Nested Accommodations

[Icosahedron]

Sabredog's consular vessel described here:
http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showpost.php?p=352296&postcount=9
got me wondering what accommodations are necessary for carriers.

If you have a mother ship carrying a vessel that itself has staterooms, is it necessary for the mother ship to have staterooms for everyone, or can the crew of the carried vessel reside within the carried vessel while the mother ship is in jump?

I don't think I've seen a rule about this, so maybe it's a matter of personal preference? Is there a RL precedent?

 

[Seriayne]

For fighters and such, I always make provisions aboard the mothership - I wouldn't expect the fighter crew to live out a week in jumpspace in their 20 or 50 ton vessel, even if it had a couple of staterooms for deep space patrols etc.

But for large battleriders with long range missions (where the tender is supposed to be hiding, or WAY away from front lines), then yeah, I would assume the riders function as extensions of the main ship, and contain their crew accommodations without duplication on the carrier ship.

 

[Blue Ghost]

I think he's talking more along the lines of a Star Warsish "rebel blockade runner" docked inside a star destroyer type of deal.

In our campaigns he had something like that happen a couple of times. The solution was pretty much this; stay on the ship. If there's room on the ship giving your starship a lift, then you can probably leave and and stay on the larger vessel. Think of a Winnebago riding a ferry. You can stay in your vehicle, or leave and hit the snack bar topside. Maybe even take a nap on the bench or something. Eventually you'll probably need to go back to your ship.

Not sure if that helps or not.

 

[sabredog]

The way I have have always figured it is similar to Blue Ghost's take: the docked ship has the extra life support and living space for it's own crew so they can live there while the ship is docked.

To use the consular ship example, the fighter crews (and the security team from the Marines) all live in the carrier's quarters. The crew of the Herald courier lives on the courier, but can always leave and wander around the carrier, but their beds are in the courier.

Now carriers like this tend to have much larger cargo bays than I usually have on other ships so that extra life support supplies can be carried to help with the load. I figure about 1/4 of what would be needed (1 ton) per stateroom (on both the the carrier and carried ship) would be sufficient. So for this example it comes out to 70 tons for the extra supplies (filters, scrubber supplies, food, toilet paper, etc.). Some of that can be taken from the mothership, some from the carried ship. That leaves between these two ships 140 tons of cargo space for regular cargo, training space for the Marines, elephants for barbarian dignitaries, and whatnot.

For things like small craft that doesn't have living quarters that are always used even while docked, the carrier has all the room needed for the crews. Like today, the pilots don't sleep in the F-18's.

Here is another example of this sort of thing IMTU:

Murmansk-class Scout Support Tender (type SD) TL-15

40,000 ton close structure w/ scoops and fuel purifier (High Guard design)

Jump Drive (5) Jump-5
Maneuver Drive (1) 1-G (Agility 0 / Emergency agility 1)
Power Plant (5) (energy=2000)

Fuel = 22,000 tons Cargo = 850 tons

Computer = Model 6fib (CPU-15/ Storage-35)

Vehicles = 2 Shuttles
2 Cutters / 2 extra modules (typically 2 passenger and 2 cargo)
100 ton Assembly / Maintenance Deck
Docking facilities for: 15, 100 ton type S & S(b) Scoutships
10, 150 ton type S(k) Scoutships

Crew: (126 Staterooms - includes extra facilities for entertainment and scout crews)

>Command<
Captain
XO/2nd Pilot
Pilot
Navigator
2 Medical Officers
Communications

>Engineering<
1 Chief Engineer
50 Ratings

>Flight<
4 Small Craft Pilots
4 Small Craft Nav/Gunners
60 Ground Crew

Medical Facilities include 4 Autodocs (16 total capacity) and 5 Emergency Low Berths

The Type SD (Scout Tender) Murmansk-class is designed to provide a mobile support base for scoutships operating throughout the Terran Empire. The ship carries enough supplies and has the facilities to repair and maintain scout ships of all 3 classes, and also acts as a transport to carry the shorter ranged scouts rapidly to areas where they are to be deployed.

The vessels are considered fleet tenders and not armed, but since they carry up to 25 scouts and are not considered a warship of the line they don’t need to be. The ships carry entertainment and relaxation facilities for the scout crews, and are available for use by “detached” scouts on a limited, first-come basis.

Ships in class include Murmansk, Portsmouth, New Bedford, Nantucket

 

[Blue Ghost]

Depending on the ship you could probably hand wave whatever it is you needed. Draft some deck plans of the adjoining spaces nearest your player's ship, and rough up whatever unique spaces you needed. That's if the actions on the larger vessel were pertinent to your adventure; i.e. the player's meet the captain/admiral, or some high ranking bureaucrat or noble.

As saberdog codified, if you have some starship combat among the big ships, then things could get interesting, and you'll need the extra set of starship codes.

Anecdote; I think I may have revisited this before, but I GM'd a session where our group's players found themselves docking their far trader into the massive hold of a battleship. One of the big behemoth Sylean Class BBs. I think I just threw it in there just for chuckles and grins. The players spent a week in the hold during jump, and didn't venture out into the BB. But, I did make it very cinematic by describing the cranes, gantries and small number of other ships docked inside with them. Not to mention the small number of fighters and BD marines and techs who occasionally floated by just to check up on things.

There were security checks, boardings/inspections, scans from within and from without, but no official interaction with the ship's higher officers. The BB in this case was acting as a taxi by ferrying our band of adventurers out of a contested region of space... or something like that.

Anyway, I know that doesn't address the technical questions, but I hope it helps add flavor.

 

[sabredog]

LOL, I had the same thing happen once in my campaign when the players suffered a malfunction in their power plant (they had been skimping on repairs, tsk, tsk) and had to "thumb" a ride form a passing cruiser.

They were moved into the docking bay by the cruiser's lighters and then told they couldn't leave their ship "For your own safety you understand.". They were bugged because they felt they were being snubbed by the captain and sent him a complaint.

The end result being that ten minutes later they were promptly ejected from the docking cradle and left adrift without so much as a by-your-leave.

 

[sabredog]

As saberdog codified, if you have some starship combat among the big ships, then things could get interesting, and you'll need the extra set of starship codes.

For ships like the two I've described here and on the other thread I have a different set of combat results tables to reflect the extra craft carried on board. And when those craft are hit because of a laser strike on the docking bay then I just drag out the regular tables and determine what happened to the docked ship. Or, for really big carriers, if you hit the bay were the fighter squadron is held I roll for a percentage kill on the fighters to simulate chains of explosions and other catastrophic damage to a hanger bay.

Once the players were on a monster (20kt) exploration ship that carried several Type S Scouts as life boats/long-range survey ships. The ship came under attack by hostiles and the players ran for their assigned Type S only to find that when they undocked the jump drive had been slagged by a particle beam hit in the docking bays.

They were screaming for help from the other fleeing Scouts, but just got to see them wink out one at a time as the shot into jump space while the players just spiraled down to the planet below. Cruel I know, but the random roll sparked a new direction for the adventure.

 

[Blue Ghost]

LOL, I had the same thing happen once in my campaign when the players suffered a malfunction in their power plant (they had been skimping on repairs, tsk, tsk) and had to "thumb" a ride form a passing cruiser.

They were moved into the docking bay by the cruiser's lighters and then told they couldn't leave their ship "For your own safety you understand.". They were bugged because they felt they were being snubbed by the captain and sent him a complaint.

The end result being that ten minutes later they were promptly ejected from the docking cradle and left adrift without so much as a by-your-leave.

Heh, my guys knew better. 200dkt of Sylean Class BB is nothing to scoff at, much less demand a mint be placed on your pillow before you debark. With my guys it was more or less groveling from inside their 400 ton pee shooter of a starship; "Oh high and mighty Imperial Navy battleship, we stoop and bow before you. Let us pay homage to our saviors by shutting the F-UP and smiling big. Okay, everybody pop an anti-depressant and think happy thoughts." Facsimile ---->

In short, our guys were pretty cautious. I think largely because I threw 'em a curve every now and then in the guise of one of these encounters.

 

[sabredog]

Yeah, the group I had took the position of treating the military like some kind of public servants at the DMV. When they finally limped back to the world with the (expensive) aid of a rescue tug they saw that the cruiser was in orbit and filed a complaint at the base.

The commodore in command invited them to come for a meeting where they were politely informed that His Majesty's warships are not in the business of carrying strays because the crew of said stray failed to maintain it's power plant as required by law. Therefore, the commodore was obliged, so sorry to have to do this but duty is duty, to levy a fine and impound the players' ship until repairs were made and the ship no longer a hazard to navigation.

And by the way, discourtesy to an Imperial Officer might result in a challenge to a duel, but the commodore would be happy to produce a second for such an event if the player doesn't have anyone in mind.

An edifying experience for the players and they were much more polite to the Navy crews after that. They even sent the captain of the cruiser a crate of wine from the cargo they were hauling by way of an apology when the captain's XO paid them a visit later with the captain's calling card inviting the player-captain to "grass before breakfast".

In return the Chief in charge of the cruiser's stores and machine shops helped them with the repairs for their ship and it all worked out in the end.

Except for the tattoo of the horse's butt that the player captain woke up with on his face the morning after the drinking party they had with the Engineering Chief and his crew the night after the repairs were finished and the cruiser left.

 

[Icosahedron]

Except for the tattoo of the horse's butt that the player captain woke up with on his face the morning after the drinking party they had with the Engineering Chief and his crew the night after the repairs were finished and the cruiser left.

:rofl:

Thanks for the responses. Yeah, that's pretty much the way I've been doing it - subsidiary crews will sleep aboard their own ships if they have cabins, but the mother ship may have some additional communal accommodations, recreational facilities, etc to account for the extra crew, depending what is available on the carried ship.