Book 6 Scouts p 33 errata?
- Thread starter Matt123
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Just a little further on in the checklist, step 6, Generate satellites within system.
Plus a difference in the inner zone DM -2 for planets, -4 for satellites? (errata already corrects 4C outer zone DM to -4).
I don't know if its wrong, just that it looks "odd".
the same bit in bold.
Plus a difference in the inner zone DM -2 for planets, -4 for satellites? (errata already corrects 4C outer zone DM to -4).
I don't know if its wrong, just that it looks "odd".
I think it means that if you get an atmo of 2 or greater in the outer zone, then you roll 2D6. If this second roll is a 12, then you replace the current rolled atmosphere with atmosphere category A.
I think they put it in to model the atmosphere of Titan. Check the example of the Terran system at the back of the book to see what I mean.
Cheers
Richard
I think they put it in to model the atmosphere of Titan. Check the example of the Terran system at the back of the book to see what I mean.
Cheers
Richard
It doesn't mean that at all - it's explained on page 36:
Size is not a factor here - if you're rolling for atmosphere (i.e. any world that is size 1 or more), then there on a roll of 12 it will have atm A if it is two or more orbits beyond the... wait. The text is wrong - it should be referring to the OUTER ZONE orbit, not the Habitable zone.
So in our solar system , the first outer zone orbit is orbit 4 (which is wrong, but that's another matter...). Therefore, if you have a size 1+ moon or planet in orbit 6 or higher, it has this chance to have atm A.
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Gray Lensman
SOC-13
From The MegaTraveller Referee's Manual, page 28, step 31 (Bold Italics Mine)
"Roll
"Roll
2D-7 + Size for Atmosphere If inner zone, DM-2 If outer zone, DM-4. If World Size 0, Atmosphere is 0 If the world is at least 2 orbits beyond the habitable zone, roll 2D for 12 exactly if the roll succeeds, Atmosphere is A"
I know the DMs are different, but I think this was the original meaning for the roll of 12.
I know the DMs are different, but I think this was the original meaning for the roll of 12.
So is that an error propagated through editions by bad editing? Either it's "two or more orbits beyond the Outer Zone" as implied by the CT Checklist, or it's "two or more orbits beyond the Habitable Zone" as described the text in CT and MT.
As an aside, Mars today has atm A (it is described in Book 6 as atm 3 though - the only possible explanation for this is that it was terraformed at some point?).
Mars is a size 4 world, so on a 2d-7 roll the maximum atmosphere possible is 4+(12-7)= atm 9. If you include modifiers for the outer zone, then the max atm is actually 9-4 = 5. Mars is also (as described in CT) one orbit beyond the Habitable Zone, and in the first orbit of the Outer Zone; therefore, it cannot use the special rule of "if at least two orbits beyond (any) zone, roll 12 for atm A".
So it seems that the CT worldgen cannot roll up Mars as it is today! (Perhaps one could argue that Mars' atmosphere is actually Trace (atm 1) though?).
Either way the CT worldgen is very outdated given what we know today. Is it even worth correcting a relatively minor thing like this when the whole system is irrelevant now?
As an aside, Mars today has atm A (it is described in Book 6 as atm 3 though - the only possible explanation for this is that it was terraformed at some point?).
Mars is a size 4 world, so on a 2d-7 roll the maximum atmosphere possible is 4+(12-7)= atm 9. If you include modifiers for the outer zone, then the max atm is actually 9-4 = 5. Mars is also (as described in CT) one orbit beyond the Habitable Zone, and in the first orbit of the Outer Zone; therefore, it cannot use the special rule of "if at least two orbits beyond (any) zone, roll 12 for atm A".
So it seems that the CT worldgen cannot roll up Mars as it is today! (Perhaps one could argue that Mars' atmosphere is actually Trace (atm 1) though?).
Either way the CT worldgen is very outdated given what we know today. Is it even worth correcting a relatively minor thing like this when the whole system is irrelevant now?
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I can see it being Trace, as defined in CT.
However Mars has no oxygen in its atmosphere, so it can never be "Very Thin" according to CT definition; there's no oxygen to 'compress' to make it breathable. Furthermore, protective suits are always necessary since it's so cold there, which is another strike against it ever being classified as "Very Thin".
Your logic is only valid if you're using pressure to define atmospheric type, which is not how CT defines it. Even then, Mars is not Very Thin by Pressure definitions in later products (e.g. WBH) since the average pressures on Mars are around 7 millibars or 0.007 atms, which is actually less than the lowest Trace atm pressure (0.01 atm) from WBH. At most it may edge above 0.01 atms in the lowest parts of the Hellas impact basin, but that's about it. So even using those pressure tables, it barely even counts as Trace.
However Mars has no oxygen in its atmosphere, so it can never be "Very Thin" according to CT definition; there's no oxygen to 'compress' to make it breathable. Furthermore, protective suits are always necessary since it's so cold there, which is another strike against it ever being classified as "Very Thin".
Your logic is only valid if you're using pressure to define atmospheric type, which is not how CT defines it. Even then, Mars is not Very Thin by Pressure definitions in later products (e.g. WBH) since the average pressures on Mars are around 7 millibars or 0.007 atms, which is actually less than the lowest Trace atm pressure (0.01 atm) from WBH. At most it may edge above 0.01 atms in the lowest parts of the Hellas impact basin, but that's about it. So even using those pressure tables, it barely even counts as Trace.
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Steps 4c & 6c
Can I suggest an errata change to Step 4c and 6c. Change the last sentence to (planet & satellite neutral to enable it to be used in both corrections);
"If the orbit is at least two beyond the habitable zone, throw 12 for atmosphere A."
Edit.... Also applies to pg 24, step 12 C. ....end Edit
I'm not sure why planets and satellites would get different modifiers for being in the inner zone. (DM -2 for planets, DM -4 for satellites). They are treated the same in the habitable zone and outer zone. Any thoughts here?
credit to Fusor for finding what I couldn't
Can I suggest an errata change to Step 4c and 6c. Change the last sentence to (planet & satellite neutral to enable it to be used in both corrections);
"If the orbit is at least two beyond the habitable zone, throw 12 for atmosphere A."
Edit.... Also applies to pg 24, step 12 C. ....end Edit
I'm not sure why planets and satellites would get different modifiers for being in the inner zone. (DM -2 for planets, DM -4 for satellites). They are treated the same in the habitable zone and outer zone. Any thoughts here?
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Here's another oddity;
Step 4E, planet population
Edit... also pg 24, step 12 E. ...end Edit.
I'm picking the negative population modifier should apply to all worlds that do not have an "ideal" atmosphere. Which counts out 0 (vacuum worlds).
Can I suggest it be errated to;
"If not atmosphere 5, 6 or 8, DM-2."
Unless I'm missing something
Step 4E, planet population
Edit... also pg 24, step 12 E. ...end Edit.
I'm picking the negative population modifier should apply to all worlds that do not have an "ideal" atmosphere. Which counts out 0 (vacuum worlds).
Can I suggest it be errated to;
"If not atmosphere 5, 6 or 8, DM-2."
Unless I'm missing something
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Don't know if it makes sense or not. Do know its errata'd this way in two other places in Don's Consolidated Errata. This one was missed.
Another one.
Scouts page 22, refers to;
"Spectral types 0 and B are extremely rare and will not normally be encountered. As a result, although they are on the column for generation, it is impossible to achieve these results."
Scouts page 28, System Features table;
Lists Primary type B twice, I suspect it should be O (on a die roll 0), followed by B (on a die roll 1).
Scouts page 22, refers to;
"Spectral types 0 and B are extremely rare and will not normally be encountered. As a result, although they are on the column for generation, it is impossible to achieve these results."
Scouts page 28, System Features table;
Lists Primary type B twice, I suspect it should be O (on a die roll 0), followed by B (on a die roll 1).
Another one;
Scouts pg 36; Satellite Orbits.
Satellite Orbits: Satellites orbit their planets at various radii. Place individual satellites into orbits using the satellite orbits table. Throw 2D for orbit type (7- is close, 8+ is far); apply a DM to each throw after the first equal to the throw number minus 1. Thus, the first throw is without a DM, the second has a DM -1, the third has a DM -2, etc. If the planet is a gas giant, then 12 + calls for use of the extreme column of the table.
The indicated DM's should be DM+1 & DM+2. It should also be clearer that the modifier applies to the "orbit type" roll, not the roll on the various orbit tables. As it stands the existing negative DM's would mean the extreme column on the "orbit types" table is never used and that the close orbit range gets very crowded...
I suggest the errata should read;
"apply a DM to each orbit type throw after the first equal to the throw number -1. Thus the first roll is without a DM, the second has a DM+1, the third has a DM+2, etc."
Scouts pg 36; Satellite Orbits.
Satellite Orbits: Satellites orbit their planets at various radii. Place individual satellites into orbits using the satellite orbits table. Throw 2D for orbit type (7- is close, 8+ is far); apply a DM to each throw after the first equal to the throw number minus 1. Thus, the first throw is without a DM, the second has a DM -1, the third has a DM -2, etc. If the planet is a gas giant, then 12 + calls for use of the extreme column of the table.
The indicated DM's should be DM+1 & DM+2. It should also be clearer that the modifier applies to the "orbit type" roll, not the roll on the various orbit tables. As it stands the existing negative DM's would mean the extreme column on the "orbit types" table is never used and that the close orbit range gets very crowded...
I suggest the errata should read;
"apply a DM to each orbit type throw after the first equal to the throw number -1. Thus the first roll is without a DM, the second has a DM+1, the third has a DM+2, etc."
This one is probably just me, but a clarification may be in order.
Scouts pg 26; Size table
The size indicated in miles (km) is the planets diameter.
Scouts pg 28; Satellite Orbits
Possibly should read...
"Distance in central planet radii (planet size in miles or km divided by 2)."
Yeah I know, my maths ain't great. I had to google the earths diameter to figure out what the Size table showed.
...errr hold up...
A ring at orbit distance 1, is within the planet...
Is it more plausible that the Satellite Orbits errata should read;
"Distance in central planet diameters." ???
Scouts pg 26; Size table
The size indicated in miles (km) is the planets diameter.
Scouts pg 28; Satellite Orbits
Possibly should read...
"Distance in central planet radii (planet size in miles or km divided by 2)."
Yeah I know, my maths ain't great. I had to google the earths diameter to figure out what the Size table showed.
...errr hold up...
A ring at orbit distance 1, is within the planet...
Is it more plausible that the Satellite Orbits errata should read;
"Distance in central planet diameters." ???
I wouldn't say its broken, it was ground breaking in its day. It just has some issues.
The main reason for posting these is because Don likes to collect this stuff for his errata.
FWIW, I own both World Builders Handbook & First In. But when doing a CT project (& most of my efforts are CT based), I use CT material.
The main reason for posting these is because Don likes to collect this stuff for his errata.
FWIW, I own both World Builders Handbook & First In. But when doing a CT project (& most of my efforts are CT based), I use CT material.
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