To Space Opera or to Not Space Opera, That is the Question.

[Murph]

To have a Space Operatic theme to the campaign, or not to have one, that is the question. Hard Science vs Weird Science. Hard Science vs Space Opera level science. I do not mean Space Opera the game, but the whole genre of Space Opera, larger than life heros and villains, vast armadas of starships, or just the hero in their one of a kind Skylark and Lensman ships?

I find I tend towards the more Space Operatic style of gaming, with grand plots, grand villains, and heroic characters taking on the evil overlords...

So do you tend towards Space Opera, or more hard science?

 

[coliver988]

when playing Traveller, I tend to the everyday man and mostly hard(ish) science. I'll play a different game if I want hero-types of characters (playing a Fate-based pulp SF game now which is a lot of fun, but definitely NOT a technically oriented game).

of course, I also prefer low-level games and the small ship universe of Traveller. So my preference to hard science/everyday characters is just an extension of that really.

 

[Spinward Flow]

Speaking just for myself, I find it a more compelling narrative structure to allow Space Opera to the be SETTING, with Big Stuff™ happening in the background ... but not in the foreground where the campaign characters are. It's much more interesting (to me, anyway) if the PC's are effectively "walk on roles" in a Space Opera that's already in progress, rather than being the central focus of that Space Opera. By keeping the PC's as "bit parts" in a larger tapestry, rather than featuring them (prominently) as the Key To Everything™ you can basically have the best of both worlds.

The Space Opera stuff IS THERE ... and the PCs can get caught up in it ... but they aren't the central axis upon which the Space Opera turns. They can participate in the Space Opera and their actions may cause (unforseen) plot twists in how the Space Opera unfolds, but the PCs are not the Load Bearing Main Characters of that Space Opera. They just happen to show up in it from time to time (like running across the stage).

So from my perspective, the best option is a Hard Science foreground with a Space Opera backdrop setting that allows a Referee to move between both form as the campaign progresses and plays out.

Besides, doing that also permits the Applied Phlebotinum outcome, courtesy of the hitherto "unknown to the Space Opera main characters" PC party, who act as wildcards that randomly intersect with the Space Opera plot, rather than as central figures of the Space Opera storyline.



Being regular schmucks who get mixed up in larger events bigger than them is often times way more interesting than being The Chosen One(s)™ foretold by prophecy, destined to become the greatest of-

 

[Murph]

I completely agree there, although I will have the PC's act sometimes as a "spoiler" for the Big Stuff thereby creating enemies for the party, which then forces them to see the patron or ally who can help them along.

 

[Baroun Tardis]

I find I tend towards the more Space Operatic style of gaming, with grand plots, grand villains, and heroic characters taking on the evil overlords...

So do you tend towards Space Opera, or more hard science?

I like hard science for the ships and equipment. I'm detail oriented that way - I'll take the scientific premisises of the setting and squeeze everything out I can to get the 'reality' in place.

When it comes to people, though, I follow realism there... except I figure the people are in the style of Joe Medicine Crow, Audie Murphy, Travis S Taylor, George S Patton....

The shopkeepers and such are regular folks. 99% of the people are just like the 99% you run into every day.

The players and their nemisises are at the right end of the bell curve on 'realism in people' - there's nothing flat out impossible allowed, but if a player is wanting their character to be 'larger than life', then I'll let them do it right up to the limit of what a person can do. If they want to sneak into the Zho base and steal 50 grav-bikes, and they can pull it off, more power to them. If they have a great plan and can turn the tide of battle, become a hero, sure. Roll well, my friend. And if they want to play an astrophysicist who also knows kung fu... then assume a spherical pebble of uniform density is in my hand, and try to snatch it, grasshopper. An Olympic pistol and saber medal winner who is also an Army officer? Your job is not to die for the Imperium, but to make that poor Vargr son of a bitch die for his.

Keep in mind, though, that the guy on the other side of the story is just as realistic as you are....

 

[Grav_Moped]

Here's how I see it.

Traveller's rules are built to support characters who can be Batman or Iron Man, or maybe Spiderman. Basically, ordinary (if in some ways better than average) humans or their alien equivalents, with assistance from technological gadgetry and equipment.

They do not support Superman at all (humans who have inherent superhuman abilities) except by way of referee-tweaking the Psionics rules.

 

[Grav_Moped]

I think that where Traveller intersects space opera can be summed up in this quotation that IIRC opened the novelization of the original Star Wars:

"They were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Naturally they became heroes." - Leia Organa of Alderaan, Senator.

The player characters are not The Chosen One(s). Nor are they The One(s) Foretold by the Prophecy, except by coincidence or connivance ("If someone asks you if you are a god, say 'yes'!").

They may well have great power, wealth, or other resources that qualifiy them for selection for a particularly significant mission or role. But they're still basically within the range of human (or the equivalent) abilities.

 

[Grav_Moped]

As far as the technological part of space opera, I like things to at least look like hard SF -- that is, unless specifically declared otherwise, physics works "normally". Drives may break thermodynamics, or ignore issues of waste heat or laser beam dispersal, but those are the things you agree to up front, and they do so in internally-consistent ways. Economics should work that way, too, mostly. Make the effort!

If you want D&D with a coating of technobabble so your fantasy setting is just re-labled as "sufficiently advanced technology," there are much better game systems for that.

 

[Condottiere]

 

[Murph]

Since I run essentially a Cyberpunk character system, the characters are all fairly high points, and they usually end up in the wrong place at the wrong time, with an "Oh no, Not Again!" sort of vibe. Most of them just do not really respect authority. The classic "Black Globe Generator Drill" is one of them.

They land at a starport close to the Naval base, and are seen unloading/loading what appears to be a Black Globe system into the ship. When the Navy/Marines show up, they open the "black globe" and it is a turbo flush with someone sitting on it taking care of the...paperwork. That is the level of disdain for authority my guys show.

 

[Dragoner]

So do you tend towards Space Opera, or more hard science?

Hard science, pc's are ordinary people doing extraordinary things. Usually they wind up somewhere between grit, and grift "enacting bold plans for the acquisition of wealth and power."

 

[Spinward Flow]

Hard science, pc's are ordinary people doing extraordinary things.

Note that this is more in tune with the Asian Hero's Journey where "random people from all walks of life" have it within them to do extraordinary things (if they answer the call) ... just not at first and they have to EARN their way climbing up the power ladder.

Compare that to the Western Hero's Journey where most heroes were "awesome from the start" and don't have as far to climb going up the power ladder (especially after their origin story is over).

It's kind of the difference between rolling a 1 and rolling a 6 for your move on the first turn.
Catching up from a "lesser start" is actually more exciting to watch, because your characters don't get to start with overwhelming advantages (getting handed to them to shortcut the process of growing).

 

[Grav_Moped]

Note that this is more in tune with the Asian Hero's Journey where "random people from all walks of life" have it within them to do extraordinary things (if they answer the call) ... just not at first and they have to EARN their way climbing up the power ladder.

Compare that to the Western Hero's Journey where most heroes were "awesome from the start" and don't have as far to climb going up the power ladder (especially after their origin story is over).

It's kind of the difference between rolling a 1 and rolling a 6 for your move on the first turn.
Catching up from a "lesser start" is actually more exciting to watch, because your characters don't get to start with overwhelming advantages (getting handed to them to shortcut the process of growing).

Agreed, but the characters do start with part (or all) of a career's worth of job experience.

 

[Ulsyus]

I think I’m within a standard deviation with this: my last couple of groups were well skilled and stated, had the opportunity to do great and heroic things, we’re just one ship crew in a larger amazing setting. Hard-ish science, but with an emphasis on the tempo and integrity of the scenario plot so the players feel a little pressure in their need to make decisions

 

[RogerD]

I think the sweet spot for Traveller is best exemplified by Pournelle, especially Falkenberg’s Legion and The Mote in Gods Eye. There is certainly some magic in the starships, but it generally works as you might expect given a few assumption changes.

The Expanse is a bit more magical, but bears some similarity. Firefly is closer and probably best represents the free trader of the sci fi I am familiar with.

I don’t consider any of those to be Space Opera, but none of them are hard science either. They are someplace in between.

 

[Grav_Moped]

with an emphasis on the tempo and integrity of the scenario plot so the players feel a little pressure in their need to make decisions

Which gives the characters in a play-by-post game a real superpower: snap decisions in game time can be the result of hours or even days of player deliberations!

 

[Condottiere]

The creator of Firefly supposedly played Traveller in college.

Alien, Aliens, A New Hope is supposedly realistically gritty.

 

[Ulsyus]

A New Hope is supposedly realistically gritty.

Take away the light Sabres and the moon-sized battle station, replace the hyperdrive with Jump (the autocorrect readily fixed the spelling of hyperdrive for me!) & you could probably run the game easily with Traveller

 

[whulorigan]

I think the sweet spot for Traveller is best exemplified by Pournelle, especially Falkenberg’s Legion and The Mote in Gods Eye. There is certainly some magic in the starships, but it generally works as you might expect given a few assumption changes.

The Expanse is a bit more magical, but bears some similarity. Firefly is closer and probably best represents the free trader of the sci fi I am familiar with.

I don’t consider any of those to be Space Opera, but none of them are hard science either. They are someplace in between.

"Hard Space-Opera".

 

[mike wightman]

Artificial gravity, acceleration compensation, magic thermodynamics, jump drive, man portable laser weapons, null grav modules, psionics.
Not seeing much hard science in that list...