Speculative Trade without a Starship

[nathanbibb]

I've been thinking about how to play Traveller strictly by the rules as a thought experiment (I'm using CT, but I think this is applicable to all versions). Assuming you do not have a patron just provide characters with a Free Trader, and you want to play a trading a game, would you let your players engage in speculative trade without a starship?

I am thinking if you can find a trade good with high value per ton, you could pay the 1000Cr per ton to have it shipped as standard cargo, then get low or middle passage for your characters, and (with a high Admin and/or Bribery skill) characters could potentially make some trades without a ship, maybe earning the 7+MCr to put a down payment on a ship of their own.

Kind of a stretch, but if a player wanted to try it, I wouldn't stop them. Thoughts?

 

[by_the_sword]

There was an article about this very subject in JTAS issue No. 5.

If it can happen in the real world, then it must surely be possible in Traveller.

 

[atpollard]

Thoughts?

It is perfectly reasonable.
I have done it myself in a PbP game.

In practice, there are several common issues that arise:

• Is it YOUR idea of fun?
  This is a serious and valid and personal question.
  Some people love the 'Merchant' game.
  Other people describe it as 'accountants in space'.
  So figure out what your whole group of people think.
• The First Purchase.
  If you are going to play by the rules as written, then there are limits on how much cash the character has to start with. There are limits on what speculative cargo is available (details by version, but 1 cargo per week in CT).
  It will cost money to live and cash to ship ... which makes waiting for a cargo expensive.
  I found that locating that first cargo that I could afford and could earn me a profit was often one of the hardest parts.
  [Of course that is also an opportunity for something ELSE to happen ... like an adventure ... while you wait for your chance to get rich.]
• The Speculative Trade table in CT, with the right rolls, can be a money machine.
  Be prepared to deal with it if a character can earn enough money to buy a Free Trader out of petty cash.

... so those are my experiences and thoughts.
Have fun.

 

[BillDowns]

I endorse Pollard's comments.

In addition, if you want more variety than a trader w/o a ship, you said you had CT. Is that the CD or books? Either way, 76 Patrons has a bunch of short-term adventures that can earn your players more cash with potentially exciting adventures. It can also give you examples of sandbox style adventuring...

 

[Selandia]

The "Merchant Prince Campaign"

your character find systems with trade imbalance that allows them to buy cheap sell high. They move to it, purchase, ship out at 1000 cr/ton and get the money printing machine going using trader and brooker skills. They make enough money to buy a run down trader and get the ship skill used, then two... then set up triangular runs, feeder line etc.... Might out of ship owning althogether by the way. Time chartering would be adequate. That gave bad reputation to merchant games as roll playing accounting in space.

A good merchant prince campaign involve role playing that include dealing with annoying issue like picky official, trade unions, shipping cartel, not so honest bankers, or even the downright criminal yakusa that want to involve you (more or less willingly) in their business, pirate, corsair in the employ of competitor, corrupt officials, dodging murder attempts.... dispossession scam by tyrannical planetary authorities, very high risk / reward blockade running oportunities...

have fun

Selandia

Selandia

 

[nathanbibb]

I endorse Pollard's comments.

In addition, if you want more variety than a trader w/o a ship, you said you had CT. Is that the CD or books? Either way, 76 Patrons has a bunch of short-term adventures that can earn your players more cash with potentially exciting adventures. It can also give you examples of sandbox style adventuring...

I have the CD, but I haven't checked out 76 Patrons yet. I will definitely do that - thanks for the tip!

 

[nathanbibb]

The "Merchant Prince Campaign"

your character find systems with trade imbalance that allows them to buy cheap sell high. They move to it, purchase, ship out at 1000 cr/ton and get the money printing machine going using trader and brooker skills. They make enough money to buy a run down trader and get the ship skill used, then two... then set up triangular runs, feeder line etc.... Might out of ship owning althogether by the way. Time chartering would be adequate. That gave bad reputation to merchant games as roll playing accounting in space.

A good merchant prince campaign involve role playing that include dealing with annoying issue like picky official, trade unions, shipping cartel, not so honest bankers, or even the downright criminal yakusa that want to involve you (more or less willingly) in their business, pirate, corsair in the employ of competitor, corrupt officials, dodging murder attempts.... dispossession scam by tyrannical planetary authorities, very high risk / reward blockade running oportunities...

Lots of great ideas there - that has really got me thinking. Thanks!

 

[rancke]

One problem with playing such a game strictly by the rules is that there is no rule for determining the number, destination, and cargo capacity of ships that visit the world you're on. If you're on a low-population world you might not be able to ship out your speculative goods for months.

One way to circumvent that problem is to set up on a rich world and buy things like liquor, wood, spices, pharmaceuticals, and gems when you roll low, wait a week, and then sell them again when the price will probably triple or more. Gems are especially good. They have a purchase DM of 0 and a resale DM of +8, giving you a minimum resale value of 130% and a very good chance of 400%. And more than half the time the purchase price is between 40 and 100%.

Indeed, by the RAW you should be able to buy according to the purchase roll and sell them the same week according to the resale roll, obviating the need to pay warehousing.

Well, maybe not.

(Incidentally, to get gems with a base value of Cr1,000,000 per dT, you need to go for quartz chips and such-like. Anything more valuable than that would be worth a lot more than MCr1 per dT.)


Hans

 

[nathanbibb]

(Incidentally, to get gems with a base value of Cr1,000,000 per dT, you need to go for quartz chips and such-like. Anything more valuable than that would be worth a lot more than MCr1 per dT.)

I am thinking for gems there could be two explanations:

(1) Gems are not worth as much in space, where there are multiple worlds to obtain them, artificial gems may be indistinguishable from natural, etc.
(2) Valuable gems may not be dumped into a giant bin, but each one packaged in individual cases that could take up 100 times the space of the actual gem or more.

Just a thought.

 

[nathanbibb]

One problem with playing such a game strictly by the rules is that there is no rule for determining the number, destination, and cargo capacity of ships that visit the world you're on. If you're on a low-population world you might not be able to ship out your speculative goods for months.

This is true, and gets back to an earlier question I asked in terms of securing passage. Same problem IMO. I would think a solution for the passenger problem would be the solution for the cargo problem. Perhaps based on population, starport, etc.

 

[BillDowns]

Oh, yeah, Hitchin' a Ride.

IIRC, I used LBB2 p37 - the starship encounter table. Well, technically I think it's 35, but I was going by the Adobe page.

You could use that as a base, then mod it by adding modifiers for Pop and TL.

Of course, after using that phrase, I had to go listen to the song:rofl:

 

[rancke]

Oh, yeah, Hitchin' a Ride.

IIRC, I used LBB2 p37 - the starship encounter table. Well, technically I think it's 35, but I was going by the Adobe page.

"Roll for starship encounters when entering or leaving a system."

Someone staying on a world is not doing either. :devil:

Seriously, though, how often would you roll? Would that depend on the population size?


Hans

 

[BillDowns]

Crap, Hans, I've slept since then!

I think we started with that table, once a week. Then we began playing with it, and adding modifiers for Pop and TL. But I have lost all that in a move a long time ago. Sometime around 1983...

 

[BlackBat242]

I would combine that with reversing the "roll for passengers/cargo" for ship crew (after all, all you are doing is trading places between the seeker and the sought).

 

[BillDowns]

BlackBat, that seems harder to me, and well, I'm basically lazy...

The Encounter table works provided one is at a Class A, B, or C port. You add POP modifiers: If Pop 3 or less, -2; Pop 4 or 5, -1.

And ignore smallcraft encounters.

Really, one would be looking for a Type A, M or R. Now that only indicates a ship in port. You will have to role-play getting the captain to go where you want plus accepting your cargo and passenger travel. You might be able to persuade him/her to let you double up on staterooms for $6k each since your are also shipping freight. Maybe the players win a ride from Texas Hold-Em or something....

 

[Timerover51]

I ran something very much like this for a couple of friends. It worked best in the Spinward Main in the Spinward Marches, with a fairly steady supply of ships at every planet, with the aim being to acquire a cargo marketable at a planet a Jump away. They did pretty well, but I did require them to travel on the ship carrying their cargo, which did soak up some of the profits, and keep them from getting too wealthy.

 

[rancke]

I am thinking for gems there could be two explanations:

(1) Gems are not worth as much in space, where there are multiple worlds to obtain them, artificial gems may be indistinguishable from natural, etc.

Every other commodity in Charted Space seem to cleave fairly closely to 20th Century Earth prices, but not gems? I suppose that would work, but I don't want to lose the possibility of fabulously rich jewellry festooned with precious stones. Or individual precious stones of high value either. These are plot elements I'd like to keep handy.

(2) Valuable gems may not be dumped into a giant bin, but each one packaged in individual cases that could take up 100 times the space of the actual gem or more.

You're right about valuable gems not being dumped into giant bins, because valuable gems are not usually carried in lots of 14,000 liters. Or 140 liters for that matter. Also, I believe that on present-day Earth precious stones are usually carried wrapped in small velvet bags that add, perhaps, enough to triple the size of the package.

Hmm... a container that was effectively a safe might add considerable bulk. But I don't believe a factor 100 even then.

There are other commodities that IMO would not usually be shipped in dT lots. Spices, for example. What the trade system could use is a subtable of stuff that for practical purposes take up no cargo space at all. Bag of gems in the captain's safe, crate of spice kept in a corner of the ship's locker, that sort of things.


Hans

 

[BillDowns]

Hmm... a container that was effectively a safe might add considerable bulk. But I don't believe a factor 100 even then.

There are other commodities that IMO would not usually be shipped in dT lots. Spices, for example. What the trade system could use is a subtable of stuff that for practical purposes take up no cargo space at all. Bag of gems in the captain's safe, crate of spice kept in a corner of the ship's locker, that sort of things.

Hans

Sounds like a hook for PCs without a ship - investigate a "travelling safe" that showed up empty even though loading the safe was on security video and no obvious holes in it.

A sort of British-style cozy

 

[BillDowns]

Just found another Encounter table, in Supplement 7 Traders & Gunboats. On Adobe p46, booklet p44.