Hunter or Avery; what's the word on the Traveller MMORPG?

[Zparkz]

I am not sure if I can buy more games now. I play Tabula Rasa occationally which is great fun. it is a kind of merge between fps and MMO.

It is level based, but the grinding doesn't seem as bad as in Anarchy Online, which I grew very tired of. However, the playing area is much smaller, but filled with action.

For a Traveller MMO I would like to se a level-less system where skills increase based on skill usage, thus eleminating much of the ever go out in the wilderness and find something to shoot. A Traveller MMO should not be so action oriented as adventure oriented with puzzles to solve and things to explore.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Either way, let me know what you think of that guy's level after you look at it. I think it's small, but I think it's Star Wars theme is much in line with a Traveller mod.

 

[Zparkz]

I had a look at the map just recently, and I like what I see. It could suit several SF themes. Hadn't it been for the Jabba grafitti everywhere Traveller would have come first to mind.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Yeah, it's a nice little map with a good Star Wars theme. The font is also a Star Wars "imperial font" that you see in the films, and there's also a Star Destroyer model hanging above the clouds.

This guy's also done two other maps with a very similar Star Wars theme, but for Half Life 2 Death Match.

I think it's a neat little map, and shows what could be done if someone wanted to make up a Traveller version. I'm going to give it a shot, but probably won't be abelt to make it happen.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Further; a Traveller FPS that I'd like to see or try to make as a fan project would have the following;

The first three physical stats would dicate your physical ability in the game; i.e. how much you could carry via ST, what kind of DEX bonus or negative you got with your weapon, and for how long you could hold your breath underwater and run at a full sprint (FarCry has this last one).

In short, you couldn't carry a virtual arsenal of weapons like so many games, nor could you carry ammo for all those weapons (cartridges weigh a lot). Additionally, the hits your body took would effect your performance.

Bullets and other rounds would travel at their actual speeds. The Delta Force and FarCry engines have this; projectile based FPS. They're not hit-scans like Source and all the rest. I think it's important for the overall effect and feel of the game. Possibly a heavy weapons too. Firing a tank gun in Joint Ops is pretty fun, ditto with a minigun from a Blackhawk.

For a basic FPS that's as far as I'd be willing to go. Actual skills for weapons and so forth would fall into more of an online RPG, and not really in an FPS as I'm imagining it.

First comes a map though. That I can do. It's been ages since I did anykind of computer model drafting, so making stuff like gauss gun models and so forth is out of my skill set. But I think I can crank out a map. We'll see.

 

[aramis]

For Dex, I'd put it at max(random(1,15)-dex,0)/5 degrees off aim point each shot. So dex 7 puts half of shots on aim.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Makes sense.

 

[Zparkz]

Rather than making it a percentage chance of hitting, the stats should reflect how your aimpoint stabilizes after a shot, running and everything else that affects aiming of the weapon.

I would feel cheated if I had my target in dead center and the shot missed because some virtual dice decides where the shot goes. At least if we are talking about a fps game.

Here's how I see the stats behave in the game.

STR - Carrying capacity, affects run speed and jump distance
END/CON - How long you can run with your load, damage resistance, endurance under water
Dex/AGL - Run speed, jump distance, maneuverability


When it comes to game design, I would go for a fps game as it takes shorter time to develop and cheaper as the game engine usually are developed.

 

[Blue Ghost]

That makes a little more sense.

During a WW2 miniature game we were doing the D-Day invasion of Normandy. The player controlling the Nazis had a German grunt with a panzerfaust (RPG/AT-weapon), and even though he was essentially at point blank range (I think 1 meter, game distance) the die roll determined that he missed, and that his shot somehow careened to the other side of the tank. We all got a laugh out of that, including him.

To further the discussion, when I thought of using the regular HL (Quake2) game engine, some of the models that inspired me to do a Trav mod were these;

Some guy's version of a futuristic auto-rifle;
http://www.fpsbanana.com/skins/screens/32633?img=http://image.hazardstrip.com/ss/srends/27170.jpg

The M41A pulse rifle (ACR) from Aliens;
http://www.fpsbanana.com/skins/screens/32380?img=http://image.hazardstrip.com/ss/srends/26963.jpg

Anyway, just putting stuff out there. Source engine has the most support, so that's the one I'm going to try to build a map with.

 

[Zparkz]

Of course, even in fps games where your personal skills matter rather than a characters skills there is possible to miss at point blank range. I don't remember which map it was on, but I was protecting the bomb I just had planted. I waited with shooting until the CS guy was crouching and defusing. I emtied my gun into him, all 20 shots or so, and missed. As I was strungling to hit the real key for reloading, he just turned around and shot me with his puny pistol. One shot.

 

[Marchand]

Just a thought on the Traveller MMO idea.

A crucial aspect of the Traveller setting is, of course, the lack of any communication faster than the fastest ships.

I don't see how this could be implemented in an MMORPG short of restricting all the action to a single planet or star system (which also wouldn't really be "traveller"). Even if there was no ingame chat channel or whatever between systems, people could still chat over the internet.

 

[Spinward Scout]

Yes, and what do you do about a full week in Jump?

One week in JumpSpace = Traveller: The Sims?

EDIT: What I mean is how do you keep them out of contact with the rest of the 'universe' for a week?

 

[Blue Ghost]

I'd imagine that each server would be a different world. But that's just me.

 

[Zparkz]

There is a lot of mechanics from OTU we need to change regardless of rulesett used.
Aging is out, no one wants to drop in stats in a MMO.
Jump mechanics needs to be changed. stuck for one week in a cramped scout won't attract players either. More I think about it I am more convinced that a fps game would be better as it can open up a lot of opportunities not available else where and with less restrictions.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Another CS Source map to look at is a Zombie Mod map called zm_spacestationflee_v2_fix

You can find it here; http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/29076

The Zombie mod is kind of hokey in my opinion, but it was fun the first time I played it. Anyway, aside from the map layout, the textures look pretty good, and the corridors have a Traveller feel to them.

For those not in the know, the Zombie mod for Counter Strike Source turns a random number of player characters into "undead" who must knife (eat brains ) of the Human player characters who are armed with guns. In the begining you don't know who's going to turn into a zombie, so there's an element of tension and worry within the game. The setup is that you all start as human, find spots to hide or barricade, then wait for the zombies.

In spacestation flee you actually have to make it to a ship which looks remotely like the Marauder Class commerce raider from the old FASA starship pack. You weave your way throgh the space station's corridors to get to the dock, and wait a minute for the airlock to open. In the meantime you're being chased by undead, and must fend them off with whatever weapon you bought at the begining of the game.

Like I said, it was kind of a thrill the first few times I played it, but it got old.

Anyway, the map, aside from the layout, is done rather well. Though I think whoever did the map really skimped on the spaceship in terms of textures. To make it a Traveller map I'd get rid of the Zombie thing first off, and then open up all the corridors, and maybe add a couple more ships.

 

[Bloo]

Been a long time since I logged in here.

About 7 years ago, I was hired at Playnet to help design Traveller Online. I had put Marc in touch with Playnet before then (late 1999 or early 2000). Playnet had the license for a while. But World War II Online suffered a devastating launch and bankruptcy followed not too long after (which we fought through and successfully escaped from - that's a different story though), and that effectively killed Traveller Online as a project at Playnet.

At the time we had to stop active development, which was mostly just me conferring somewhat with the executive producer and MM occasionally, we had a design doc of ~80 pages, with some neat ideas that would have been new at the time. But what was looming in my mind was that once we were able to commit real resources to moving forward on it, were several major changes to 'canon' that would have to take place to be viable as a 'persistent universe' MMO. One or two have already been hinted at here.

Of course, that was 2000 and a lot of the design doc is of little value now, IMO (though I'm not free to share it). And player expectations have changed drastically. Doing Traveller 'right' as a full-scale MMO would take about $40 million and 3-4 years, ballpark. And, unfortunately, the value of the brand is currently challenged do to very little name recognition, especially in the main demographic of people who are willing to pay $60 up front and $180/year ($15/month) for an MMORPG. That's a huge risk that few are willing to take.

I think now that an "Oblivion" style approach would have greater opportunity, especially given the ability that players have to modify content for that system. I would also look at Neverwinter Nights-style, which allows of multiple players and single-player 'parties', or 'crews', especially if you could strip the D20 out of it (I'm no fan of levels).

It would still require a significant amount of artistic re$ource$ to be AAA quality, to say nothing of level/story design and programming. And it would have to stand on it's own merits, outside of being associated with "Traveller" as a great gaming experience.

And unlike an MMO, where you have to do the WHOLE thing, and test it all, you could focus on some of the classic adventures, like the whole series leading up to the discovery of Grandfather. And you could modularize it, release new expansions over time.

I think that's an approach that is much more feasible, certainly much less expensive, and has a greater likelihood to build the value of the Traveller brand. (And you don't have to worry about the necessity in MMOs for instanteous, universe-wide communications, for one thing).

 

[Merxiless]

Forrestwolf of Neverwinter Nights community has done a decent Traveller port to a subset of T20 / D20 rules, using re-modded sets, and NWN as the game engine.

I've played it, it feels like Traveller, as much as a D&D to NWN to d20 modern to Traveller 20 possibly can.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Merxiless, that's interesting. Do you have a link?

Bloo; wow. Long time no see. Incredible story. Any chance of updating the old Traveller games wth really cool graphics?

p.s. I think a regular FPS is the way to go. Traveller is still a niche market.

 

[LearnedHand]

Trav MMORPG

I'm running the idea through UO guilds and seeing if anyone knows anyone etc. who could push the idea of a trav mmorpg through. Never hurts to try.

Hand

 

[ManOguaR]

I'm programming it

Sure, there's about a couple years of design, research & developement.

Many of the "problems" about Traveller's universe design where solved as gameplay feats.

1 week of jumpspace --> 4 hours travelling. (CHANGE THE TIME SCALE IS GOOD)
Communications --> You need electronics to enable and enhance your comm-chat.
Starships = TheSims??? --> Have you ever seen a TACTICAL SUBMARINE SIMULATOR??

AND SO MORE DESIGN FEATURES.

Server kernel fully operational, server simulations debuggin stage, client graphics work on progress, server AI work on progress.

Any questions? Any reply? Any help?

we need designers and coders...

Traveller Online will be the finest MMORPG if we try.


P.D. Sorry about my bad english, I'm spanish. Thank You