Starports!

[Colin]

Stop the attacks.

You know, I would hate to shut this thread down, so stop with the attacks. That means everyone, including S4 and Mongoose Fordy.

This conversation is about a fan-produced Starport book of fairly high quality. Let's keep the discussion on target, and not use this thread as yet another excuse to attack Mongoose.

In fact, Supplement 4, just ignore Mongoose for the time being. Your contributions to other aspects of Traveller, notably CT, are quite good, if a little, uh, intense. On the subject of Mongoose Traveller, however, your contributions are considerably less useful. I would suggest, strongly, that you stop the latter, lest you find yourself unable to do the former.

 

[Mickazoid]

Suggestions for updates?

Hi folks!

See? Starports are sooooo controversial in the world of Traveller! (sigh) Nevertheless, I heard a few useful observations amidst the baggage.

Background

First, just for the record - I'm a Photoshop/Indesign/Illustrator artist with 20 years' experience in typography - so producing this book was not a particularly time-consuming or difficult effort. At its core it was (and is) an exercise in seeing how close I could get to evoking the Classic Traveller spirit that got me hooked when my cousins sat down to teach me the game in the 70's. A Starports! book was an obvious choice for a project and I started gathering up rules for an area of CT that I felt was inadequately addressed. It took me about a day's work to do the visual formatting and stretches of time here and there as I found and analyzed the content for 'compatibility' (not being much of a rules monger, I went on 'feel'). I did this book back in 2005, if I'm not mistaken, about 6 months before I started the Sector Maker pdf project, and revisited it in 2007 for some reason.

Originators and Creators

Second, please remember Rob and the others cited in the book's introduction are the authors of this content. I compiled, cited and formatted it for my own use, and it would be wonderful if the authors of the content itself could contribute or update the content (as I'm hopeful they will), but please remember this is a fan-created rules compilation and not an original text of mine.

Encounters

Also, I read here that a Starports! book would probably be more useful to people with richer encounter tables, and I wholeheartedly agree. Right now, it's got the following:

Freight Type Encountered by Starport Type (p.19)
Local and Berthed-Ship Encounter Tables (p. 21)
Starport Encounter Table (p. 22)
Starport Events Table (p. 22)

If anyone would like to point me to some useful fan content with rich and evocative encounter types that will add a bit of 'meat' and 'depth' to the scenarios (or indeed, any other useful rules or content that will round out this book), feel free to pass 'em on!

Artwork

Also as with with my Spinward Marches book I'd like to put a nice image on the cover, something with the black of space and a starport, perhaps a background world or worlds. If anyone has any suggestions for possible artwork, cover or otherwise, let me know!

Other ideas

My sector generator software was created as a result of my desire to stop doing too much formatting on sector book 'one-offs', so is there any other tie-in that might be useful (a starport creation spreadsheet, etc.)?

 

[Supplement Four]

Second, please remember Rob and the others cited in the book's introduction are the authors of this content.

You have me cited as one of the contributors...I just wish I could remember what I contributed. o:

I always do that. I've got stuff all over this forum, game rules and what-not, that I've completely forgotten about.

 

[robject]

You have me cited as one of the contributors...I just wish I could remember what I contributed. o:

I always do that. I've got stuff all over this forum, game rules and what-not, that I've completely forgotten about.

Most of those names were originally cited by me: you-all contributed many, many suggestions that I put into my text, which Mickazoid was then able to use.

 

[robject]

Control Towers

T7 Compact, 3-5 person, 5 sensors max, 10 tons, MCr1.
T7 Standard, 4-10 person, 10 sensors max, 20 tons, MCr1.
T8 Standard, 6-15 person, 15 sensors max, 30 tons, MCr2.
T9 Standard, 10-20 person, 20 sensors max, 40 tons, MCr3.
TA Standard, 14-25 person, 25 sensors max, 50 tons, MCr4.

Larger control structures are built by linking together multiple modules.

Sensors

Starport sensors include EMS, Grav, Radar, Mass, Neutrino, Proximeter, Viewer. Each sensor costs MCr1. TL varies.

Surface-mounted only require surface space, plus the cost of the sensor.
Antenna mounts require 1 ton, plus MCr0.5.
Extensible antenna mounts require 2 tons, plus MCr1.0.
An orbital sensor platform (1 sensor) requires 3 tons plus MCr3.2.
A large orbital sensor platform (1 sensor) requires 5 tons plus MCr6.0.

Orbital platforms are capable of landing and redeployment.

Beacons

A standard surface programmable beacon is TL9 and costs MCr0.1. Or, it may be mounted as a typical sensor above (i.e. antenna, extensible, orbital).

Parking Orbit Transponders

A 3 ton orbital transponder. TL8, MCr 4. Duration 1 year. Capable of landing and re-deployment.


Shuttles

Max 4 passengers per payload ton.
Orbit/surface operations only, unless otherwise specified.

VIP Shuttle, TL12, 23t, 6G, 12t payload, MCr3.7.
Light Passenger Shuttle, TL11, 45t, 5G, 29t payload, MCr5.5.
Interplanetary Cargo Shuttle, TL11, 96t, 3G, 72t payload, MCr22. Can serve worlds in the inner solar system.
Heavy Cargo/Utility Shuttle, TL11, 200t, 1G, 144t payload, MCr22. Armored.

 

[Supplement Four]

I suggest looking at the material in the Judges Guild 50 Starports book. There's some fantastic stuff there (in spite of JG's reputation).

In fact, it's some of the best starport stuff I've seen published for CT.

 

[DonM]

I suggest looking at the material in the Judges Guild 50 Starports book. There's some fantastic stuff there (in spite of JG's reputation).

In fact, it's some of the best starport stuff I've seen published for CT.

John M. Ford's Starports (the GURPS Traveller supplement) is quite good as well. He wrote at least one JTAS article on the topic (dealing with the Port Authority), and the supplement follows on that.

 

[Keklas Rekobah]

What could be better? Not much...

I like the 'Starports!' fan supplement.

More artwork -- especially of the 'filler' type -- would enhance the experience.

Collating and correlating all of the information into one cohesive work (really intense editing and re-writing), that progresses from basic principles into a final chapter that gives examples of each of the starport classes would be even better. I'm in the process of doing exactly this for MTU.

Otherwise ... I like it ... a lot!

 

[shadowcat20]

Did a quick look over and made sure it is in my library now. Very well done. I did notice the parkbays and picts were taken from White Darf #43 though. The Happy Landings article. Dragon #59 also had a good article called Exonidas Spaceport with both a high and low port and ships. It also had a good adventure about a world pulling the nuke trigger and the rescue fleet needed to help pull things back together. And yes, I still have copies of both those mags in my library...

 

[Keklas Rekobah]

Starports ... all I ever did was combine a flight map of a local airport with a basic floorplan of a local shopping mall. Then made some mods for VTOL craft, TAS facilities, and a 'Strip' (a.k.a., 'Startown') outside the main gates. No one ever did manage to explore ever nook and cranny ... and all those maintenance corridors and tunnels ... and the penthouse apartments of the portmaster ... who also had his grubby fingers in local vice ...

 

[Tellon]

my .02cr -- It's fantastic stuff -- even though I use MT/TNE stuff -- this supplement (for CT) is still very usable

Awesome work guys ..

 

[curmudgeon]

I just stumbled across this thread and the fan book in question. I looked through it quickly and think it deserves a more detailed read. As an editor and proofreader I found a few aspects of it a bit annoying, but over all it has a good look similar to the Classic Traveller books. I would make a few formatting and layout changes, but that's just me.

 

[FreeTrav]

Curmudgeon, would you be willing to write a full-up review and send it off to Freelance Traveller? I think it would be a good thing to have reviews of fan-written material, even if it's NOT commercial release.

 

[curmudgeon]

Curmudgeon, would you be willing to write a full-up review and send it off to Freelance Traveller? I think it would be a good thing to have reviews of fan-written material, even if it's NOT commercial release.

I will see what I can do. I will print it up and read through it. I can't promise anything, because I have a manuscript due to my publisher in a couple of months and there's a lot of writing left to be done.

 

[boomslang]

http://www.columbia.edu/~mbk2109/traveller/Starports!.pdf

Looks good overall; a very valuable resource.

I have one editing note, though: starting on page 15, the discussion of life support costs is not consistent with what is in LBB CT. Specifically, LBB2 informs us that the Cr2000 cost per stateroom occupant is calculated for a fortnight, not a single week. Given the later tendency by players (w/MWM's encouragement) to embrace a 168 hours ± 10% Jump duration, the average Passage takes the better part of ten days from liftoff to planetfall, which is clearly more than one week. Slapping a Cr2000 per Passenger cost to the ship -- rather than a Cr1000 one -- on top of a single Jump's High & Middle Passage income (already fixed-rate in canon, of course) bites even deeper into the revenue model and makes all-freight operations more economically attractive to the average ship owner. Crew costs likewise begin to skyrocket if they breathe twice as much air as they technically need to every week.

Thus, I would think you could cut your base, non-variable numbers in half for the subsequent cost calculations of life support. This cost issue is crucial to the budgets of profit-chasing Traders, and therefore has a direct impact on the general availability of interstellar Passage TU-wide.

Likewise regarding edits, the original CT LBB2 rules are ambiguous about Low Berth costs, mentioning that they consume Cr100 "per use". Given the assorted canonical examples of people getting all Van Winkled in the things, the tradition seems to be that the ongoing operation of a Low Berth has nearly zero overhead. As a consequence, I have always figured that a Low Berth costs Cr100 "per usage cycle, regardless of duration", rather than "per fortnight of use". Given that most Low Passengers are only making single-fortnight hops, it is not such a major issue for Traders as the stateroom cost one is, but it does begin to affect Frozen Watch operations, I would think.

Additionally, given the risks of Low Berth travel, there is reason for Low Passengers to stay frozen for more than one Jump in a row if they need to travel farther; the need to thaw out repeatedly needlessly ups the risk for the multi-Passage Low Passenger. It is probably better off to freeze one time for one cost, and just stay in uninterrupted cold storage as long as possible (or as long as one can afford to buy Passage ahead of time for); this increases the Trader's profit margin a wee bit as well, thus encouraging the practice (or at least making it more tempting for the cash-strapped Traveller).

Anyway, just my Cr.02 on the matter; the book is very groovy in general...

 

[Mickazoid]

Folks:

If you keep adding errata and other tweaks to the thread as boomslang, Reklas and others have done, I'll be sure to get the edits made pronto, so any review can focus on the good parts

Thanks all, for the great outpouring of feedback to what was a fairly small outpouring of effort on my part.

 

[rancke]

Specifically, LBB2 informs us that the Cr2000 cost per stateroom occupant is calculated for a fortnight, not a single week. Given the later tendency by players (w/MWM's encouragement) to embrace a 168 hours ± 10% Jump duration, the average Passage takes the better part of ten days from liftoff to planetfall, which is clearly more than one week. Slapping a Cr2000 per Passenger cost to the ship -- rather than a Cr1000 one -- on top of a single Jump's High & Middle Passage income (already fixed-rate in canon, of course) bites even deeper into the revenue model and makes all-freight operations more economically attractive to the average ship owner. Crew costs likewise begin to skyrocket if they breathe twice as much air as they technically need to every week.

OTOH, if you cut life support costs by 1/3rd (to 1300 or 1400 per fortnight) any time a vessel doesn't actually spend more than 9 out of those 14 days 'bottled up', you save a significant amount of money.


Hans

 

[boomslang]

OTOH, if you cut life support costs by 1/3rd (to 1300 or 1400 per fortnight) any time a vessel doesn't actually spend more than 9 out of those 14 days 'bottled up', you save a significant amount of money.

Good point; I suppose the truly detail-oriented could even break life supp cost down on a 'per person-day of occupancy' basis and squeeze every last Cr out of the margin, if players/ref were mutually so inclined. Precedent exists in the per day portage surcharges for vessels that stay berthed more than 1 week, for example.

Too much labor for me, but not an unreasonable job for a spreadsheet to track... this would then presuppose that starports could resupply/recharge life supp incrementally, which is likewise not a particularly unreasonable assumption.

 

[rancke]

Good point; I suppose the truly detail-oriented could even break life supp cost down on a 'per person-day of occupancy' basis and squeeze every last Cr out of the margin, if players/ref were mutually so inclined. Precedent exists in the per day portage surcharges for vessels that stay berthed more than 1 week, for example.

Yes, but as you suggest it becomes a question of how much it matters for gaming purposes. If it's a difference between keeping or losing the ship, most players will care, so thousands of credits are, IMO, interesting, while hundreds might or might not be and tens usually wouldn't be.

In my own games I use ten-day 'units' of life support and don't sweat the difference between spending 8 or 10 or 12 days between opening up the ship, or the difference between an 60 kg passenger and a 120 kg passenger, though luxury meals are extra .


Hans

 

[Commander Truestar]

The missing charts

I believe the missing tables can be found in the pages linked to the following web site:

http://eaglestone.pocketempires.com/starports/StarportModuleCatalog.html

Marc