Gray Pennell
SOC-12
Can anyone tell me the year the Imperium reached tech level 15, obtained jump 6 (I think these will be the same year) and the year the Black Globe was discovered?
Need some timeline help
- Thread starter Gray Pennell
- Start date
far-trader
SOC-14 10K
Have you checked DonM's Traveller Integrated Timeline?
Scroll down the page linked below a bit to download the free pdf:
http://dmckinne.winterwar.org/trav.html
Scroll down the page linked below a bit to download the free pdf:
http://dmckinne.winterwar.org/trav.html
Let's see, that would be 19.. oh, you mean in the Imperium calender!
Try Don's timeline @ http://dmckinne.winterwar.org/pdfs/TravellerIntegratedTimeline.pdf
Circa 1000 has 'Third Imperium at TL 15. Referee's Companion, GDW, 1988, p. 34.'
1103 has 'Emperor Strephon orders the beginning of Project Longbow II, using the entire width of the Imperium as its long baseline, with data carried by jump-6 couriers to Depot (Lishun 1219). GURPS Traveller, SJG, 1998, p. 81'
101-1105 has 'TNS - Regina (Spinward Marches 1910) - Imperium announces plans to begin deploying jump-6 drop tank express boats on all major express routes within a decade, cutting time from Regina to the Imperial Core to under 25 weeks. JTAS #02, GDW, 1979, p. 05.'
1084 has 'Kinunir class colonial cruiser "Ninkur Sagga" suffers either a spontaneous missile detonation or a freak globe screen failure (accounts differ) while engaged on the port dorsal flank at the Battle of Two Suns. Adventure 01 - The Kinunir, GDW, 1979, p. 11.'
(Wiki also has some timeline info @ http://traveller.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline)
Try Don's timeline @ http://dmckinne.winterwar.org/pdfs/TravellerIntegratedTimeline.pdf
Circa 1000 has 'Third Imperium at TL 15. Referee's Companion, GDW, 1988, p. 34.'
1103 has 'Emperor Strephon orders the beginning of Project Longbow II, using the entire width of the Imperium as its long baseline, with data carried by jump-6 couriers to Depot (Lishun 1219). GURPS Traveller, SJG, 1998, p. 81'
101-1105 has 'TNS - Regina (Spinward Marches 1910) - Imperium announces plans to begin deploying jump-6 drop tank express boats on all major express routes within a decade, cutting time from Regina to the Imperial Core to under 25 weeks. JTAS #02, GDW, 1979, p. 05.'
1084 has 'Kinunir class colonial cruiser "Ninkur Sagga" suffers either a spontaneous missile detonation or a freak globe screen failure (accounts differ) while engaged on the port dorsal flank at the Battle of Two Suns. Adventure 01 - The Kinunir, GDW, 1979, p. 11.'
(Wiki also has some timeline info @ http://traveller.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline)
Gray Pennell
SOC-12
Thanks all thats what I thought. I forgot to search the timeline using TL my bad.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Alternatively just dig out the MT Referee's Companion and look in the Technology section.
At the end the dates the Imperium achieved its TL thresholds are given.
700 for TL14, 1000 for TL15.
Note that the Imperium did not discover the black globe technology , they discovered ancient era caches of them. Which begs the question are the reverse engineered black globes of TL15 in HG really a TL15 technology...
At the end the dates the Imperium achieved its TL thresholds are given.
700 for TL14, 1000 for TL15.
Note that the Imperium did not discover the black globe technology , they discovered ancient era caches of them. Which begs the question are the reverse engineered black globes of TL15 in HG really a TL15 technology...
Gray Pennell
SOC-12
Shhh dont tell people that
Cobalt Accord will get you. Also even if put on ships at 1000ish it was probably only the knock offs wich would have taken decades to build and decades more to research. Even before then the globes just floated around till someone got them to work. So I bet they where discovered several centuries before the CT timeline puts them in action.Yes, but what exactly does that mean? I don't think it's the exact years someone invented respectively the jump-5 and the jump-6 drives. It would be a staggering coincidence if jump-4, jump-5, and jump-6 all were invented in years divisible by 100. So I think they are dates chosen by Imperial historians as the dates a sufficient number of Imperial worlds had reached TL13, 14, and 15. The problem with that is to figure out what "a sufficient number" means to Imperial historians. And to figure out how much before those dates the respective jump drives were actually invented.
It's my theory that when the jump-6 drive was invented, the Imperial Navy kept is a military secret for several decades, and that once the drive became known to enough people that it was silly to keep that up[*], several more decades went by before TL15 really became widespread enough to meet whatever criteria those historians consider significant.
[*] Once a drive was known to be possible, it was probably reinvented separately by dozens of Imperial worlds over the next few years.
(Incidentally, I think the same thing happened when jump-5 was invented. So the Scouts were not allowed to upgrade the X-boat network to jump-5, which caused the Imperial Bureaucracy to switch to sending orders and reports by Navy couriers, which in turn meant that when jump-5 was declassified, there was not political pressure to upgrade the X-boats and no funds allocated to do so. Exactly the same happened again with jump-6. Which is why the X-boat network is in the ridiculously inefficient state it is in the Classic Era.)
Why not? IMO if you can build something at TL X, it's TL X, even if you didn't invent it until later (Indeed, even if you COULDN'T have invented it until later). Black Globe generators is an example of something that (probably) wouldn't have been invented until much later, but now the Imperium has figured ouit how to build them. The capacitors that allow drop tanks is another example. Usable at lower TLs than 15 (I can't remember the exact details), but not invented until the late 11th Century, six or seven decades after the Imperium reached TL 15.
Hans
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I agree with you , the TL14 and 15 dates are too contrived to be anything more than "this is the date we say it happened".
I also agree that TL15 drives, screens etc were under development and used on secret development ships much earlier than the 1000 date given.
As it is, many of the TL15 designs in S9 appear to be more like TL15/15 designs rather than pure TL15 builds.
The TL for the capacitors needed to make drop tanks work is given as TL12 in HG1, so it makes sense that these were also a military secret for a long time until declassified for commercial use.
I also agree that TL15 drives, screens etc were under development and used on secret development ships much earlier than the 1000 date given.
As it is, many of the TL15 designs in S9 appear to be more like TL15/15 designs rather than pure TL15 builds.
The TL for the capacitors needed to make drop tanks work is given as TL12 in HG1, so it makes sense that these were also a military secret for a long time until declassified for commercial use.
The best information available has already been given.
I went through the Timeline to collate when the Vilani, Droyne, Zhodani, Hivers, K'kree, Vargr, Solomani, Aslan, Sylean, and Imperium discovered what jump levels when.
Syleans discovered Jump-1 before 1776, Jump-2 at about -650, no data on Jump-3, Jump-4 at about 300, Jump-5 at about 700, and Jump-6 at about 1000.
Enjoy.
I went through the Timeline to collate when the Vilani, Droyne, Zhodani, Hivers, K'kree, Vargr, Solomani, Aslan, Sylean, and Imperium discovered what jump levels when.
Syleans discovered Jump-1 before 1776, Jump-2 at about -650, no data on Jump-3, Jump-4 at about 300, Jump-5 at about 700, and Jump-6 at about 1000.
Enjoy.
Sylea fell to TL 10 before -1776 but maintained minimal interstellar trade, regained TL 11 (jump-2) around -650, regained TL 12 (jump-3) around -150. [RC:34]
Hans
GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
TL 15 is the point at which a Black Globe could be reverse engineered. The original cache of black globe generators was found somewhat earlier. I'm not sure where or if that date is referenced.
Which means it is the tech level at which it can be built, which makes it a TL 15 item. Note that this is a less effective version of black globes than the artifacts (IIRC the artifact globes are TL 18 -- something like that).
It isn't. We had a thread on that subject once and arrived at some time around Year 1000, give or take a couple of decades. But there are various unprovable assumptions involved in getting that date.
Hans
