T20 design question: Small vehicle-like objects

[archhealer]

Ok, I know I obviously have WAY too much timem on my hands at work, but last night at 3am, between my patrols, I was trying to use the T20 design sequence to create the following items: Rollerskates, rollerblades, skateboards, scooters (The Razr type, not motorized), hang gliders, etc.

Anybody else ever bothered with this? I stopped after realizing that you actually can't make a pair of rollerskates capable of actual rollerskate speeds, smaller than about 12vls. Which is WAY too big, unless my ideas about size are way off. I know that rollerskates, on a skilled user (Like myself and the rest of my rollerderby league), can achieve speeds in excess of 50kph in short bursts, and rollerblades are capable of even higher speeds. I hammered my head against the numbers for about 45 minutes before giving up, the drive train (With 8 wheels for standard skates) is just too damned big once you make it capable of those speeds. Also remember, with somebody wearing them, if they're 8 vls (To pull a random number out of the air), they have to be able to mvoe 108 vls with somebody wearing them.

Anybody else feel like wasting some time on these? Practical use: Pretty much nil, but still, I find it amusing...

 

[tjoneslo]

Through the Waves (TA8) has a muscle engine in it to generate the strength of (EP output) of a human being.

I'm going to assume a 2vl "vehicle", which we want to move at 50 kph, therefore requires 0.1 TH. The control system is 0.2 vl, and costs Cr1. A 0.01 EP muscle engine requires 0.1 vl and costs Cr 0.1. A wheeled drive train which produces 0.1 TH is 0.01DTUs, therefore requres 0.11 vl, requires 0.01 EP and costs Cr0.25. Except you want 8 wheels, so +6 wheels is 3vls times 0.01 DTU or +0.03 vls, for a total of 0.14 vls and Cr1.

Totals is 0.44 vls, Cr 2.1. Fancy laces and glitter extra.

Did I do that wrong?

 

[archhealer]

Except, isn't that just moving the skates themselves, and not the wearer? Or does a person pushing/pulling a vehicle not count toward the size of the vehicle?

If this is right, it's pretty much perfect.

 

[tjoneslo]

I realised that when I got up this morning. We now have to play with payload (i.e. the person is a 100vl payload on the 2vl skates).

I redid the calcuations probably the same way you did, and came up with the 12-14 vl skates.

There is another mistake in the above calculations: an average person (ST12) outputs about 0.1 EP. So a muscle engine capable of handing that is 1vl and Cr1. The eight wheeled drivetrain for 0.1 EP is 1.4 vl and cr10, and outputs 1 TH. So we have to increase the size of the boots a little: 2.7 vl chassis, remote control system is 0.27vls and Cr1.35

Thus far the total is 2.7 vls (leaves 0.03 vl cargo space), and cr12.35.

Here's where we cheat a little. Using the towing rules from TA3, the skates output 1TH, or enough to propel them at 370 kph. But we also have to tow the 100vl person along as well. So the top speed is (1 th / 0.103 TH required) or 10.3 kph.

I might argue that since the vehicle's power source is the person running that the skates top speed should add to the persons running speed, not be instead of.

The fact that you (and other athelets) are capable of higher speeds than the average person indicated you are stronger than the average person. A ST16 or ST17 (in the legs only) will double your speed.

Does this work for you?

 

[archhealer]

Ah it does. Also remember that you can use the hustle/run rules to double or triple your EP output on muscle power plants. That would allow people to exert themselves to go a little faster, but the normal (Just skating along easily) speeds would be quite a bit lower.

 

[Savar]

yes, but it has been fun to follow.

 

[tjoneslo]

I'm not too hard to provoke into doing weird designs and abusing the system.

 

[archhealer]

And I work overnight security, so unless somebody tries to steal the building, I have 7 or 8 hours a night to kill... And I really like rollerskating. Next project: Skateboards & Longboards (I'll also post a few grav boards, hoverboards, and similiar things I've done).

 

[archhealer]

And I work overnight security, so unless somebody tries to steal the building, I have 7 or 8 hours a night to kill... And I really like rollerskating. Next project: Skateboards & Longboards (I'll also post a few grav boards, hoverboards, and similiar things I've done).

 

[shadowdragon]

imho unless the object actually produces thrust to propel the wearer along, it is not a vehicle per-se, more in the nature of a friction reducing platform to enhance the movement of an existing vehicle. that isnt covered in the vehicle design specs, maybe figure a modification of the rules for trailers?

 

[archhealer]

Rules for human-propelled vehicles are covered in the "Through the Waves" TAS supplement. Both for muscle powered drive trains (Such as pedals, paddles, oars, etc), and push/pull situations (Harnesses, wheelbarrows, and the like). it also provides sail power. I built a pedal-powered airplane, just for giggles.