MichaelSTee
SOC-12
Was just looking at the ship on p46 of the MT Player's Manual. I always liked the lines of it. Has there ever been a name and design for this?
Thanks
Thanks
Need help identifying ship
- Thread starter MichaelSTee
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MichaelSTee
SOC-12
Thank you, @atpollard . I will look into TNE1248.
(edit) Well, there's a 300-dton Frontier Trader in 1248_Starships_1 (including deck plan). But it's not quite the same. I think the one in the Players Manual looks more like a 100 or 200 dton ship. I always saw it as more like a Beowulf.
(edit) Well, there's a 300-dton Frontier Trader in 1248_Starships_1 (including deck plan). But it's not quite the same. I think the one in the Players Manual looks more like a 100 or 200 dton ship. I always saw it as more like a Beowulf.
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That was probably the one that I was remembering. I just remembered the “flattened disk” shape at the front.
The MT PM ship reminds me of a stripped Millennium Falcon.
It might be the 400 ton Solomani Sundowner Class Free Trader (see CT:Alien Module 6 - Solomani and DGP Aliens Volume 2: Solomani & Aslan (where it first gets its class-name)).
I can see a "family resemblance" ...
"Free Trader (type SA): Using a 400-ton hull, the type SA Free Trader is a moderate-sized ship designed for small-time merchant operations. It mounts jump drive-D, maneuver drive-D, and power plant-D, giving it a performance of 2G and jump-2. Fuel tankage of 100 tons supports the power plant and one jump-2. Adjacent to the bridge is a computer Model/1 bis. There are thirteen staterooms and no low berths. The ship has two hard-points, and two tons allocated to fire control; no weapons are installed. The ship has one 20-ton launch mounted in the nose of the ship. The cargo hold carries 160 tons. The ship is streamlined.
The ship requires a basic crew of five: pilot, navigator, two engineers, and a steward/medic. Two gunners may be added if called for. One of the engineers is assigned to pilot the launch. The ship can carry eight high or middle passengers. The free trader costs MCr133.4 (including 10% discount for standard design) and takes 14 months to construct."
[Posted under Fair Use Policy from CT AM 06 Solomani]
[I do not have DGP Aliens Vol 2.]
"Free Trader (type SA): Using a 400-ton hull, the type SA Free Trader is a moderate-sized ship designed for small-time merchant operations. It mounts jump drive-D, maneuver drive-D, and power plant-D, giving it a performance of 2G and jump-2. Fuel tankage of 100 tons supports the power plant and one jump-2. Adjacent to the bridge is a computer Model/1 bis. There are thirteen staterooms and no low berths. The ship has two hard-points, and two tons allocated to fire control; no weapons are installed. The ship has one 20-ton launch mounted in the nose of the ship. The cargo hold carries 160 tons. The ship is streamlined.
The ship requires a basic crew of five: pilot, navigator, two engineers, and a steward/medic. Two gunners may be added if called for. One of the engineers is assigned to pilot the launch. The ship can carry eight high or middle passengers. The free trader costs MCr133.4 (including 10% discount for standard design) and takes 14 months to construct."
[Posted under Fair Use Policy from CT AM 06 Solomani]
[I do not have DGP Aliens Vol 2.]
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This is pretty much the R2 ("Big Far Trader") that's implied by the engine bay size of the 400Td Standard Hull from LBB2'81. Its drive bay is sized for matched D drives with enough room to make the Power Plant a Size E if desired (to enable Double-Fire).
The standard Type R (Subsidized Merchant) has a lot of wasted drive bay space, despite having oversized drives. They're Size C when Size B would still yield J1/1G (this is from being a LBB2'77 build that wasn't corrected for the changes of '81).
I think there are two reasons for this. The first is to build-in the upgrade path from a Type R -- when you strike it rich, you can just plow the money back into the ship you already have, rather than having to buy a new one (that is to say, buy again, since the Type R is the upgrade path from the Type A that the player party likely started out with). The second is to handicap the Type R with wasted space (along with the carried Launch) so it's not vastly more profitable per payload ton than the Type A.
I kind of like the idea of a "disc-like" Far Trader. Oblate spheroid ("flattened sphere"), maybe?
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Always fun until you start getting into specifics (like deck plans tend to demand).
Any kind of cargo hold is going to have to assume 1 of 2 possible shapes ... rectangular prism (for rectangular cargo lot containers) or hexagonal prism (for trapezoidal cargo lot containers?
).The best possible way to handle any kind of cargo loading/unloading arrangement is to stipulate that the entire cargo bay is some kind of gigantic grav lift, so the whole ventral size of the craft descends when landed, flops down the ramps onto it and you've got a roll on/roll off platform that all the cargo pallets and containers get maneuvered onto and removed from. This means that the landing gear needs to be "tall" so as to have enough headroom clearance to work cargo loading/unloading underneath between the landing legs (or just keep the gravitics turned on the whole time and "float" above the loading/unloading at higher tech levels of construction).
Any type of crew quarters and passenger accommodations then becomes the deck "over" the cargo hold, so you've got a minimum 2 decks of starship (3 if you want to make a double deck height cargo bay, but then the "flattened sphere" is less flat and more spherical).
From a LBB5.80 perspective, there is DEFINITELY an advantage to going with a Configuration: 6 hull design (+20% to +10% to -20% for streamlining expense on hulls) so the "Flying Saucer" form factor definitely has its upsides for a cash strapped merchant operation. But as soon as you start trying to draw deck plans for it, things rapidly get "3D weird" in a hurry, because of the shapes involved.
I assumed dTons 200 because of the size of the dorsal turret. Assuming there could be a ventral turret, that would put the ship at 200 dTons, but that was just one clue I used to decide it should be 200 dTons. Unless those were particle barbettes.Always fun until you start getting into specifics (like deck plans tend to demand).
Any kind of cargo hold is going to have to assume 1 of 2 possible shapes ... rectangular prism (for rectangular cargo lot containers) or hexagonal prism (for trapezoidal cargo lot containers?
The best possible way to handle any kind of cargo loading/unloading arrangement is to stipulate that the entire cargo bay is some kind of gigantic grav lift, so the whole ventral size of the craft descends when landed, flops down the ramps onto it and you've got a roll on/roll off platform that all the cargo pallets and containers get maneuvered onto and removed from. This means that the landing gear needs to be "tall" so as to have enough headroom clearance to work cargo loading/unloading underneath between the landing legs (or just keep the gravitics turned on the whole time and "float" above the loading/unloading at higher tech levels of construction).
Any type of crew quarters and passenger accommodations then becomes the deck "over" the cargo hold, so you've got a minimum 2 decks of starship (3 if you want to make a double deck height cargo bay, but then the "flattened sphere" is less flat and more spherical).
From a LBB5.80 perspective, there is DEFINITELY an advantage to going with a Configuration: 6 hull design (+20% to +10% to -20% for streamlining expense on hulls) so the "Flying Saucer" form factor definitely has its upsides for a cash strapped merchant operation. But as soon as you start trying to draw deck plans for it, things rapidly get "3D weird" in a hurry, because of the shapes involved.
If I was designing this thing as a decent merchant:
a) All the inside face of the outer hull would be where I would put all the systems/stations, fuel, etc.
b) All cargo and passenger space are in the center.
c) There will be forward ventral ramp and aft ventral ramp. If your ship's Cargo Master / Supercargo is worth his slot on the ship will know where you are going, what you expect to sell where (or what the cargo has as a destination), and will load the ship in the order such that when you land at every location, the material that needs moved out is at the aft ventral ramp. Similarly, the things right at the forward ventral ramp are things last off (as expected).
d) I would not drop the entire lower deck. It seems convenient, but my lord, the weight and the power of the hydraulic jacks would be incredibly large. Instead foreward and aft ramps are the answer. It also is easier to only open one smaller exit or entry point if you are at a sketchy landing. Easier to protect one small entry than the entire bottom of your ship sitting on the ground....
The drawing (due to trying to figure various volumes on a curved hull) would be annoying. That's the only troublesome part. You can conform work stations and life support and everything to the hull without much trouble (because we don't know much about the contents and there aren't any issues with spreading your Jump Drive around the hull.....).
Gravity control makes the effort magically "free".
Assuming artificial gravity, of course, and you almost have to (either that or have the ventrally-centered maneuver drive on a gimbal that can pivot 90o from straight down to straight aft...)Note: I call dibs on that design, kinda.
Extremely good point.
Annoying, yes. Not at all impossible, though -- just requires visualizing the geometric figures that comprise it, and adding/subtracting stuff. For example, the front half (without the protruding flight deck) is half of an oblate spheroid. [4/3*pi*height*(radius^2), and take half of that]. The back half (without the "tent") is roughly a conic section with both the front and aft slices being ellipses. Construct the "attic" out of trapezoids. And so on.
Interior sections are just a matter of taking the volume of the entire exterior figure, figuring what fraction of it is included, and subtracting the parts that aren't included from that fraction. Yes, that's easier said than done, but it's also a lot easier if you've got a drawing to work with -- but I don't have time for that at the moment (I'll likely come back to it later this evening when I'm less busy).
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GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
I would map the ship at 100 tons, based on that turret. Top and bottom curving takes care of fuel volume.
MichaelSTee
SOC-12
I would have said 200 dtons, looking at the turret but I might have thought it was 2 decks high
kilemall
SOC-14 5K
Looks to me like one main deck and a second spinal deck like the Sulieman with an air/raft hatch forward of the turret, and 100 tons. Basically a flattened sphere Type S.
Given the two bridge windows up front, I would call it the Horseshoe Crab. Stick a retractable detection/antenna array out back and the look is complete.
I approve. I was considering the detail that you're calling the air/raft hatch to be a fuel skimming scoop with a slatted grille, but it works as a roll-up door too. The dorsal dents at about the 3- and 9-o'clock positions would then be the skim scoops.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
The turret and air/raft hatch give some sense of scale. Using sophisticated mapping technology - a ruler - it has a length of ~17 (deck plan square sides) and a width of ~14
