MGT Only: Fighters in Combat

[McPerth]

Since the barrage system took the damage dice of the weapon as a positive DM and there was no size modifier, it was advantageous for big guns, aka bays.

There's no DM for size, but there's a -4 DM to attack fighter wings (MgT1E:HG, page 80).

Also, the high speed of light fighters make them quite likely to reach close range, where any long range weapon has a -3 (but they have only a -1, as they use the "small craft shooting" column for close range (page 73 table), and if they use the "Fast Strafing Run" order (page 81, 4 initiative cost)m they shoot at +2DM and are shot at -2 DM).

See that the fighter shown in this post would be fired at -19 DM (-15 due to armor, -4 for fighter wings).

Example:

Let's imagine that a wing of 100 such fighters, 5 equal fighters armed with pulse lasers and 5 more with sandcasters (for wing defense), with crews skill pilot2 and gunner 1 (acting as 1 and 0 respectively, as they use both at once) attack Planet Class Heavy Cruiser (MgT1E:HG page 119) with +3 Crew quality. The fighters Dodge whi lthe approach:

Approach:

the cruiser:

• fires its meson bays at -3 DM (+8 per dice, +2 per improvements, +3 per crew quality, +5 per fire control), but can only kill 10 fighters (one per gunner, so I guess one per bay).
• Fires the torpedos at -5 (as they have 6 dice, asuming nukes, and no improvement DMs), but the point defenses subtract 2d-3 more.
• Fires the PBs at -8 (same as mesons, but only 3 dice damage)
• Fires the lasers at -10 (as they only have 1 die damage), so ineffective.
• Fires the missiles at -11 (assuming they are nukes, as they have 2 dice damage, but no improvement DMs).

The fighters:
Fire their PBs at -4 DM (-10 per armor, +3 per dice, +3 FC), -6 if the cruiser is dodging. If the crews have.

Once at close range:

All cruiser weapons are subject to an additional -3, and missiles (and I guess torpedoes) cannot be used; so only the Mesons can be effective, but fire at -6

The fighters fire at -5 (-7 if the cruiser is dodging).

If strafing:

The cruiser bays are at additional -2, so firing at -8

The fighters fire at -3/-5.

And the fighters wing about MCr 3300 in total, while the cruiser costs MCr 55537. Assuming the same Budget and 66% of the fighter's one needed for carriers, the wing could be about 600 fighters....

Of course, against the armor 15 BB shown in page 101 the situation is less bright for the fighters, but the Budget is increased to MCr 138236, so, with the same premises (33% of th ebudget spent in fighters), about 1500 fighters could attack it...

 

[AnotherDilbert]

There's no DM for size, but there's a -4 DM to attack fighter wings (MgT1E:HG, page 80).

It's also optional: you can always fire at individual fighters.

See that the fighter shown in this post would be fired at -19 DM (-15 due to armor, -4 for fighter wings).

OK.

But why such a ridiculous ship? We just agreed meson bays were a bad choice with the barrage system.

Let's take this instead:

It's certainly not optimised to kill fighters...

At MCr 6000 it's about equal budget to 100 of your fighters with a carrier?


Let's start at Distant range:
The ship fires at
Barbettes: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -5. This is 42% chance to kill 14 (limited by turret gunners) fighters for an average of 6 fighters.
Barbettes, individual: -2[range] +0[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] = -6. This is 30 × 28% chance to kill a fighter for an average of 8 fighters.
Bays: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +9[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = ±0 this is 12 fighters killed per round.
Totally about 20 fighters are killed each round, so all fighters are killed after 5 rounds.

At 12 G against my slow capital 2 G (+dodge) you can decrease the range by ~8 each turn while dodging. It will take 50 / 8 ≈ 7 turns to close in to Very Long.

The fighter will never reach Very Long range, much less Short range...

The fighters fire at:
Turret: -4[range] +2[software] +2[Acc,HYield] -2[dodge] +0[skill] +3[dice] -15[armour] = -6 giving an average damage of about 24 damage, killing the ship in about 71 × 4 / 24 ≈ 12 turns.

The fighters will have inflicted about 75 damage before they are wiped out.


Sorry if I have forgotten something, it was awhile since MgT1...


If we assume that Fire Control software applies to all attacks, not just one, the barbettes would attack 30 individual fighters, killing about 27 fighters for a total of 39 fighters per turn.

Edit: I just realised I can't do 30 attacks with 14 gunners.

 

[McPerth]

It's also optional: you can always fire at individual fighters.

Sure, if you have the time for so many rolls (or if you resort to stastical results, but I hate them).

OK.

But why such a ridiculous ship? We just agreed meson bays were a bad choice with the barrage system.

Well, it was one of the ships in the MgT:HG...

And personally I guess we agreed we found an errata (mesons should not be affected by armour), not that mesons are a bad choice....

Let's take this instead:

It's certainly not optimised to kill fighters...

At MCr 6000 it's about equal budget to 100 of your fighters with a carrier?

I guess so...

Let's start at Distant range:

See that at Distant range the sensors (MB, page 144) only allow for visual and termal minimal results, defined as basic outline of objects for visual (size irrlevant, it seems) and hot and cold overall for termal.

Would that be enough for a lock on?

In any case, I cannot find any sensor need in combat rules ...

In any case, MB page 146 talks about combats begining at long range (unless near a planet, where it would be short or médium)

The ship fires at
Barbettes: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -5. This is 42% chance to kill 14 (limited by turret gunners) fighters for an average of 6 fighters.

My math is -2+5+2-2+3+4-15-4= -9...

If so, only with a 12 result they will have a 10% result (as the total barrage is 52, that would be 5 fighters)

Barbettes, individual: -2[range] +0[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] = -6. This is 30 × 28% chance to kill a fighter for an average of 8 fighters.

If firing individual, the DMs would be -2 (range), -2 (Dodge) +3 skill, as neither the dice, armor of fighter wing DMs do not apply. So they will hit on a 9+, and each hit must roll 4 dice (1 and 2 count as 3, as it's very high Yeld) for a 16+ to kill the fighter.

Bays: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +9[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = ±0 this is 12 fighters killed per round.

Again, my math is -2+5+2-2+3+9-15-4 = -4. Sitll good, but not so much...

Totally about 20 fighters are killed each round, so all fighters are killed after 5 rounds.

At 12 G against my slow capital 2 G (+dodge) you can decrease the range by ~8 each turn while dodging. It will take 50 / 8 ≈ 7 turns to close in to Very Long.

The fighter will never reach Very Long range, much less Short range...

The fighters fire at:
Turret: -4[range] +2[software] +2[Acc,HYield] -2[dodge] +0[skill] +3[dice] -15[armour] = -6 giving an average damage of about 24 damage, killing the ship in about 71 × 4 / 24 ≈ 12 turns.

Again, my math difers: -4+2+2-2+3-15 = 14, so being fully ineffective at those ranges (in fact, until they can close to straffing runs, if they can)

Of course, if they begin at very long, the DMs for range change, but fighters will close in about 3 rounds, and be at close in about 3 more...

 

[Blue Ghost]

Are you using T5 or MT rules for that build?

 

[McPerth]

Are you using T5 or MT rules for that build?

If you're asking to AnotherDIlbert or to me, we're using MgT1E.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Okay, it looked very familiar but also much different from classic ship design. More vetted.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Sure, if you have the time for so many rolls (or if you resort to stastical results, but I hate them).

I would resort to statistical or software after just a few rolls...

And personally I guess we agreed we found an errata (mesons should not be affected by armour), not that mesons are a bad choice....

Sorry I misunderstood. My hit rate yesterday seems to be quite low.

Mesons should not be affected by armour of course, but that would make them completely unbalanced, without any effective defence before TL14 - 15. I such case we would have to find some balancing factor...

See that at Distant range the sensors (MB, page 144) only allow for visual and termal minimal results, defined as basic outline of objects for visual (size irrlevant, it seems) and hot and cold overall for termal.

...

In any case, MB page 146 talks about combats begining at long range (unless near a planet, where it would be short or médium)

I run simple logic: If I'm at war and see warships that refuse to identify themselves I fire.
We can hit at Distant range, so I start to fire at Distant range.
Starting at shorter range would require exceptional circumstances.

My math is -2+5+2-2+3+4-15-4= -9...

If so, only with a 12 result they will have a 10% result (as the total barrage is 52, that would be 5 fighters)

You are correct, I seem to have consistently flipped the sign of the range modifier. All my calculations were completely wrong, well, time to start over I guess...

If firing individual, the DMs would be -2 (range), -2 (Dodge) +3 skill, as neither the dice, armor of fighter wing DMs do not apply.

A barrage can be very small, it is simply all the weapons of the same type fired on the same target.
With 100 enemy fighters there is no lack of targets, so each barbette can fire a barrage on an individual fighter (with enough gunners).

You are right, we can also use basic attacks, another alternative to evaluate...


Ok, let's see if I can do better:
Let's start at Distant range:
The ship fires at
Bays: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +9[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -4, so we need to roll 7+ to kill 12 fighters for an average of 7 fighters per round.

Barbettes: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -9. This is 2.8% chance to kill 14 (limited by turret gunners) fighters for an average of 0.4 fighters.
Barbettes, 15 barrages of 2: -2[range] +1[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +4[dice] -15[armour] = -9. This is 15 × 2.8% chance to kill a fighter for an average of 0.4 fighters.
Barbettes, 15 basic: -2[range] +1[software] -2[dodge] +3[skill] = ±0. This is 15 × 42% × 55% chance to kill a fighter for an average of 3.5 fighters.

Totally about 10 fighters are killed each round.

At 12 G against my slow capital 2 G (+dodge) you can decrease the range by ~8 each turn while dodging. It will take 50 / 8 ≈ 7 turns to close in to Very Long and another 3 rounds to Long range.

All fighters are killed before reaching Long range.



Let's try this instead:

With 3 × Reinforced hull it takes 9 + 1 points of damage to kill it.
And it has a gunner.

Its about 50% more expensive and 50% larger (so more expensive carrier). Let's say we get 65 of these for 100 of the 10 Dt fighters.

The ship fires at
Bays: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +9[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -4, for an average of 5 fighters per round.

Barbettes, 15 basic: -2[range] +1[software] -2[dodge] +3[skill] = ±0. This is 15 × 42% × 2.67 = 16.8 damage for an average of 1.7 fighters.

Totally about 7 fighters are killed each round.


The fighters fire at (65 barrage attacks since the ship can't dodge 65 times):
Turret: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] +3[skill] +3[dice] -15[armour] = -4 giving an average damage of about 0.26 × 3 × 65 = 50 damage.

Since we lose some fighters each round we do less damage every round:
1: 50
2: 45
3: 39
4: 34
5: 28
6: 23
7: 18
8: 12
9: 5
for a total of 254 damage of 284. The ship barely survives, killing all fighters.

The fighters do better, but still lose...

 

[pendragonman]

Gentlemen,

It will still come down to the basic design philosophy of each navy. Anyone can make a specific type of ship that counters the other guys advantage. The real skill is your fleet mix and how you assign ships where for your meeting engagements.

Fleet carriers will not always find targets vulnerable to fighters, nor will they always run into target optimized to kill fighters.

And without a fleet logistics requirement there is no cost to firing even if you only hit on boxcars.

 

[Blue Ghost]

If you're asking to AnotherDIlbert or to me, we're using MgT1E.

One more question, is that from the basic rules or from the MgT equivalent of HG?

 

[McPerth]

I would resort to statistical or software after just a few rolls...

As I already said, this is something I don't like to, but it's only a matter of taste, not something wrong

I run simple logic: If I'm at war and see warships that refuse to identify themselves I fire.
We can hit at Distant range, so I start to fire at Distant range.
Starting at shorter range would require exceptional circumstances.

But rules specify that combat begins at Distant. I gues that's due to sensor locking capabilities, as, as I said, the sensors at Long range are quite ineffective. Don't ask me how can they fire at long distance, I guess that's against already detected and locked fleeing units.

Unfortunately, no sensor using rules are in the rules for combat (or at least I have not found them).

Let's try this instead:

With 3 × Reinforced hull it takes 9 + 1 points of damage to kill it.
And it has a gunner.

Its about 50% more expensive and 50% larger (so more expensive carrier). Let's say we get 65 of these for 100 of the 10 Dt fighters.

You ninja'd me, as I was reading a similar design, with gunner and better hardware (and software, off course).

As your cockpit is only 1.5 dtons, where is the gunner fit? According the small ship design rules (HG page 60) A cockpit takes 1.5 tons per crewmemeber .

The ship fires at
Bays: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] -2[dodge] +3[skill] +9[dice] -15[armour] -4[flight] = -4, for an average of 5 fighters per round.

Barbettes, 15 basic: -2[range] +1[software] -2[dodge] +3[skill] = ±0. This is 15 × 42% × 2.67 = 16.8 damage for an average of 1.7 fighters.

Totally about 7 fighters are killed each round.


The fighters fire at (65 barrage attacks since the ship can't dodge 65 times):
Turret: -2[range] +5[software] +2[VHYield] +3[skill] +3[dice] -15[armour] = -4 giving an average damage of about 0.26 × 3 × 65 = 50 damage.

Since we lose some fighters each round we do less damage every round:
1: 50
2: 45
3: 39
4: 34
5: 28
6: 23
7: 18
8: 12
9: 5
for a total of 254 damage of 284. The ship barely survives, killing all fighters.

The fighters do better, but still lose...

I'm afraid you forgot some rules about how damage is applied (after all, you already warned that you might, as it was a longtime since you used those rules):

For small crafts, the damage is multiplied by 3, so the 5 fighers per round for the bays would be 15 (in fact 12, due to the gunners limitations), and the 1.7 from the barbettes would be 5 (see that this reduces de advantage of the reinforced hulls, at least against high dice weapons).

For the capital ships, you forget the System Damage, that is likely to reduce its offensive power.

And remember that the fighters may also divide themselves into several flights, so reducing their losses against massive barrages...

 

[McPerth]

One more question, is that from the basic rules or from the MgT equivalent of HG?

MgT1E High Guard.

On the basic Core Book ship combat is diferently handled, and barrages do not exist.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

But rules specify that combat begins at Distant. I gues that's due to sensor locking capabilities, as, as I said, the sensors at Long range are quite ineffective. Don't ask me how can they fire at long distance, I guess that's against already detected and locked fleeing units.

If two vessels randomly encounter each other while travelling, the encounter will begin at Very Long range.

I think this applies more to tramp freighters than military operations.

Unfortunately, no sensor using rules are in the rules for combat (or at least I have not found them).

The sensor system seems simple:

Compare the range something is to the sensing ship with the sensors being used and look up the result on the Detail By Sensors table (overleaf).

Core, p143.

The Dice Modifier applies to jamming and counter-jamming attempts.

Core, p108.
No rolls involved, you see what is there.

As your cockpit is only 1.5 dtons, where is the gunner fit? According the small ship design rules (HG page 60) A cockpit takes 1.5 tons per crewmemeber .

In the turret, as usual?
Rechecking the rules a cockpit seems required for the gunner, despite having a perfectly good workstation in the turret.
That would reduce the 15 Dt fighter to 6 hull points, so 7 hull + structure.
Or 12 + 1 = 13 at 20 Dt and M-4.
A 40 Dt fighter can still have 13 + 2 = 15 hull + structure.
Reinforced hull does not work against mesons, so we are still vulnerable...

For small crafts, the damage is multiplied by 3, so the 5 fighers per sound for the bays would be 15 (in fact 12, due to the gunners limitations),

I think 5 fighters is correct:
A barrage at -4 does damage at a roll of 7+. For a roll of 7 it does 12 × 9 × 3 × 10% = 32 damage or 3 fighters, that roll has a 6/36 chance so contributes 3.2 / 6 = 0.54 fighters to the average. We only kill 12 fighters on a roll of 9+. Summing up all possible rolls I get an average of 5 fighters.

and the 1.7 from the barbettes would be 5 (see that this reduces de advantage of the reinforced hulls, at least against high dice weapons).

Sigh, yes that is wrong (again). As basic attacks they do basic damage. If they penetrate armour (55%) they do an average of 2.67 damage leading to an average of 1.14 hits on the damage table, leading to 1.14 × 11/36 = 0.35 Hull damage, or next to nothing.
The barbettes seem to be next to useless against reinforced fighters.

For the capital ships, you forget the System Damage, that is likely to reduce its offensive power.

The fighters would do one or two hits per round, I assumed they would be repaired at roughly the same speed. The impact would be minimal?

And remember that the fighters may also divide themselves into several flights, so reducing their losses against massive barrages...

Or even better, don't group into flights at all, forcing the ship to fire its bays as individual barrages with minimum software support.


Now I start to recognise the system, the reinforced fighters easily wins over ships.

We can squeeze out a little more damage with sensor locks and aid gunner...

 

[McPerth]

If two vessels randomly encounter each other while travelling, the encounter will begin at Very Long range.

I think this applies more to tramp freighters than military operations.

Unfortunately it's not specified, and if theis is changed in HG I have not found it. That's why I guess its for sensors matter, as at Distant range they are quite poor...

The sensor system seems simple:

Compare the range something is to the sensing ship with the sensors being used and look up the result on the Detail By Sensors table (overleaf).

Core, p143.

The Dice Modifier applies to jamming and counter-jamming attempts.

Core, p108.
No rolls involved, you see what is there.

It's a shame sensor rules are so poor (and their combat effect apparently nil) when there are so many ways to modify those inexistent rolls and tasks (stealth, better sensors, etc)...

I guess we found another errata here...

In the turret, as usual?
Rechecking the rules a cockpit seems required for the gunner, despite having a perfectly good workstation in the turret.

I have used CT and MT to design ships too, and in no case the gunner was assumed to enter into the turret tonnage, needing a seat in both versions.

The fighters would do one or two hits per round, I assumed they would be repaired at roughly the same speed. The impact would be minimal?

That would depend. If several wings attack at once, each barrage does ssystem damage on a 8+. So if the 60 fighters attack as 6 10 fighter wings, they would do on average 2-3 such hits per round, and the capital ship may attempt one repair per section per turn...

Or even better, don't group into flights at all, forcing the ship to fire its bays as individual barrages with minimum software support.

Why minimal softweare support? As I understand them, the core computers apply their FC program to each and every fire, as they are assumed to be many computers linked.

We can squeeze out a little more damage with sensor locks and aid gunner...

I'm afraid I don't understand what you mean here...

 

[Xerxeskingofking]

We can squeeze out a little more damage with sensor locks and aid gunner...
I'm afraidf I don't understand what you mean here...

I think he means that, since sensor locks add +1 to any attacks on a target, and other crew could (in theory) use the standard skill chain mechanic to add a bonus to a attack (e.g. a pilot (small craft) roll to "hold her steady for me" or, engineering (p plant) roll to "boost power to weapons" or somesuch, with the Effect of that roll as a modifier to the attack), you could add a bonus to the barrage roll and thus boost damage output.

Why minimal software support? As I understand them, the core computers apply their FC program to each and every fire, as they are assumed to be many computers linked.

do you have a page reference for that? I can't see that in my copy of HG, and the standard FC program form the core book can effect up to its version number of attacks or one attack up to its version number (or some combination of those).

Clearly, a single barrage against one target counts as one attack (as shown in the example barrage given), but I'm not sure that a capital ship can apply the full bonus to every attack it makes, and if it splits its fire over multiple targets (like several dispersed fighter swarms), it will have to split its fire control bonus as well.

 

[Blue Ghost]

I have used CT and MT to design ships too, and in no case the gunner was assumed to enter into the turret tonnage, needing a seat in both versions.

It's been ages since I looked at the design rules (SFB gave me enough headaches), but I seem to recall that all you needed to do was assign a weapons' station to a hardpoint in more advanced design rules. A gunner was only needed, ISTR, with basic CT design.

Or am I completely wrong on that?

I bring it up because I recall that FASA's Chameleon had a six tube missile bay and a four triple turret PPC bay, each acting as a single barbette, but were controlled by a single gunner nested behind the missile launchers.

 

[McPerth]

It's been ages since I looked at the design rules (SFB gave me enough headaches), but I seem to recall that all you needed to do was assign a weapons' station to a hardpoint in more advanced design rules. A gunner was only needed, ISTR, with basic CT design.

Or am I completely wrong on that?

I bring it up because I recall that FASA's Chameleon had a six tube missile bay and a four triple turret PPC bay, each acting as a single barbette, but were controlled by a single gunner nested behind the missile launchers.

In CT:HG you needed 1 gunner 100 dtons of spinal mount, 2 gunners per bay and 1 gunner per turret battery.

On larger ships, where staterooms and bridges (instead of cockpits) are used, people's space is asumed to be among them, not needing the seat specified, but in small craft each crewmember must be proivided a control couch and life support (one half ton and Cr 25000).

 

[AnotherDilbert]

I think he means that, since sensor locks add +1 to any attacks on a target, and other crew could (in theory) use the standard skill chain mechanic to add a bonus to a attack (e.g. a pilot (small craft) roll to "hold her steady for me" or, engineering (p plant) roll to "boost power to weapons" or somesuch, with the Effect of that roll as a modifier to the attack), you could add a bonus to the barrage roll and thus boost damage output.

Exactly. "Help line up a shot", Core p147. "Sensor Lock", Core p150.

do you have a page reference for that? I can't see that in my copy of HG, and the standard FC program form the core book can effect up to its version number of attacks or one attack up to its version number (or some combination of those).

Clearly, a single barrage against one target counts as one attack (as shown in the example barrage given), but I'm not sure that a capital ship can apply the full bonus to every attack it makes, and if it splits its fire over multiple targets (like several dispersed fighter swarms), it will have to split its fire control bonus as well.

Exactly.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

It's a shame sensor rules are so poor (and their combat effect apparently nil) when there are so many ways to modify those inexistent rolls and tasks (stealth, better sensors, etc)...

We have Sensor Lock and Electronic Warfare on p150.

I have used CT and MT to design ships too, and in no case the gunner was assumed to enter into the turret tonnage, needing a seat in both versions.

Unfortunately for me that is true, I have apparently house ruled this unwittingly for ~35 years.

That would depend. If several wings attack at once, wach barrage does ssystem damage on a 8+. So if the 60 fighters attack as 6 10 fighter wings, they would do on average 2-3 such hits per round, and the capital ship may attempt one repair per section per turn...

In my example the fighters made 65 individual barrages at -4 needing a roll of 12 to cause system damage, for an average of 65 / 36 ≈ 1.8 hits per round.

I estimated that in 5 or 10 round the effect would be small.

 

[McPerth]

Exactly. "Help line up a shot", Core p147. "Sensor Lock", Core p150.

TY. Can "Help line up a shot" and dodging be done simultaneously?

I know rules don't talk about it, but "giving the gunner a stable platform" and dodging seem quite contradictory to me...

do you have a page reference for that? I can't see that in my copy of HG, and the standard FC program form the core book can effect up to its version number of attacks or one attack up to its version number (or some combination of those).

Clearly, a single barrage against one target counts as one attack (as shown in the example barrage given), but I'm not sure that a capital ship can apply the full bonus to every attack it makes, and if it splits its fire over multiple targets (like several dispersed fighter swarms), it will have to split its fire control bonus as well.

Exactly.

In fact no, It seems I was confused by the fact the FC software talks about "firing weapons" (not even weapon mounts, so a triple turret requiring FC/3 to be fired by the software), not realizing the DMs talked about attacks, not weapons (in CB i understand they are the same, as each weapon fires indificually).

As this is clearly not applicable to HG barrages (that represent many weapons at once), I assumed the HG FC programs were, as their computers, more powerful.

This gives a clear advantage to fighters, if they divide on small flights...

We have Sensor Lock and Electronic Warfare on p150.

True, but quite ill defined.

As an example. are they affected by distance or by target size?

In my example the fighters made 65 individual barrages at -4 needing a roll of 12 to cause system damage, for an average of 65 / 36 ≈ 1.8 hits per round.

I estimated that in 5 or 10 round the effect would be small.

IMHO single weapons attacks should be handled by CB rules, not by barrage ones.

Using single weapon attacks as barrages makes them far too powerful.

A two seat fighter with good FC software firing against the Planet cruiser as in my first example (as we have the System Damage tables for it) could produce up to about 6 hull/Structure hits plus a System Damage roll, that could mean reducing its armor or destroy 30-40 turrets...

 

[McPerth]

[m;]Above posts have been moved from this thread to avoid hijacking it[/m;]