Empress Wave Resources
- Thread starter The Pakkrat
- Start date
I don't know if anything in the Lorenverse has been directly contradicted in the same manner.
The retcon of the Wave completely overwrites my version of it, and since elements of the 1248 setting were based upon that interpretation, they're dead too. Other stuff is more questionable, but I don't see how the states of 1248 as published could possibly exist in a period when the apocalyptic steamroller wave was surging through former Imperial space.
The Lorenverse isn't as directly smashed flat by the change, I don't think.
The retcon of the Wave completely overwrites my version of it, and since elements of the 1248 setting were based upon that interpretation, they're dead too. Other stuff is more questionable, but I don't see how the states of 1248 as published could possibly exist in a period when the apocalyptic steamroller wave was surging through former Imperial space.
The Lorenverse isn't as directly smashed flat by the change, I don't think.
Pre-wave, I agree. However the goal of the Lorenverse (If I understood correctly) was to save the Third Imperium of the Classic Era by avoiding the Rebellion and Virus. It sounds like the Empress Wave will roll through and Zombie Apocalypse the Third Imperium after all. The Lorenverse just bought a few decades stay of execution, not a full pardon.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Perhaps the point of departure of the Lorenverse is the Empress Wave was never initiated thousands of years ago...
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Now that is an interesting idea...
If the Wave follows an inverse square (or inverse cube for a sphere) law, and these are the effects HERE ... just imagine what things are like as you get closer to the point of origin!
I need to go and read up on my 1248 material. Was the wave discussed anywhere in particular or spread out?. I think that Rebellion and Virus were bad enough, why steamroller what's left? Atpollard has a point, how much stronger was the wave to begin with and how fast is it fading, or is it?
Many of the 3I's fans have come to see it as a straight-jacket.
Some of the brilliant work done highlights this effect...
GURPS Traveller detailed the late 3I beyond playable levels.
Travellermap has basic UWPs for every world in more than 35 sectors.
At one point, many of us thought of the Sunbane/GEnie archive as a good thing... then, trying to use it later... came to feel different.
The Land Grant system in the CT run... those subsectors and sectors have a sense of being something special. The Subsectors moreso than the Sectors... more hand massaged data.
GEnie/Sunbane data outside those 6 sectors or so, was pretty impersonal feeling, lacking in that sense of life. There's some gems hidden - cases where raw random did some interesting things.
But the open space that was the 3I of the late 80's (even in MT) and early 90's (and into TNE) was gone by 1997, with M0 detailing and canonizing the Sunbane data...
It's not just Traveller that has collapsed under its own weight of canon. Both L5R and most of the D&D settings. (The realms have been retconned all to hell and back.)
Yes 1248 devotes a few pages in two of the books. They are available in the TNE-2 CD ROM from the FFE website.
That was all very well put, well said. I've been struggling with how to explain my love of the canon 3I and interest in seeing new information and books related to it, but my general lack of desire to actually play in it anymore.
D.
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
Heh, reminds me of why many audiophiles prefer analog to digital, for the warmer sound.
Turns out in order to fit all the audio data into the lesser data storage dB range that recording engineers gave a personal touch to the final product, making artistic choices.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
It's ten megs a minute, give or take.
I've seen files that may be three or our times that size.
I've seen files that may be three or our times that size.
Going back and reviewing timing, :coffeegulp: :coffeegulp: figured out some factoids because of the speed change.:coffeesip:
Additonal data point confirms at 1 pc/year
The year for the "Wave of Craziness" chapter in the AotI novel is 434. If travellermap has the sector placed right (i'm pretty sure inexorabletash got it right), the date and distance corroborates the FTL speed of about 1pc/year with and to hit Zhdant in late 1100's. This being the case, I guess Mr. Miller likes it that way.
The Wave is a recent phenomena, having began 10,000 years or sooner.
I base this from distance to the galactic core. If that ring/ray thing and Reference being the 10,000th ring that is more or less fact, then 10000 parsecs to the galactic core, so 10000 years ago. The factors altering the calculation are how much closer or further from the core the Yaskodri were. The closer they were the sooner it happened. The propagation speed does not invalidate the cause MJD wrote about, just the timing
Now checking revised speed vs distance where the wave is vs the date of the Expeditions to determine how far back the Zhodani should have known about the Wave.
A chilling thought since you are all accepting now of MgT as canon (which it is).
Additonal data point confirms at 1 pc/year
The year for the "Wave of Craziness" chapter in the AotI novel is 434. If travellermap has the sector placed right (i'm pretty sure inexorabletash got it right), the date and distance corroborates the FTL speed of about 1pc/year with and to hit Zhdant in late 1100's. This being the case, I guess Mr. Miller likes it that way.
The Wave is a recent phenomena, having began 10,000 years or sooner.
I base this from distance to the galactic core. If that ring/ray thing and Reference being the 10,000th ring that is more or less fact, then 10000 parsecs to the galactic core, so 10000 years ago. The factors altering the calculation are how much closer or further from the core the Yaskodri were. The closer they were the sooner it happened. The propagation speed does not invalidate the cause MJD wrote about, just the timing
Now checking revised speed vs distance where the wave is vs the date of the Expeditions to determine how far back the Zhodani should have known about the Wave.
A chilling thought since you are all accepting now of MgT as canon (which it is).
- What if the true purpose of the Yaskodri was Grandfather's equivalent of Project Longbow to find his "sons"?
- What if the Zhodani activation of the Toliak allowed Seven (the "son" from Secrets of the Ancients) find and determine the Yaskodri homeworld?
- Oh let's drop a TL 29 Starkiller in the Galactic Core so Seven is not spied on amymore.
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When Don asked me to update the chart on the Empress Wave page based upon the 1 Parsec per year, I went through the Core Expeditions. The Fifth core expedition (-1130) would have encountered the wave. It could be argued, and Don did argue, the Zhodani didn't know what they had encountered and thought it a local phenomena.
There is no reasonable argument that the 6th expedition did not figure this out. They have a thousand years worth of data and worlds to compare and discover the effects. The Zhodani have known about the wave since the founding of the Third Imperium, and suspected it for a thousand year before that.
They didn't want to jump to any hasty conclusions like the Vilani would have
, so they were taking things slow and careful. Fortunately, they had the ability to calm the easily excited few who saw this as a problem."Enhance your calm, citizen. Your government has everything under control and is carefully considering all possible solutions."
But canon is only significant if you want to publish (or feel an abiding need to adhere to it). Just because Traveller Map has captured 35 sectors of data doesn't mean anyone has to follow it individually. I feel like this point keeps getting lost and contributes to the impression among gamers that Traveller players and refs are a hidebound lot.
From private communication with Marc: we may have the sector off by a bit on the map to get the numbers exactly right. On the list of things to investigate/fix.
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