after noting the other ship's motion, I check for detection of each by the other, and "inform" each of their knowledge.

Third, I roll the other ship's activity. Mercenaries use the Mission table from Book 4 pg 18. Navy uses the Specific Assignments table from Book 5 pg 6. Scouts use the Scout Office Assignment table and Duty Assignment table from Book 6 pg 12. Merchants use the Specific Assignment tables from Book 7 pg 23 (about all I use that book for). Civilian ships and small craft I generally use the Patron Encounter table from Book 3 pg 27 for inspiration.

Fourth, I roll the other ship's reaction on the Non-Player Character Reaction table of Book 3 pg 27 as a base to determine their mindset, modified by circumstance. Negative is probably a pirate or thinks you are, neutral is open to comms but not initiating, positive initiates friendly comms with you.

From there it's role playing

 

[Magnus von Thornwood]

Go F-T

I like Far-Trader's last entry here, seems to make sense to me, combine with the Starport/Pop and bango!