So, who actually builds corsairs?

[gloriousbattle]

Imperial Inspector: "So, you're saying Mr. Samiibukun, that Tukera Lines buiilds these... what was their designation... "Type P Economy Liners", purely as trade and drayage vessels?"

Executive: "That's correct. A good, dependable ship at an excellent price has always been the firm's trademark."

Imperial Inspector: "Uh huh. And these three triple turrets..."

Executive: "Purely for defensive purposes of course. One can't be too careful in these trying times. We also sell an excellent line of sandcaster."

Imperial Inspector: "Of course. And these retractable fins also serve this purpose?"

Executive: "Simply a convenience for our buyers who wish to customize their lines without paying for expensive and unnecessary cosmetic reconfiguration."

Imperial Inspector: "Quite. And I assume that the ship's ability to modify it's communications traffic and ident codes are also merely features to customize..."

Executive: "Dear me! Look there! Someone seems to have dropped 20MCr on the floor! Who could have done such a foolish thing? Perhaps if I go find a maintenance man..."

Imperial Inspector: "No need for that Mr. Samiibukun, no need for that. Well, I'll be going now, and I'm happy to report that Tukera Lines has passed inspection yet again with flying colors. Oh, before I do go, just a word of advice. You might want to paint out that Jolly Roger on the "Type P Economy Liner". Future inspectors might get the wrong idea..."

***

Well, it has to go something like that. How else could the Corsair be a standard design? And who but a Megacorp could build them?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttQjm-8OITE

 

[Sir Brad]

Not Quite, some are built by Governments as Privateers or Blockade Runners for use in war time, others are built as Bonded Cargo Haulers (Navy Contract sais to transport those Spinal Mount components I need to be packing four Military grade Turrets for defence) or Convoy Escorts or for use in running cargo in hazardous markets out side the Imperium.

Wars over Privateers & Blockade Runners turn Pirate or turn in their Type-P's for full Credit on something more economically reliable, Government strips back the ships to something approaching a legitimate (if uneconomical) configuration and sells them as Surplus, outlaws buy them up and return them to original Specs. Once the Purchase/Lease is up on the Bonded Couriers, Escorts & HMT's the big lines can't write the Payments on their Tax, they sell them off to their Feeder Lines and "Special Security Contractors" (Privateers who fight their Trade Wars for them) or put them on the open market, outlaws eventually get their hands on them and fit them out for Piracy.

 

[mike wightman]

IMTU corsairs are built by megacorps and by imperial nobles.

The megacorps use them during their trade war periods and the nobles sponsor their use to raid rival nobles shipping during their disputes.

Something I wrote on the subject a while ago:

Privateers and Gentlemen - piracy in proto-Traveller

In the original Library Data the first/lowest tier of Imperial government is the sub-sector Duke.
They are tasked with seeing to the economic well being of the worlds within their sub-sectors, overseeing the deployment of Imperial resources, and ensuring that worlds pay their taxes

Rivalry exists between sub-sector Dukes, they are competing for limited Naval assets, they are trying to encourage megacorp involvement within their sector, and they are constantly striving to exploit the resources the sub-sector offers.
A sub-sector Duke who can encourage the development of a couple of high pop worlds, or a nice mix of industrial, rich and agricultural worlds, will have considerably more influence at the sector level - and may even aspire one day to that lofty position.

How to stop your neighbours doing the same? What if a world just over the sub-sector border offers great trade potential?

Megacorportions are the power behind the throne of the Imperium. They exploit the resources, operate the refineries and factories, and transport the goods to market.
They conduct exploration - to find new markets and resources - they conduct research and development - to stay ahead of the competition, they found colonies, buy and sell whole worlds, and pay their taxes...

So what if a rival company is making inroads into your market share? What if a world that used to provide the raw materials for your factories decides to trade with someone else? What if an upstart transport company starts to undercut your transport monopoly? What if another megacorporation perceives your foothold in a particular region to be weak and ripe for takeover... hostile takeover.

Individual planets are free to govern themselves as they see fit. They are free to build their own naval ships, to subsidise trade, develop their own economies, and exploit their own resources...

So what if a rival world has ambitions to claim an uninhabited part of your system, or you want to develop the potential in another worlds system because they lack the resources?

So basically I can see how each of the above groups would sponsor raiders within the territory of their rivals.

By claiming "Trade War" you have partial immunity from the IN blowing you out of space because of your activities. The letter of marque is a natural extension of this IMHO.
This helps me to explain three things:

how the pirate career can have such a well defined structure

where Corsair class "speculative traders" come from (and why it is a standard design )

how pirates can find a ready market for their booty.

 

[Border Reiver]

Excellent justification.

 

[rancke]

By claiming "Trade War" you have partial immunity from the IN blowing you out of space because of your activities.

Actually, you don't. Trade wars are illegal [TA:108]. Any Imperial Navy vessel that vitnessed an incident would be obliged to intervene. What a trade war ensures is that if you keep the violence within certain bounds, the IN won't go out of its way to track you down and bring you to justice.


Hans

 

[mike wightman]

Hence the partial immunity not full immunity.

Funny how there are two pages about the practice...

 

[HG_B]

They started out life as privateers. Pretty simple. Show your permission to be a privateer and you can get it built.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Who builds corsairs? It's the same issue I brought up with armed civvies.

Speculation; it could be a generic design that caught on, and so every Vargr state has their version of one. The rules present the stock vanilla flavored hull. YMMV

 

[kafka47]

Good point, BG, essentially no ship would be labeled as a corsair...having said that there are shipyards across the Imperial border...that might specialize in that trade. For me, I always liked to leave it blank. But, there are worlds that offer havens for pirates even good standing members of the Imperium might support piracy, albeit for all the wrong reasons even if the intentions were good. For instance, a pirate captain might be sharing its high tech loot with a Charismatic Dictator who shares it with the noble families of a particular Feudal Technocracy. The serfs would be charged with building starships without knowledge of what they are being used for...for all they know the corsair could be a blockade runner - which was needed to circumvent that evil oppressive (or so says the official propaganda) empire - the Zhodani Consulate which are holding a "sister" world in its maw.

 

[Ran Targas]

Would most be just reworked warship designs? I don't think anyone would start off designing a corsair or bucanneer from the ground up.

Builders who come in 2nd or 3rd in a military design contest need some way to turn a profit so they sell the design to whoever will offer them enough to cover the engineering costs. The plans fall into the hands of some utterly unscrupulous and yet very industrious shipyard or government who eventually puts them to use. There are examples of similar situations to this in the WW2 and Cold War aircraft industry where designs for one contract all of a sudden showed up in someone else's inventory as a counter to the contract winner. There's even rumor the Zero was originally a Hughes design that was liberally copied.

 

[jatay3]

I imagined IMTU a class of ships based on a reworking of the old ISW era Lightnings that was built at government expense and sold to private owners, on the understanding that they would be liable to government service at any moment. Effectively they were like the old Lightnings, utility ships that could serve as pickets, commerce raiders, and such like when called upon for war, but were also useful for more dangerous mercantile expeditions. Owners appreciated them because it allowed them extra jump, greater survivability and other such advantages at a tolerable cost.

The Lightnings(and the ships IMTU) could be called semi-corsairs because they could easily be adapted to that purpose.

 

[The Hinterworlds Rambler]

Imtu, the Corsair, the ship, the mustering out benefit, is most likely 1 of several hundred thousand kits that were ordered for a war 300 years ago, and only recently have they started making a comeback. The design, the one with the clamshell had its roots with slavers, with ship to station combatants, and with outright capturing of other ships and xboats. Either that or it was made as a one off of this popular an unknown design. The corsair design also gets sold to small governments. The design is a legend. You are a badass if this is your ride.

A kit can usually be had for half off listed price, which right out of the box can range from "You might need chairs" to a full kitted operations version.
I also allow that it can be built on a C+D starport world as long as at least Eng-3 is on the job. Chop Shops and private clubs tend to buiild them in A+B Ports in seedier areas.

For Vargr, its a ship that has been family owned and maybe built and rebuilt and beat on for generations

 

[jawillroy]

I always had a hard time liking the Corsair. "It's a warship... THAT TRANSFORMS INTO A TRUCK!!!" It always seemed kinda kiddie to me. I couldn't get behind it being a successful "standard design."

 

[HG_B]

I always had a hard time liking the Corsair. "It's a warship... THAT TRANSFORMS INTO A TRUCK!!!" It always seemed kinda kiddie to me. I couldn't get behind it being a successful "standard design."

Yes, the whole extending & retracting of the hull is ridiculous and totally unnecessary.

 

[jawillroy]

Anyhow, if you're going to be purpose-building a ship to operate as a corsair, you could do a sight better than the S4 type P... I'm trying to remember, did that ship have any boats? No?

I remember how, in early sessions, pirate boarding parties would go wrong and the PCs would somehow fight their way into the pirate ship and take it... whereupon it occurred to me that any pirate captain with the brains of a box of rocks (or a patrol cruiser skipper, for that matter) would stand off with the ship's weapons locked and ready, while the boarding party/prize crew went over in a ship's boat. Because, you know, they'd have thought of tricks like that themselves.

You could hardly pick a better ship for a Pyrate Kingthan a C-ship, for that very reason: those cutters can extend your reach pretty nicely. Half the time, they're the ones that should be closing with the prey, anyway: risk your boats before you risk your jump-ready ship! They're good for surface raids, too... "Arr, ha HA! Surrender, peasants! We come for your gold, and GROCERIES!!! You thARR, that zucchini patch looks ripe. HARRRRvest for your life!"

 

[gloriousbattle]

I always had a hard time liking the Corsair. "It's a warship... THAT TRANSFORMS INTO A TRUCK!!!" It always seemed kinda kiddie to me. I couldn't get behind it being a successful "standard design."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLS2N9mHWaw

 

[jawillroy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLS2N9mHWaw

Yup. Like I said: Kiddie.

 

[gloriousbattle]

Anyhow, if you're going to be purpose-building a ship to operate as a corsair, you could do a sight better than the S4 type P... I'm trying to remember, did that ship have any boats? No?

I remember how, in early sessions, pirate boarding parties would go wrong and the PCs would somehow fight their way into the pirate ship and take it... whereupon it occurred to me that any pirate captain with the brains of a box of rocks (or a patrol cruiser skipper, for that matter) would stand off with the ship's weapons locked and ready, while the boarding party/prize crew went over in a ship's boat. Because, you know, they'd have thought of tricks like that themselves.

You could hardly pick a better ship for a Pyrate Kingthan a C-ship, for that very reason: those cutters can extend your reach pretty nicely. Half the time, they're the ones that should be closing with the prey, anyway: risk your boats before you risk your jump-ready ship! They're good for surface raids, too... "Arr, ha HA! Surrender, peasants! We come for your gold, and GROCERIES!!! You thARR, that zucchini patch looks ripe. HARRRRvest for your life!"

And you'd do even better with a Kinunir, and better still with a Lighning Class battleship, but its a question of expense.

However, IIUC, sailing ships that were considered to be corsairs were just whatever vessel that could be grabbed and stuffed to the gills with guns and pirates. They were not a class of ships themselves.

Thus, a Lab ship would probably make a pretty good corsair. It has two hardpoints that could accomodate triple turrets, a pinnace for exactly the use you suggest, and a decent sized cargo bay once all that hokey science equipment is sold for scrap (the scientists you take the ship from will whine when you sell off their stuff, but once you shunt them out the airlock, that problem gets solved too:devil.

 

[HG_B]

and a decent sized cargo bay once all that hokey science equipment is sold for scrap (the scientists you take the ship from will whine when you sell off their stuff, but once you shunt them out the airlock, that problem gets solved too:devil.

:rofl: It would be fun playing a pirate campaign with you.

 

[jawillroy]

Thus, a Lab ship would probably make a pretty good corsair.

I agree! I forget what kind of M-drive the L had, but the Pinnace is pretty zippy: heck, arm the pinnace, stick a computer in if you can, and go after the prey with that. If your pinnace can't take it, committing the mothership to the fight's too expensive a proposition anyhow.

Hmm. I like the idea of ship's-boat pirate tactics, but I'm going to have to smoketest this a little bit.