MAJOR Change to UGM?

[Supplement Four]

Check this out. I'm thinking this is pretty cool...and that it improves the UGM task system.

I've been fiddling with the Natural Ability Check in UGM, trying to make the system flow a bit better. (Not that is flows badly--I just wanted to see if I could improve on the idea. I think I have. Keep reading.)


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What if we scratch the Natural Ability DM all together.

In place of it, we assign a specific DM based on Natural Ability, tied to the character's skill.

This way, Natural Ability will effect different skills differently. And, an account is made for experience & natural ability over lap (high skill levels won't benefit from natural ability often--which makes some sense to me).

Here's what I'm thinking....

--1-- Natural Ability goes away as we're doing it now.

--2-- UGM tasks are rolled the same (except for the Natural Ability part of the roll).

--3-- New Natural Ability DM will be known before dice roll.


New Natural Ability DM...

When Skill x 3 is equal to or less than governor stat, then use a +1 DM. Skill-0 skills are not elligible for this.


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Examples.

Da Bien-Hua
UPP is 9AA655
Streetwise-2, JOT-1, Medical-3, Electronics-1, Grav Vehicle-1

His Streetwise skills is allowed a +1DM except when governed by EDU or SOC.

Throws made on his Electronics, JOT, and Grav Vehicle skills always receive a +1DM (unless a Stat is reduced for some reason...like combat).

His Medical skill will only get the +1DM when the task throw is governed by STR, DEX or END (which is hardly ever).


Bromley Riieve's UPP is 8889AB

Since every stat Bromely has is higher than 6, all of his Level-1 and Level-2 skills will receive a +1DM.

But, any Level-3 skill will receive the +1DM only when governed by INT, EDU, or SOC.

 

[Supplement Four]

Check this out. I'm thinking this is pretty cool...and that it improves the UGM task system.

I've been fiddling with the Natural Ability Check in UGM, trying to make the system flow a bit better. (Not that is flows badly--I just wanted to see if I could improve on the idea. I think I have. Keep reading.)


-------------------------------------
-------------------------------------
-------------------------------------


What if we scratch the Natural Ability DM all together.

In place of it, we assign a specific DM based on Natural Ability, tied to the character's skill.

This way, Natural Ability will effect different skills differently. And, an account is made for experience & natural ability over lap (high skill levels won't benefit from natural ability often--which makes some sense to me).

Here's what I'm thinking....

--1-- Natural Ability goes away as we're doing it now.

--2-- UGM tasks are rolled the same (except for the Natural Ability part of the roll).

--3-- New Natural Ability DM will be known before dice roll.


New Natural Ability DM...

When Skill x 3 is equal to or less than governor stat, then use a +1 DM. Skill-0 skills are not elligible for this.


=====================

Examples.

Da Bien-Hua
UPP is 9AA655
Streetwise-2, JOT-1, Medical-3, Electronics-1, Grav Vehicle-1

His Streetwise skills is allowed a +1DM except when governed by EDU or SOC.

Throws made on his Electronics, JOT, and Grav Vehicle skills always receive a +1DM (unless a Stat is reduced for some reason...like combat).

His Medical skill will only get the +1DM when the task throw is governed by STR, DEX or END (which is hardly ever).


Bromley Riieve's UPP is 8889AB

Since every stat Bromely has is higher than 6, all of his Level-1 and Level-2 skills will receive a +1DM.

But, any Level-3 skill will receive the +1DM only when governed by INT, EDU, or SOC.

 

[Supplement Four]

AND...

If the UGM goes this route, there could be a new use for the JOT skill.

As in: A character can use his JOT skill level when figuring his naturalability modifier.

Thus, a character with JOT-1 would consider all of his stats 1 point higher when looking for the natural ability DM.

If Jon has INT-5 and Computer-2, he won't normally get the +1DM. But, if Jon also has JOT-1, then Jon will get the natural ability DM.

 

[Supplement Four]

AND...

If the UGM goes this route, there could be a new use for the JOT skill.

As in: A character can use his JOT skill level when figuring his naturalability modifier.

Thus, a character with JOT-1 would consider all of his stats 1 point higher when looking for the natural ability DM.

If Jon has INT-5 and Computer-2, he won't normally get the +1DM. But, if Jon also has JOT-1, then Jon will get the natural ability DM.

 

[Supplement Four]

A problem, of course, is the separation of all stats--which is something that is needed in the UGM (otherwise, the UTP is a good task system to use).

So, with this Skillx3 concept, does each stat matter? Or, does only multiples of 3 matter?

I'm just thinking out loud (again) in this thread.

What do you UGM users think of this?

 

[Supplement Four]

A problem, of course, is the separation of all stats--which is something that is needed in the UGM (otherwise, the UTP is a good task system to use).

So, with this Skillx3 concept, does each stat matter? Or, does only multiples of 3 matter?

I'm just thinking out loud (again) in this thread.

What do you UGM users think of this?

 

[aramis]

WJP:

The value of the physicals is individualized quite well outside of tasks: damage absorption.

Mentals have a less profound but equally quantitized non-task role: the Experience limit is Int+Edu. (I DO use it, even in MT. Under CT, it was seldom relevant; under MT, it often can become relevant.)

Soc levels are thus the only one where the quantization not reduced in value by non-task elements, at least not until SS is A+.

Further, under CT, skill levels of 4+ are fairly rare, thus making stats over 9 pretty much irrelevant here...

Is it essential that stats have resolution in the task system when there is individual resolution for non-task activities?

(I'm not trying to be snide; I'm just looking at it as a student of task systems...)

 

[aramis]

WJP:

The value of the physicals is individualized quite well outside of tasks: damage absorption.

Mentals have a less profound but equally quantitized non-task role: the Experience limit is Int+Edu. (I DO use it, even in MT. Under CT, it was seldom relevant; under MT, it often can become relevant.)

Soc levels are thus the only one where the quantization not reduced in value by non-task elements, at least not until SS is A+.

Further, under CT, skill levels of 4+ are fairly rare, thus making stats over 9 pretty much irrelevant here...

Is it essential that stats have resolution in the task system when there is individual resolution for non-task activities?

(I'm not trying to be snide; I'm just looking at it as a student of task systems...)

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Aramis:
Is it essential that stats have resolution in the task system when there is individual resolution for non-task activities?

Absolutely. That's why UGM was created. I like the UTP. I do. I used to use it all the time.

But, bottom line, there is a difference between a character with INT-9 and a character with INT-5.

The character with the higher INT should get some edge on the other character who is not as bright, when making intelligence based tasks.

The UTP (DGP/MT task system) doesn't do that well at all. The UGM does.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Aramis:
Is it essential that stats have resolution in the task system when there is individual resolution for non-task activities?

Absolutely. That's why UGM was created. I like the UTP. I do. I used to use it all the time.

But, bottom line, there is a difference between a character with INT-9 and a character with INT-5.

The character with the higher INT should get some edge on the other character who is not as bright, when making intelligence based tasks.

The UTP (DGP/MT task system) doesn't do that well at all. The UGM does.

 

[Golan2072]

I think that the older system (i.e. a "natural" task roll below the characteritic gives DM+1) is somewhat more intuitive; I generally don't like multiplication and subdivision in task throws, and skillx3 has its complexity problems, plus high stats will benefit only very skilled characters under the new system, and IMHO it should be the other way around.

Another option - used by Paul Elliott's task system - is to have target numbers and then give a +DM if the relevant stat is above or equal to the target number, and a -DM if the stat is below the target number.

 

[Golan2072]

I think that the older system (i.e. a "natural" task roll below the characteritic gives DM+1) is somewhat more intuitive; I generally don't like multiplication and subdivision in task throws, and skillx3 has its complexity problems, plus high stats will benefit only very skilled characters under the new system, and IMHO it should be the other way around.

Another option - used by Paul Elliott's task system - is to have target numbers and then give a +DM if the relevant stat is above or equal to the target number, and a -DM if the stat is below the target number.

 

[mike wightman]

I agree with Employee.

The beauty of UGM to me is its simplicity and ease of use/explanation.
As soon as you start to introduce complicating factors and extra rules it becomes a bit harder to use.

With total familiarity of the system then such complications can be introduced, I just wonder if they add anything to add to the playability of the rules?

 

[mike wightman]

I agree with Employee.

The beauty of UGM to me is its simplicity and ease of use/explanation.
As soon as you start to introduce complicating factors and extra rules it becomes a bit harder to use.

With total familiarity of the system then such complications can be introduced, I just wonder if they add anything to add to the playability of the rules?

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
I agree with Employee.

I'm agreeing with both of you.

I'm just thinking out loud, trying to make UGM "better".

But, it doesn't look like this thought is "better".

With total familiarity of the system then such complications can be introduced, I just wonder if they add anything to add to the playability of the rules?

I'm not sure if what I proposed is more complicated. It might be, but is was seeming simpler last night.

I was going for a straight bonus, based on stat--something easy to figure on the fly that takes no more time than the current Natural Ability Check part of the roll.

The thing I don't like about it is that there is no separation of each stat.

You're both right. Let's scratch this idea and keep UGM the way it is.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
I agree with Employee.

I'm agreeing with both of you.

I'm just thinking out loud, trying to make UGM "better".

But, it doesn't look like this thought is "better".

With total familiarity of the system then such complications can be introduced, I just wonder if they add anything to add to the playability of the rules?

I'm not sure if what I proposed is more complicated. It might be, but is was seeming simpler last night.

I was going for a straight bonus, based on stat--something easy to figure on the fly that takes no more time than the current Natural Ability Check part of the roll.

The thing I don't like about it is that there is no separation of each stat.

You're both right. Let's scratch this idea and keep UGM the way it is.