On Corsairs, Pirates, Smugglers and Privateers.

[aramis]

Hmmm, sometimes, even with a treaty, if the prize was rich enough to make the ruler happy, you were fair game.

Yep. And the Barbary coast was mostly looking for slaves - either to ransom back, to sell on to others, or to perform base level labor. It was an ugly bit... but it was a part of the overall ottoman empire, and thus part of the "Civilized World." Right up until the US got mad and stomped on them.

 

[sabredog]

Francis Drake was a pirate, albeit a sanctioned one, when it came to attacking the Spanish. No orders have ever been shown with respect to his voyage around the World, although there are some suspicions that exploration was also on the agenda. Elizabeth did apparently put up some money in backing the voyage. By Knighting him on his return, Elizabeth indirectly declared war on Spain.

Drake was commissioned by Elizabeth I to seize property (including ships) of Spain while making the trip around the world, it was the whole point of the exercise. Plant the flag was the dominant reason for the vast majority of exploration at the time and since Spain was working up to a war with England at the time Drake took that war to the Spanish in the (then called) West Indies and anywhere else he encountered them along the way. Formal Letters of Marque did not exist yet, so Drake was commissioned in secret by the Queen so that plausible dependability could be used if required, and the flip side being the Crown could legally claim the prizes and spoils Drake captured and sent home. It was a fine point, but privateering was a new idea and hadn't had all the kinks worked out.

This does highlight the point that it is important that all involved parties understand the legalities and fine print involved with privateering vs. piracy. You could start a war you weren't ready for if you weren't ready (hence Elizabeth keeping Drake's commission secret at that time) for it because the other side felt your privateer was really just a part of your navy.

 

[sabredog]

I like to think of myself as a decent enough space admiral, but I had not thought of pirates going after my auxilleries. The other navy sure, but not some damned vermin. Thing is as soon as I read it, I realized you are correct, sir. They do make for an excellent target, often lightly armed (if at all) and armored, and they come with Fuel, Ammo, Life Support, Medical supplies, pretty much anything a right proper smart corsair wants lots of.

Dangnabbit! Now I have to start arming up my auxilleries. Great, that goes over well at the Budget hearings, "Yes, My Lords, I do need 15.754 billion Credits to arm our Auxiliaries, and that is just with a couple triple beam laser turrets. Turrets, My Lords, not even barrettes. Now, if you could see your way toward giving me my initial request 533.82 billion Credits...". :devil:

Because, while we have our differences we share a love of the logistical end of war. Ah, those lovey safe and clean numbers with none of that getting shot at stuff...mostly.

Well, maybe. Auxiliaries can be, and should be, escorted when entering dangerous "waters" so arming them probably isn't worth the expense when you already have plenty of gunboat types to cruise with them. And how often do they cruise around in any case when not during maneuvers. To arm them sufficiently enough to stave off pirates determined enough to take one brings up the question of if it is worth also having those auxiliaries blown up during the attack rather than just surrender the ship, ransom the crew, and live to see another day while the warships go after the pirates that hijacked you?

After all, its one thing to be pirate and attack the occasional private merchant. The cops come after you, maybe the local navy if you really make a nuisance of yourself, but keep it low-key and don't kill anyone and chances are you'll live a long time.

It is something altogether of a different animal when you attack and seize one of the Navy's own ships. It definitely attracts lots of fatal attention from the type of pirate chasers you can't outgun or run far enough from.

It would be cheaper, easier, and a heck of a lot safer to just snag a private bulk carrier or something similar (or a commercial tanker if they exist) and convert it to an oiler for your pirate ship (s). Park it somewhere quiet and it can form the basis of a supply waypoint suitable for minor field repairs and refueling. Maybe even just get a stack of cutter modules or similar...haul them out to the same sort of location and use them for fuel tanks and stores. Use a cutter for the refueling from the local gas giant and that way the modules can just be filled as needed. Add a processing plant to the rig and you have refined fuel.

 

[Timerover51]

This is an interesting comment on German World War One auxiliary cruiser operations that I discovered in a Royal Navy handbook on the subject for World War 2.

A larger number of auxiliary cruisers of the Moewe-Wolf type would not by themselves have won the war, but in conjunction with submarines, might in the years 1917-18 have been able to contribute what was wanting to secure victory, particularly if the North and South Atlantic routes had been seriously threatened at their terminals. Auxiliary cruisers would, however, have been particularly valuable at the commencement of the war had they been employed at once in large numbers. If for instance, the colliers of the supply bases at Manila and Batavia had each been fitted at Kiaochow with a single gun and a supplementary active service crew commanded by efficient young commanders—then, at a time, when no merchant ships had been armed, the trade in Australian and Indian waters would have been completely disorganised. The effect of these auxiliary cruisers might have been greatly strengthened by the Emden, perhaps also the Nuremberg in the Far East, and by the Dresden and Leipzig on the West Coast of South America. Owing, however, to everything being subordinated to the battle fleet and by systematic opposition to the "jeune ecole", cruiser warfare on a grand scale had never been thoroughly considered. Nevertheless, the weaker naval power possesses a powerful weapon in the auxiliary cruiser, which has greater effect, if wielded energetically, at the outbreak of war simultaneously in all oceans."

Emphasis added. A privateer could be considered as functioning as an auxiliary cruiser.

 

[Ulsyus]

I like to think of myself as a decent enough space admiral, but I had not thought of pirates going after my auxilleries. The other navy sure, but not some damned vermin. Thing is as soon as I read it, I realized you are correct, sir. They do make for an excellent target, often lightly armed (if at all) and armored, and they come with Fuel, Ammo, Life Support, Medical supplies, pretty much anything a right proper smart corsair wants lots of.

I recall reading an account by a sailor in an Australian destroyer in the Mediterranean in 1941 whose ship took an Italian merchantman. After the war all the crew at the time, or the families of the deceased, were posted cheques for their prize money. I was amazed to see that the concept was still around at that time. So, I suppose while auxiliaries can't engage in a standup fight, if they're armed sufficiently to cause a corsair to to hesitate over the cost/benefit equation of taking something, that might buy them the time they need to take the decision out of the pirate's hands.

 

[sabredog]

This is an interesting comment on German World War One auxiliary cruiser operations that I discovered in a Royal Navy handbook on the subject for World War 2.



Emphasis added. A privateer could be considered as functioning as an auxiliary cruiser.

I found a link to an illustration for one of those WW1 raiders. Heavy armament on one of those. Their descendents could easily be some up-gunned subbie fitted for commerce raiding.

http://raiderwolf.com/wp-content/gallery/maps/wolf-illo.jpg

 

[Timerover51]

Yep. And the Barbary coast was mostly looking for slaves - either to ransom back, to sell on to others, or to perform base level labor. It was an ugly bit... but it was a part of the overall ottoman empire, and thus part of the "Civilized World." Right up until the US got mad and stomped on them.

The US Navy did fight the Barbary Corsairs in the early 1800s, and then again paid a visit after the War of 1812. The British Royal Navy under Lord Pellew paid them a very serious visit in 1816 at Algiers, but problems continued until the French conquered the area in the mid-1800s.

It is the actions with the Barbary Pirates that gives the Marine Hymn the phrase "to the shores of Tripoli". Combat during the Mexican War of 1846-48 gives the Marines "From the Halls of Montezuma".

 

[Timerover51]

I found a link to an illustration for one of those WW1 raiders. Heavy armament on one of those. Their descendents could easily be some up-gunned subbie fitted for commerce raiding.

http://raiderwolf.com/wp-content/gallery/maps/wolf-illo.jpg

The German merchant raiders in World War 2 were even better equipped, to include torpedoes and aircraft.

 

[sabredog]

The German merchant raiders in World War 2 were even better equipped, to include torpedoes and aircraft.

This is a WW1 raider and it already has 20" torpedoes and a spotter plane. I don't know if that is typical, probably not, but this ship was pretty well-equipped for its mission.

The website has a lot of info on this particular ship's cruise because it set some kind of record. The crew used captured supplies and fuel to keep going and attacked Australia and New Zealand. Apparently the ship was a serious menace.

http://raiderwolf.com/

 

[McPerth]

Pirates might be highly interested in support ships and tankers, if the support ships are supplying naval vessels or military units, while tankers would give them the ability to make longer jumps or avoiding having to take the time to shim fuel.

While I agree in the goals you state here, I see more as targets for regular fleet raiders (akin of the Bismark in WII or Emden in WWI) than for privateers. I may well be wrong, but I guess privaters would be more interested in what they can capture or loot, and support ships and tankers ae probably too big (and so armed/escorted) for them to be worthy targets.

I envision the privateers more as raiders for enemy trade in "home space", and concentring more in small merchants that could be captured or looted, while avoiding larger ships.

 

[McPerth]

This is a WW1 raider and it already has 20" torpedoes and a spotter plane. I don't know if that is typical, probably not, but this ship was pretty well-equipped for its mission.

The website has a lot of info on this particular ship's cruise because it set some kind of record. The crew used captured supplies and fuel to keep going and attacked Australia and New Zealand. Apparently the ship was a serious menace.

http://raiderwolf.com/

I guess it's not too typical, and I'm petty sure it's from quite late WWI, as few ships could carry seaplanes by that time.

 

[Timerover51]

I found a link to an illustration for one of those WW1 raiders. Heavy armament on one of those. Their descendents could easily be some up-gunned subbie fitted for commerce raiding.

http://raiderwolf.com/wp-content/gallery/maps/wolf-illo.jpg

The following is a link to a study done by the Royal Navy in WW2 on German raiders in World War One. There is a good but brief discussion of the Wolf's cruise along with the other ships sent out. Some very nice comments on the use of radio intercepts and monitoring as well.

https://archive.org/details/ReviewOfGermanCruiserWarfare19141918

 

[mike wightman]

WW2 german commerce raiders built as disguised merchantmen - I posted this link many, many years ago but it's easier to re-post than trawl through the archives

http://www.bismarck-class.dk/hilfskreuzer/hilfskreuzer_menu.html

 

[Ulsyus]

The website has a lot of info on this particular ship's cruise because it set some kind of record. The crew used captured supplies and fuel to keep going and attacked Australia and New Zealand. Apparently the ship was a serious menace.

http://raiderwolf.com/

Supply lines from Aus and NZ and India were vulnerable to raiding, just like those going across the Atlantic. The Kormoran was a raider in WW2 that, due to it's disguise, was able to get pretty close to a RAN light cruiser, HMAS Sydney, and engage in a MAD duel with it. The wreck of the Sydney was found only a few years ago after on-again-off-again searches for decades.

One raider could do damage, but was vulnerable to concerted naval efforts to combat.

How much junk is out in interplanetary space? I'd thought of corsairs possibly hiding in/on rocks with slow trajectories close to transit routes between worlds or GG's and jump limits/points. Though, after millennia of exposure to this sort of thing you'd imagine the IN would be aware of the tactic and clear the spacelanes of such debris.

 

[Magnus von Thornwood]

There you assuming.

Well, maybe. Auxiliaries can be, and should be, escorted when entering dangerous "waters" so arming them probably isn't worth the expense when you already have plenty of gunboat types to cruise with them. And how often do they cruise around in any case when not during maneuvers. To arm them sufficiently enough to stave off pirates determined enough to take one brings up the question of if it is worth also having those auxiliaries blown up during the attack rather than just surrender the ship, ransom the crew, and live to see another day while the warships go after the pirates that hijacked you?

After all, its one thing to be pirate and attack the occasional private merchant. The cops come after you, maybe the local navy if you really make a nuisance of yourself, but keep it low-key and don't kill anyone and chances are you'll live a long time.

It is something altogether of a different animal when you attack and seize one of the Navy's own ships. It definitely attracts lots of fatal attention from the type of pirate chasers you can't outgun or run far enough from.

It would be cheaper, easier, and a heck of a lot safer to just snag a private bulk carrier or something similar (or a commercial tanker if they exist) and convert it to an oiler for your pirate ship (s). Park it somewhere quiet and it can form the basis of a supply waypoint suitable for minor field repairs and refueling. Maybe even just get a stack of cutter modules or similar...haul them out to the same sort of location and use them for fuel tanks and stores. Use a cutter for the refueling from the local gas giant and that way the modules can just be filled as needed. Add a processing plant to the rig and you have refined fuel.

I understand, as I stated in the OP that I am rigid and mean when it comes to pirates, and I hope you do too.

All pirates must hang! This is the overarching meme of my government navies. It does not matter if they take civilian ships or navy ships, if they rob on the Sovereign's Road they forfeit their lives. Period. It also means you (a navy spacer) have a duty to Civilization to fight these vermin, not give them rewards and no punishments. You don't just surrender the ship, first off it is a fleet ship, it will be repaired so, if needed you fight it. Also, arming auxilleries might be useful to keep enemy forces from just plucking them like flowers.

Now, given that most civilian ships generally don't carry munitions that is one of the reasons to take military auxilleries.

 

[Ulsyus]

Who crews these things? Who has had sufficient technical training, maintained currency, and descended low enough in their personal life to consider this as a way to live?

Real pirates today come from impoverished backgrounds, and can achieve a weapons overmatch against their adversaries, in an environment with sufficiently little security, to make the actions worth their while.

So who becomes a pirate? For how long do they do it? Are corsair vessels grimy things manned by disillusioned spacers who are almost slaves to their captain and his core crew who control the ship security system? Or are they the morally bankrupt who are hoping for a quick capture & sale of a vessel in order to get a share that would enable them to travel to another sector and live out their life in style and ease?

 

[sabredog]

Who crews these things? Who has had sufficient technical training, maintained currency, and descended low enough in their personal life to consider this as a way to live?

Real pirates today come from impoverished backgrounds, and can achieve a weapons overmatch against their adversaries, in an environment with sufficiently little security, to make the actions worth their while.

A lot of that depends on the kind of game you run. If it is on some backwater map far from the edges of the Empire (or its analog IYTU) then pirates can come from the same sources you bring up. They could be an alien culture who use pirating as a way to count coup or similar against a larger culture. They don't see it as "piracy", to them it is just the way they've always lived ...neobarbarians of a sort.

As for weapons it really depends on if you run a small vs. large ship universe. As we all know in the former any ship with sufficient turrets can call itself a battle ship and possibly make the name stick. In the latter warships are warships and it would have to be pretty impressive pirate to get a hold of something that could stand up to so much as a Gazelle or two. The rare pirate king might get a hold of something formidable, but not for long.

So who becomes a pirate? For how long do they do it? Are corsair vessels grimy things manned by disillusioned spacers who are almost slaves to their captain and his core crew who control the ship security system? Or are they the morally bankrupt who are hoping for a quick capture & sale of a vessel in order to get a share that would enable them to travel to another sector and live out their life in style and ease?

IMTU, as in real life, all of the above.

For some it is merely a moral slippery slope: they get in a jam and are far enough from prying eyes that when an opportunity comes along in the form of a fat merchant they decide (after much sweaty introspection and argument) to take her. Maybe the crew and captain realizes at that time how easy ships like that are as prey, like a tiger making its first human kill, and decide to try again. They scare themselves a bit on that one and decide to lay low to see if the cops show up....no one does....and then they go on after a third. And a fourth....and then come the pirate chasers and things get really interesting.

Maybe the crew has pressured the captain into it...or mutiny...or a ship captured by pirates has forced the crew (albeit some may choose voluntarily) to join them. Privateer crews during an inconveniently long period of peace who owe someone lots of money or their ship is forfeit. Or their lives.

The ship can be dirty, or since "going down" in space is less forgiving then on an ocean where their may be an island to swim to, the ship is kept in good order. The crew might not bathe regularly but they keep a clean ship, all Bristol Fashion and such.

 

[Timerover51]

Who crews these things? Who has had sufficient technical training, maintained currency, and descended low enough in their personal life to consider this as a way to live?

Hmm, I would suggest doing some reading on the Chicago Gangs in the 1920s and 1930s for a starter.

You might also take a look at some of the South American revolutions in the later 1800s, where control of the navy was a major factor for the revolutionaries, and some of the vessels were borderline pirates. Although the Peruvian ironclad Huascar was declared a pirate. Being on the loosing end of a revolution would do it very quickly.

Real pirates today come from impoverished backgrounds, and can achieve a weapons overmatch against their adversaries, in an environment with sufficiently little security, to make the actions worth their while.

See above, but also consider the potential for criminal activity when tracking someone down over several planets is not going to be easy or quick. No faster-that-light communication is a big headache for law enforcement. As for impoverished backgrounds, are you saying that all criminals come from impoverished backgrounds?

So who becomes a pirate? For how long do they do it? Are corsair vessels grimy things manned by disillusioned spacers who are almost slaves to their captain and his core crew who control the ship security system? Or are they the morally bankrupt who are hoping for a quick capture & sale of a vessel in order to get a share that would enable them to travel to another sector and live out their life in style and ease?

I would recommend doing some reading about historical pirates, particularly the articles covered in Alexandre Exquemelin's book The Buccaneers of America, where they clearly were not slaves, and had a set compensation list for injuries, among other things.

As for who becomes a pirate, in the OTU you have Vargr, Aslan, and Sword Worlders to start with. Add disaffected Solomani eager to twist the tail of the Imperium, naval vessels on the wrong side of a revolution, Belters looking for some quick returns, and frontier planets desperate for goods at cheap prices, and "Voila", you have pirates. Not a moral bankrupt, except maybe the Belters, in the lot. Then you could have revolutionaries out to seize a ship to transport or acquire needed weaponry for their activities. And that is just in the OTU.

Not sure about the K'kree, although given their extreme hatred of any meat-eater, they could probably justify piracy of human/Vargr/Aslan ships as simply vermin control and a positive public good.

If you have an alternate Traveller-based universe, where the Imperium either does not exist, or is much smaller and weaker, the possibilities are pretty much endless. Consider A. Bertram Chandler's Galactic Rim, where odd things slip in from other universes, such as the oversized intelligent Rats in Contraband from Otherspace.

 

[Kilgs]

So who becomes a pirate? For how long do they do it? Are corsair vessels grimy things manned by disillusioned spacers who are almost slaves to their captain and his core crew who control the ship security system? Or are they the morally bankrupt who are hoping for a quick capture & sale of a vessel in order to get a share that would enable them to travel to another sector and live out their life in style and ease?

The pirate book for Mongoose was one of the better products out there and it discusses the different kinds of pirates. From jumpcussers (opportunistic) to the professional.

 

[whulorigan]

The pirate book for Mongoose was one of the better products out there and it discusses the different kinds of pirates. From jumpcussers (opportunistic) to the professional.

I assume you mean the Pirate Section of Book 6: Scoundrel?