intergalactic jumpgate

[Werner]

related to pre-determining the sectors: if this is going to be an actual game, this would be an opportunity to have the players roll up the systems using sensors and all that. Depending on the players, of course. If I were to play in such a game, I'd love to just start generating a system that I've "discovered" and get into all the nooks and crannies. It would give me some ownership of the game.

Somewhere on this board someone did that with the character generation: it was also home world generation and they got to help shape their home systems and the subsector. That sort of metagaming is how I like to play, but is definitely not how a lot of people want to play.

edit: plus, just how old is the sensor data again? I think it was long enough for significant geophysical changes.

Here is a starter subsector for you, in it, I have just the listed star types and indicating whether the system is binary followed by which orbit the binary is in using the standard orbits as listed in the classic scout book, and for convenience I have listed the distance the binary is from the primary in AU where that applies.

Hex number Layer number Nature Primary Binary & Orbit Orbit distance (AU)
0707 layer 8 Alpha Solo K0 V
0207 layer 7 Beta Solo M5 V
0406 layer 7 Gamma Binary F5 II, G5 V Orbit 2 0.7
0409 layer 7 Delta Solo K5 V
0604 layer 7 Epsilon Binary K0 V, M5 V Orbit 10 77.2
0708 layer 7 Zeta Solo K0 V
0302 layer 6 Eta Binary K5 V, M0 V Orbit 10 77.2
0403 layer 6 Theta Solo M5 V
0709 layer 6 Iota Solo M5 III
0306 layer 5 Kappa Solo F0 V
0502 layer 5 Lambda Solo A5 V
0708 layer 5 Mu Solo K0 V
0207 layer 4 Nu Solo M5 V
0307 layer 4 Xi Solo M5 V
0702 layer 4 Omicron Solo K0 V
0706 layer 4 Pi Solo K5 V
0102 layer 3 Rho Solo F0 V
0208 layer 2 Sigma Binary G0 V, G0 V Orbit 16 4915.6
0609 layer 2 Tau Solo G0 V
0702 layer 1 Upsilon Binary K0 V, M5 V Orbit Close

You can ignore the layer number if you just want a 2D map, if two star systems are located in the same hex, you can do a number of things to resolve it, including putting one of the systems in an adjacent hex, or just having two systems within the same hex, unlike a binary, these two systems aren't gravitationally bound together, they are just passing by each other at an unusually close distance.

 

[Enoki]

All ships that use a jumpgate need to either be jump capable or be Carried onboard a jump capable ship. What the jumpgate does is get the ship into jump space, the thing is once in jump space, no matter how far the jump is, the time spent in jump space will last about a week, so a ship that is in jump space will need a jump drive to maintain a jump bubble around itself for one week until it enters normal space, a jumpgate can do that job, because it doesn't travel with the Starship it sent into jump space. Also the rule for jump travel is you need 10% of the hull volume in liquid hydrogen for ever parsec of space crossed, so for a 750,000 parsec jump, which is what's you'd need for that jump to Andromeda, a 100 ton scout ship will need 7,500,000 displacement tons of liquid hydrogen, most of this fuel is loaded into the fuel tanks of the jumpgate and is used to initiate the jump, all this hydrogen gets injected into jump space along with the Starship that is sent, the Starship then needs to inject 10% of its hull volume into jump space to maintain the jump bubble as it travels for one week in jump space. Fortunately hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe and is fairly cheap.

The formula for calculating the jump fuel required to send a Starship through jump space to andromeda galaxy is therefore 750,000 × ship dton hull volume/10.

A Type S scout goes for about 25 to 30 Mcr new. 7.5 million tons of hydrogen at 30 cr (MT lists it at 35 cr per kiloliter) a ton is 225 Mcr. So, the cost of sending a brand new scout there is about 250 million credits of which roughly 90% is fuel costs.

Sending a single million ton ship on 750 billion tons of hydrogen might actually make more sense as once it arrives you have everything to set up a colony at the far end with a relatively high tech level in one shot rather than sending penny packets of ships and people who really can't manage that. One say 10 to 20 trillion credit investment gets you a working colony at fairly high tech at the other end.

A scout with eight people aboard and a few tons of supplies in the cargo hold would be unable to accomplish much of anything on arrival. Where do they get more food when what's on board runs out?

The million ton ship? You only need J1 to get there. You have several scouts, small merchant ships, and warships aboard to do the heavy lifting. The behemoth colony ship can take it's time getting in position around the selected planet while the merchant ships, etc., move advanced parties and equipment there ahead of it.

You have farmers and such aboard, along with agricultural machinery and the seed, etc., to begin farming immediately. You have starter stock for animal breeding.

The ship itself could be designed to allow its disassembly once at the world to be colonized to provide materials for a variety of purposes until manufacturing and mining is established.

With thousands of people selected for their skills and knowledge you quickly build shelter (housing) and begin to establish facilities for manufacturing and trade as well.

It certainly doesn't argue well for sending dissidents and criminals there, at least initially.

 

[Werner]

A Type S scout goes for about 25 to 30 Mcr new. 7.5 million tons of hydrogen at 30 cr (MT lists it at 35 cr per kiloliter) a ton is 225 Mcr. So, the cost of sending a brand new scout there is about 250 million credits of which roughly 90% is fuel costs.

Sending a single million ton ship on 750 billion tons of hydrogen might actually make more sense as once it arrives you have everything to set up a colony at the far end with a relatively high tech level in one shot rather than sending penny packets of ships and people who really can't manage that. One say 10 to 20 trillion credit investment gets you a working colony at fairly high tech at the other end.

A scout with eight people aboard and a few tons of supplies in the cargo hold would be unable to accomplish much of anything on arrival. Where do they get more food when what's on board runs out?

The million ton ship? You only need J1 to get there. You have several scouts, small merchant ships, and warships aboard to do the heavy lifting. The behemoth colony ship can take it's time getting in position around the selected planet while the merchant ships, etc., move advanced parties and equipment there ahead of it.

You have farmers and such aboard, along with agricultural machinery and the seed, etc., to begin farming immediately. You have starter stock for animal breeding.

The ship itself could be designed to allow its disassembly once at the world to be colonized to provide materials for a variety of purposes until manufacturing and mining is established.

With thousands of people selected for their skills and knowledge you quickly build shelter (housing) and begin to establish facilities for manufacturing and trade as well.

It certainly doesn't argue well for sending dissidents and criminals there, at least initially.

You make a good point, so not criminals or dissidents, more like astronauts with the Right Stuff. You would want every Starship to be brand new. The PCs would be the equivalent of astronaut selected. you probably want to send the colonists young so they can have families and children. There would be a lot of Scout characters, some Navy, Marines, and Army guys. All the starships would likely be the property of the Third Imperium and they would all be built at tech level 15, lots of standard designs though since those would be the most reliable. A number of dependents would probably go as well, and scientists, doctors, mechanics, and botanist/farmers. I would reference the Netflix show Lost in Space, as this campaign would resemble that. The captain of each starship would be considered the owner of that Starship once it is sent through by the jumpgate. Colonies work best when each colonists has ownership in his property and there will be a need for starships and mechanics. A large capital ship, maybe a Navy fleet carrier will serve as an orbital Starport for that first colony, it will have shipyards for constructing PC class starships 1000 dtons and under, and for a while at least, those will be the only kinds of starships constructed.

 

[AtlanticFriend]

Bond: "Do you expect me to talk?"

Goldfinger: "No, Mr. Bond, I expect you to die!"


And, on the other hand,
Dr. Evil: "Scott, I want you to meet daddy's nemesis, Austin Powers."

Scott Evil: "What? Are you feeding him? Why don't you just kill him?"

Dr. Evil: "I have an even better idea. I'm going to place him in an easily escapable situation involving an overly elaborate and exotic death."

Hey, it worked for 2001: A Space Odyssey after all !

The inmates/pioneers are like Bowman. They have a real mission to conduct, but have not been told the real reason why. They think they are to establish a base and build the return jumpgate, but maybe the mission serves a higher/darker/stranger purpose. Maybe the colony is to be the Empire's equivalent of Dune's Salusa Secundus. Maybe not all of the inmates are ordinary criminals. Maybe the "return gate" is not necessary at all and the Empire is just conducting a live test for a new form of Jump travel.

 

[Werner]

Maybe this would be a means of escaping the Virus which led to the New Era.

 

[Werner]

Here is a 3 dimensional representation of Andromeda 11 Subsector

https://www.deviantart.com/tomkalbfus/art/Subsector-Gaia-870343544

 

[mike wightman]

Isn't it a bit empty?

 

[Enoki]

You make a good point, so not criminals or dissidents, more like astronauts with the Right Stuff. You would want every Starship to be brand new. The PCs would be the equivalent of astronaut selected. you probably want to send the colonists young so they can have families and children. There would be a lot of Scout characters, some Navy, Marines, and Army guys. All the starships would likely be the property of the Third Imperium and they would all be built at tech level 15, lots of standard designs though since those would be the most reliable. A number of dependents would probably go as well, and scientists, doctors, mechanics, and botanist/farmers. I would reference the Netflix show Lost in Space, as this campaign would resemble that. The captain of each starship would be considered the owner of that Starship once it is sent through by the jumpgate. Colonies work best when each colonists has ownership in his property and there will be a need for starships and mechanics. A large capital ship, maybe a Navy fleet carrier will serve as an orbital Starport for that first colony, it will have shipyards for constructing PC class starships 1000 dtons and under, and for a while at least, those will be the only kinds of starships constructed.

If it were me, I be sending more trades people to build and make stuff, along with engineers, architects, and the like to do the design work while keeping everything to say TL 10 to 12.

The exact TL would depend on what could be easily repaired and replicated rather than cutting edge technology that would be harder to maintain. The analogy might be they send 1950's and 60's technology rather than 2020's technology. The older stuff is easier to diagnose and much easier to repair and replicate parts for. Sure, you improve the materials and quality, but the technology itself is easily maintained and repaired.

This would be necessary because you aren't going to get a gate at the far end manufactured any time soon. First you need a stable society that can do the manufacturing. Without shelter, food, and other basic necessities you can't build the gate which likely is going to take years in any case.
Better to shoot through a million ton ship once a year to beef up the far end than expect things to be accomplished PDQ.

Military? A minor concern unless you expect to encounter nasty bad intelligent aliens at the far end. Some scouts are useful to survey and secure the local portion of the galaxy, but the focus would be on establishing one or more permanent colonies on decent worlds with a TL of at least 10 initially.

Resource extraction and manufacturing would be the focus until you had a range of basic industry necessary to support that tech level. From there, you start to grow the economy and population.

Heavy use of robots and automation would be useful to free up the population for more complex tasks too.

 

[Werner]

Isn't it a bit empty?

I could add some more, the way I calculated it there is a standard 50% chance that a hex would be occupied, since there are 8 layers, the chance should be 6.25% per hex per layer, and I used my spreadsheet to do all the Dice rolling and I ended up with 16 stars in total, perhaps this is a sparse region, there should be a lot more red dwarf, the stars shown could be considered only the inhabited star systems, I can add some uninhabited ones, these don't have mainworld, there is the usual chance of gas giants however so you can refuel your starships with gas giant skimming and cross some of the gaps.

After this I've decided to have 5d6 inhabited worlds per subsector, maybe I should increase it to 6d6 worlds, that will give me an average of 21 stars per subsector. Each star, even members of a binary have seperate mainworlds, I could add in stars without mainworlds to make crossing a bit easier. Looks like some of the worlds are going to have intelligent native species and are technological, I haven't decided what these aliens are yet. I might decide to reduce the jump fuel requirement for the gates. I want the subsector to be more populated, and having exiled criminals sounds more interesting than just a bunch of astronauts, I could justify this as a gain in efficiency over the usual jump drive. How about a 1% jump fuel requirement instead of a 10% jump fuel requirement, this means for every parsec crossed and for every 100 tons of starship, you need 1 ton of jump fuel.

I think I might use Stardrive aliens(We'ren, Fraal, Aleeren, Tsa, and some native humans as well) for the Andromeda Galaxy instead of the usual Traveller Aliens, though some of the criminals exiled are Traveller aliens such as Vagryr, most are human since they are Solomani, but the Imperium is sending some of it's own people as well - people who volunteered to go rather than being exiled. The Imperium wants to see the return gate constructed, and that is being done at the Gaian system. A fleet carrier is acting as a temporary high port starport of type A for the Gaian system, an Imperium Noble governs the Gaian system, he is a fleet officer and is also an Admiral and captain of fleet carrier/starport, he has taken to the task of constructing the return gate, he is organizing the mining of Planetoid Belt 1 to get the raw materials needed for its construction. There is a small Belter community in this belt tasked with this mining.

 

[Werner]

If it were me, I be sending more trades people to build and make stuff, along with engineers, architects, and the like to do the design work while keeping everything to say TL 10 to 12.

The exact TL would depend on what could be easily repaired and replicated rather than cutting edge technology that would be harder to maintain. The analogy might be they send 1950's and 60's technology rather than 2020's technology. The older stuff is easier to diagnose and much easier to repair and replicate parts for. Sure, you improve the materials and quality, but the technology itself is easily maintained and repaired.

This would be necessary because you aren't going to get a gate at the far end manufactured any time soon. First you need a stable society that can do the manufacturing. Without shelter, food, and other basic necessities you can't build the gate which likely is going to take years in any case.
Better to shoot through a million ton ship once a year to beef up the far end than expect things to be accomplished PDQ.

Military? A minor concern unless you expect to encounter nasty bad intelligent aliens at the far end. Some scouts are useful to survey and secure the local portion of the galaxy, but the focus would be on establishing one or more permanent colonies on decent worlds with a TL of at least 10 initially.

Resource extraction and manufacturing would be the focus until you had a range of basic industry necessary to support that tech level. From there, you start to grow the economy and population.

Heavy use of robots and automation would be useful to free up the population for more complex tasks too.

Yeah, I'll go with a variety of tech, and Stardrive Aliens for the natives of this region, there are some humans here as well, and the Ancients have gotten this far out, and apparently they brought some humans to Gaia as well, they are very primitive sorts though, paleontologists have identified some neanderthals among the native humans here, they live on an isolated continent about the size of Australia, the other continents have more or less modern humans on them. Population is in the millions, lots of hunter gatherers originally and stone Age tribes, contact with the colonists have since increased their local tech levels. Some of the neanderthals make good scientists however, though they are not as socially outgoing as modern humans.

There was a lack of native jump drive technology when the colonists first arrived, trade with the natives have since spread this technology and the natives are employed in the construction of the gate as well. The Aleerins are inherently technological, and appear to have been part of an experiment the Ancients conducted, they initially had slower than light starships when they were first encountered, but have picked up jump drive technology rather quickly.

 

[mike wightman]

You should be using the 50/50 chance for every hex regardless of the layer - your stellar density is way off as a result.

 

[Werner]

You should be using the 50/50 chance for every hex regardless of the layer - your stellar density is way off as a result.

I think the Kappa and Lambda systems are likely home the Aleerens. A heavily modified human race with electronics integrated into their bodies. For some reason the inhabitants of this part of the galaxy at least have not developed the Jump Drive, the Fraal on the other hand have developed gravity technology and the Maneuver Drive, and the Fraal tend to be good with psionics to the point of making the Zhodani look like pikers. The Fraal in the Andromeda galaxy are more open than the ones in the Milky Way, where they are referred to as Grays or flying saucer aliens.


Also 90% of the stars are red dwarfs, but thats boring, I like a little more variety. A planet orbiting a red dwarf in its habitable zone will likely be tidally locked and subject to stellar flares which will likely strip away most of its atmosphere, they could have gas giants and they would be likely places to refuel, but one would think most people would choose not to live there. Also Earthlike habitable planets tend to have lower tech levels if you go strictly by the tables. I'll throw in some uninhabited red dwarf systems that are mostly ignored except as refueling depots.

 

[Werner]

You should be using the 50/50 chance for every hex regardless of the layer - your stellar density is way off as a result.

I think I will double the amount of stars in the sector and include mainworlds for them as well. I'll use the stars I generated for subsector 1 and combine them with subsector 11.

I'm going to use subsectors 8 parsecs thick, but I'm not going further than that a sector will still be 16 subsectors arranged in a 2 dimensional fashion, that is no subsector blocks stacked on top of other subsector blocks, this leaves the number if stars per sector about the same. A 3 dimensional sector would have 64 subsectors, and I'm not going that crazy! I'd rather have longer distances than more stars bunched together.

 

[Werner]

To summarize the intelligent major alien races found in the Andromeda Sector:
Aleerin
Type: Humanoid (aleerin)
Size: Medium (between 1 and 2 meters tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Endurance +1, Intelligence -1, Education +1, Social Standing -1

Dralasite
Type: Aberration (amorphous blob that extrudes limbs as needed)
Size: Medium (takes up the same volume as a human, but can flatten itself and elongate as needed.
Characteristic Modifiers: Dexterity -1, Endurance +1 (Dralasites are resilient but awkward)

Fraal
Type: Humanoid (fraal)
Size: Small (stands about 1 meter tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Strength -2, Endurance -2, Intelligence +2, Education +2, Social Standing +2 (Fraal are frail and weak, but their mental abilities far surpass most other species.)
Fraal have psionic abilities that include telepathy.

Sesheyan
Type: Monstrous Humanoid
Size: Medium (between 1 and 2 meters tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Dexterity +1, Social Standing -1
Sesheyans are agile but lack social grace. Sesheyans possess wings on their back and are capable of flying in an atmosphere 5 or greater at twice their ground movement rate.

T'sa
Type: Humanoid (reptilian, T'sa)
Size: Small (stands about 1 meter tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Strength -1, Dexterity +1, Intelligence -1, Social Standing +1.

Vrusk
Type: Humanoid (insecticide, Vrusk)
Size: Large (stands between 2 to 3 meters tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Strength -1, Intelligence +1, Education +1. Vrusk evolved on a low gravity world, about Size 4 and have low gravity adaption.

Weren
Type: Giant Humanoid
Size: Large (stands about 3 meters tall)
Characteristic Modifiers: Strength +2, Dexterity -1. Weren't are incredibly strong but lack agility.

Neanderthal
Type: Humanoid (human, neanderthal)
Size: Medium between 1 and 1.5 meters tall, stocky build and stronger than average human.
Characteristic Modifiers: Strength +1, Intelligence +1, Social Standing -2. Neanderthals are strong, slightly shorter than average humans, and are awkward socially.

 

[Werner]

Here are some additional worlds to add to Subsector 11.
Hex number Layer number Name UWP Bases Gas Giant Planetoid Belt Nature Primary, Binary & Orbit Orbit distance (AU)
0707 layer 8 Aee B79A532-C N S G Solo K0 V
0207 layer 7 Bee B696564-B S G Solo M5 V
0406 layer 7 Cee C9BA423-6 G Binary F5 II, G5 V Orbit 2 0.7
0409 layer 7 Dee C68557B-5 G B Solo K5 V
0604 layer 7 Ee B6258BB-8 N G Primary K0 V
Ef E554200-7 G Binary M5 V, Orbit 10 77.2
0708 layer 7 Gee A8BA7AB-B N G B Solo K0 V
0302 layer 6 Aech B433775-9 G Primary K5 V
Eye A443336-E N B Binary M0 V, Orbit 10 77.2
0403 layer 6 Jay D98A466-6 S G B Solo M5 V
0709 layer 6 Kay A526220-A G B Solo M5 III
0306 layer 5 El D574885-1 S G B Solo F0 V
0502 layer 5 Em A9EA756-C G Solo A5 V
0708 layer 5 En E544744-6 G B Solo K0 V
0207 layer 4 Oh A85558C-C G Solo M5 V
0307 layer 4 Pee B250798-8 G B Solo M5 V
0702 layer 4 Que B345644-9 N S G B Solo K0 V
0706 layer 4 Ar C330477-A G B Solo K5 V
0102 layer 3 Es B442379-C N Solo F0 V
0208 layer 2 Tee E647644-2 G B Primary G0 V
You C88A676-9 G Binary G0 V, Orbit 16 4915.6
0609 layer 2 Vee B696586-8 N S G Solo G0 V
0702 layer 1 Double-you C867535-8 S G B Binary K0 V, M5 V Orbit Close

 

[Werner]

The complete Andromeda subsector 11:
Hex Number Layer Designation UWP Bases Gas Giant Planetoid belt Component Star Orbit
0102 03 Es B442379-C N Solo F0 V
0208 02 Tee E647644-2 G B Primary G0 V
0208 02 You C88A676-9 G Binary G0 V 16
0401 05 Delta C310456-9 G Solo F0 V
0503 02 Iota C577443-7 G Solo M0 V
0504 06 Gamma D34047A-4 G B Solo F0 V
0504 08 Alpha A011674-C N Solo M9 V
0604 03 Zeta D620532-5 G Primary M0 V
0604 03 Eta C330775-7 S G B Binary M5 V 10
0609 02 Vee B696586-8 N S G Solo G0 V
0506 07 Gaia A867634-B N S G B Solo G0 V
0606 03 Theta C556863-5 G B Solo F0 V
0108 04 Epsilon C758230-9 Solo M5 V
0207 04 Oh A85558C-C G Solo M5 V
0207 07 Bee B696564- S G Solo M5 V
0209 06 Beta A547548-9 G B Solo M0 V
0302 06 Aech B433775-9 G Primary K5 V
0302 06 Eye E443336-E N B Binary M0 V
0306 05 El D574885--1 S G B Solo F0 V
0307 04 Pee B250798-8 G B Solo M5 V
0403 06 Jay D98A466-6 S G B Solo M5 V
0406 07 Cee C9BA423-6 G Binary F5 II, G5 V 02
0409 07 Dee C68557B-5 G B Solo K5 V
0502 05 Em A9EA756-C G Solo A5 V
0604 07 Ee B6258BB-8 N G Primary K0 V
0604 07 Ef E554200-7 G Binary M5 V 10
0702 01 Double-you C867535-8 S G B Binary K0 V, M5 V Close
0702 04 Que B345644-9 N S G B K0 V
0703 01 Mu B8AA457-E N G Solo M0 V
0706 04 Ar C330477--A G B Solo K5 V
0707 08 Aee B79A532-C N S G Solo K0 V
0708 05 En E544744--6 G B Solo K0 V
0708 07 Gee A8BA7AB-B N G B Solo K0 V
0709 06 Kay A526220-A G B Solo M5 III
0801 01 Nu C855521-7 S G Primary F5 V
0801 01 Xi B553155-A N G Binary M5 V 10
0802 01 Omicron B6BA66B-A G Solo M5 V
0809 02 Kappa B668542-B N G B Primary F5 V
0809 02 Lambda B1109AC-B N G Binary M5 V 08