Chris Barlow
SOC-10
Lloyds Register and Lloyds Insurance share a name but have been separate organisations since Queen Victoria's reign. Lloyds Register helps create ship building standards and inspects ships to see if they meet these standards.
Space craft classification societies’ in Traveller?
- Thread starter Chris Barlow
- Start date
Chris Barlow
SOC-10
Ship Classification societies
A great explanation of the difference between Lloyds Register a classification society and lloyds Insurance. Lloyds Register and other classification societies now also cover relatively static marine structures such as oil and gas exploration rigs and production platforms. Transferring this to the Traveller universe. Classification societies might also set standards for and inspect space stations and asteroid mining complexes as well as space craft. :CoW:
A great explanation of the difference between Lloyds Register a classification society and lloyds Insurance. Lloyds Register and other classification societies now also cover relatively static marine structures such as oil and gas exploration rigs and production platforms. Transferring this to the Traveller universe. Classification societies might also set standards for and inspect space stations and asteroid mining complexes as well as space craft. :CoW:
Chris Barlow
SOC-10
Working for Lloyds Register is a great job. Although I am NOT a surveyor or marine engineer. I work as a contractor for Lloyds Register's fiance team. Thanks to everyone who has commented on this thread. Some might call it a bit too specialised for Traveller.
BlackBat242
SOC-14 1K
Sure... in T5 campaigns.
FreeTrav
SOC-14 1K
Do I detect a possible Freelance Traveller article?
Chris, if you can convert this into more of an essay format instead of essentially a bullet list, I think it would be a great article for Freelance Traveller! Please give the thought some serious consideration; it certainly comes under the advice to "write what you know".
Chris, if you can convert this into more of an essay format instead of essentially a bullet list, I think it would be a great article for Freelance Traveller! Please give the thought some serious consideration; it certainly comes under the advice to "write what you know".
It is pretty much version agnostic from my reading of it. This sort of thing is useful to any campaign, even non-Traveller ones with little adjustment.
The Star Port Authority and Surveyors societies may have the same effect but are not redundant as they use different ways.
Insurance are involved in market regulated activities. They want a surveyor's seaworthiness certificate before insuring the ship or cargo. No certificate for your rust bucket = no client and no sail.
Civil authorities (such as SPA) are involved in Public Protection Regulation. You do not care for insurance and want to sail, after all "this is my business"…. the Harbor Master (SPA) refuse sailing certificate (" I do not want your floating navigation hazard in my channel"), the Canadian CG, /US CG/ Guardia Di Finanzia/ etc…. could also perform random (or informed) safety inspection and prevent sailing.
have fun
Selandia
Chris Barlow
SOC-10
Spacecraft Classification as a Freelance Traveller article
To The Editor
Sorry for not being in touch sooner. As a regular reader of Freelance Traveller I would be honoured to expand this into essay format and submit as per the usual submission requirements. What sort of word count would be appropriate? I have never submitted an article on TRaveller before.
However as I wish to possibly do a a Mongoose first edition career for a spacecraft surveyor and do a few more adventure seeds based involving space craft classification societies. The article will not be submitted until early May, apologies.
Regards
Chris Barlow.
To The Editor
Sorry for not being in touch sooner. As a regular reader of Freelance Traveller I would be honoured to expand this into essay format and submit as per the usual submission requirements. What sort of word count would be appropriate? I have never submitted an article on TRaveller before.
However as I wish to possibly do a a Mongoose first edition career for a spacecraft surveyor and do a few more adventure seeds based involving space craft classification societies. The article will not be submitted until early May, apologies.
Regards
Chris Barlow.
Duke Craig
SOC-12
Thanks
Great article about Space craft classification societies. Thanks.
It was well written, informative, comprehensive and thought provoking.
Sometimes in cooperation or in competition...
The starship and spacecraft appreciation and classification society might be at the intersection of more than one of the following institutions (among many others):
Thanks for reading.
Please comment freely and franky on the spacecraft classification society idea I have proposed.
Great article about Space craft classification societies. Thanks.
It was well written, informative, comprehensive and thought provoking.
Sometimes in cooperation or in competition...
The starship and spacecraft appreciation and classification society might be at the intersection of more than one of the following institutions (among many others):
- Shipyards
- The Starport Authority.
- Imperial Ship Builders Association.
- Travellers Naval Architecture Society.
- The Travellers' Aid Society.
- And one or more MegaCorps such as: 1. Hortalez et Cie, LIC 2. General Products, LIC, ...others?
- And/or many smaller insurance or ship building concerns.
Thanks for reading.
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FreeTrav
SOC-14 1K
I will give you my "stock" answer on that: You write the article to give it the treatment you think the topic requires, and let me worry about word counts.
Early May is plenty of time for the July/August issue!
As you've outlined it, it's potentially an ambitious project; I like that! You can also, however, consider it as two or three separate-but-related articles: First, an overview of ship classification as a 'background' article (which is pretty much what I was targeting when I made the original suggestion); second, the ship surveyor career; and third, the adventure seeds (or combine the seeds with the career).
However you eventually choose to structure it, I look forward to seeing it!
BRJN
SOC-12
A government facing an ongoing problem with smuggling (and associated tax evasion, possession of illicit goods, possibly damages due to firefights) might decide to create such a ratings agency and give it a secret mandate to prevent Millenium Falcon-style "special modifications". Overzealous bureaucrats might interpret that to prohibit the PC's typical Beowulf from operating an M4 drive; corrupt bureaucrats (in a different direction) might come sniffing for opportunities to accept a bribe.
Timerover51
SOC-14 5K
That only works if you have control of all of the possible ship production yards. In the Official Traveller Universe (the OTU) you have a large number of independent worlds. Some like the Sworld Worlds are militantly so. They may build to Imperial standards in terms of ship construction materials and requirements, but add all sorts of additional touches to a ship.
Duke Craig
SOC-12
Even the Imperials may add ****Classified**** Experimental features (A La FF&S) to their ships, as demonstrated in the Kinunir with the Black Globe. Which they might prefer that others were unaware. I guess that is why they have their own carefully guarded System-wide Depots.
But those will be fringe ships compared to the mainstream. There's a much large number of official ship builders providing approved ships.
Plus if the official inspections and what not are going to take in to account looking for such modifications, then the ships are even more marginalized out of the mainstream.
BackworldTraveller
SOC-13
This is getting into the place where Traveller and reality come apart.
Ships would be registered at a port and if you turn up and aren't on the list of registered ships, you would be subject to stringent checks because you're probably nicked.
Ships would be inspected during annual maintenance (part of the fee) and if you aren't inspected you won't get insurance...wait you never have insurance anyway!
If you don't have insurance, you aren't going to get passengers (except the dodgy or dangerous) because the tickets can always be used on insured ships. Ditto cargo. Ditto crew.
And Lloyds Register isn't the insurer - it just has a similar name. Lloyds Register was set to define the basis on which insurance rate that should be charged. A 100A1 ship would be cheaper to insure than an 80 - less likely to just sink without cause.
Ships would be registered at a port and if you turn up and aren't on the list of registered ships, you would be subject to stringent checks because you're probably nicked.
Ships would be inspected during annual maintenance (part of the fee) and if you aren't inspected you won't get insurance...wait you never have insurance anyway!
If you don't have insurance, you aren't going to get passengers (except the dodgy or dangerous) because the tickets can always be used on insured ships. Ditto cargo. Ditto crew.
And Lloyds Register isn't the insurer - it just has a similar name. Lloyds Register was set to define the basis on which insurance rate that should be charged. A 100A1 ship would be cheaper to insure than an 80 - less likely to just sink without cause.
BackworldTraveller
SOC-13
What does the ISA actually do...Collect landing fees? Yes. Anything else...? It doesn't try to spot frauds, barratry or piracy - That's bounty hunters or the IN. It doesn't stop smuggling - Local issue, unless you nuke the port when that's the IN again. It doesn't provide rescue services - Local Navy/COACC. It doesn't seem to circulate port transit details between worlds. It doesn't say "Err...your ship can't fly" even if you've not got a qualified engineer - unless you haven't paid the landing fees. It doesn't provide space-traffic control except within a few km of the station itself. If the ISA did any of these things, boy are most players in trouble! But it's much more fun if they don't.
"So Captain, Your ship is not registered here, and we are going to impound you until we have proof of the change of registry...and you are uninsured...and the registry doesn't match the chassis number and none of your crew have the required paperwork and the reversing light is broken and the washer bottle is empty and...."
You're asserting a lack of overlap. The rules on skipping do tend to imply that the starports AND the skip tracers both keep an eye out... but do keep in mind also that...
- Jump Travel is still dangerous
- Insurers won't touch dangerous of the level of uncertainty that is implied in CT rules.
- the Imperium pretty much has to be subsidzing ship loans; they're too risky.
- The canonical starports are extra-territorial to the world; the SPA is the imperial agency which oversees operations. Which could include the payment-handling at class A/B/C ports for monthly payment
- Canonically, the transponder tells the bank and/or SPA when your last payment was entered.
AnotherDilbert
SOC-14 1K
Is it? That is not the impression I get.
As far as I can see the economic model implies that jump is very safe. Ships are routinely expected to survive 40 years / 1000 jumps with proper (cheap) maintenance.
This means that a jump done by the book have to be at least 99.99% safe, i.e. taking max a 0.01% risk, including all standard risks such as misjump, piracy, hi-jacking, etc.
I would call that fairly safe.
I of course assume that the ship does not take silly risks, such as jumping on unrefined fuel or within the 100D limit. If it does, it will misjump every year or two and no bank or insurer will touch the ship with a 10 parsec pole.
BackworldTraveller
SOC-13
A few seeds from my father's career might be useful...
1) "This Hovercraft (SRN4) is too flimsy in the bows and will not withstand the buffeting expected in the channel"..."We don't like your conclusion so we have found our own advisors who agree that everything is ok"..."We have had to suspend all cross-channel flights temporarily while the bows are reinforced"
2) "There is not enough compartmentalisation in your RORO ferries to prevent sinking in cases of trouble so additional safety measures will be required to ensure that the cases of trouble don't occur"..."That will be too expensive, we'll go as they are"..."Oops".
3) "The rudder's broken, we will need a tow and will be late so we'll lose money and if we lose money we'll fire you"..."What a nice crate of whiskey"..."Do you need a tow?"..."Can't take one without the owner's approval"..."Hi, owner's tug, I'm sorry but it's now too rough to pass a tow"..."Ah - Rocks!!!".
4) "So that bit lets water out and not in"..."Yes"..."So my boat sank because I put it in backwards?"
1) "This Hovercraft (SRN4) is too flimsy in the bows and will not withstand the buffeting expected in the channel"..."We don't like your conclusion so we have found our own advisors who agree that everything is ok"..."We have had to suspend all cross-channel flights temporarily while the bows are reinforced"
2) "There is not enough compartmentalisation in your RORO ferries to prevent sinking in cases of trouble so additional safety measures will be required to ensure that the cases of trouble don't occur"..."That will be too expensive, we'll go as they are"..."Oops".
3) "The rudder's broken, we will need a tow and will be late so we'll lose money and if we lose money we'll fire you"..."What a nice crate of whiskey"..."Do you need a tow?"..."Can't take one without the owner's approval"..."Hi, owner's tug, I'm sorry but it's now too rough to pass a tow"..."Ah - Rocks!!!".
4) "So that bit lets water out and not in"..."Yes"..."So my boat sank because I put it in backwards?"
Most ACS ships will hit D ports, and thus be forced to use unrefined fuel, about once a year or twice a year. Most won't make all 40 years without a misjump. And that's about 50% likely to be fatal.
Also note: MT and TNE both increased the number of misjumps but reduced the severity.
MT misjumps usually cost you a week - half a jump cycle - from earning. Given the trade model (Bk7 derivative), and the cargo accidents, few ships make all forty years even with skilled crewing... andf the average crewman is axiomatically skill 1 in field... but they also do not require carelessness.
In TNE, the wear value system causes misjumps of much lower severity but annoying frequency... about 2 a year, but only one in 10 is a "end the ship's career. 10 kAU is still a lethal misjump if the ship has no additional jump 1 worth of fuel and 4 weeks of food. (Assuming strict rationing, even the 12 weeks is not enough.)
Also, the low maneuver fuel of merchants in TNE means that a failed roll for planetary intercept is either expensive rescue or is a total loss, depending upon local world.
And that's before accounting for the changes in setting...
For reasons of the task system, I never really got deep into the economic elements of T4... and I don't recall it's misjump rules.
