Telescopic/Electronic sights in Striker and AHL

[aza]

Something I've been curious to know ever since I started reading these forums but have not got around to asking.

It seems many people who still play CT use the Striker and/or AHL rules for combat, as I did myself back in the day. Question for these people - how do you handle the Telescopic and Electronic sights descibed in Book 1 using those rules? It never came up in my games but reading through the rules now I wonder how I would have done it.

 

[aramis]

When I was using it, I just looked at the ranges on the Bk 1 tables, and when in those ranges, applied their +4.

 

[aza]

Thank you for the reply Aramis. Obviously not a lot of interest in this topic!

I did think about just applying the +4 as per book 1 rules myself but I felt it made the scoped rife a bit too overpowered in striker relative the the more high tech weapons. I was going to check again to see if that was the case but haven't had time to dig the rules out and have another look.

-Aza

 

[Vladika]

I use the +4 for any uninterrupted shot. If the shooter is distracted the bonus goes down. So far in an arbitrary way because I don't care to list and quantify every possibility.

Also, for a weapon without iron sights as a backup, you can certainly have negative "bonuses" if the enhanced sight is damaged, destroyed or inoperable.

Don't worry about interest, it's still early.

 

[McPerth]

Personally, I like the +4 (as in CT), but I would not allow it to more tan double the modifier without it (that mostly represents the skill). So, a soldier that usually has a +2 DM would only gain another +2 (to a total of +4) for using it, while another with a usual +5 modifier will get the full +4 (for a total of +9).

That's because I guess that I (never been trained in rifle use) would not get the same benefit for it as a trained sniper would.

And I also agree with Vladika's requirement of undistrubed aiming, and, of course, not usable in automatic fire...

 

[atpollard]

One option that I have seen and liked was to allow the +4 to be used only to offset negative modifiers, not bestow a positive modifier.

So a weapon with -5 at that range becomes -1 with the electronic sights (+4).
A weapon with -3 at that range becomes +/-0 with the electronic sights (+4, but no positive modifier allowed for range).

 

[Vladika]

One option that I have seen and liked was to allow the +4 to be used only to offset negative modifiers, not bestow a positive modifier.

So a weapon with -5 at that range becomes -1 with the electronic sights (+4).
A weapon with -3 at that range becomes +/-0 with the electronic sights (+4, but no positive modifier allowed for range).

Interesting concept, and I do see merits to it. But why wouldn't a scope allow a + modifier at long and very long ranges? In many cases you'd need it to even see the target.

(I'm actually leaning to switching over to your system.)

 

[Johnny_BoomBoom]

Hmm, interesting topic. I always felt that the +4 was maybe a bit of a heavy modifier for scope.

However, as a shooter, I got to try the difference at 'long' and 'very long' range!

Our club shoots at 200yds and 500 yds. Most of my shooting up until now has been at 200.

I use a Saiga M3 (think modern, civilianised AK) in .223 calibre with a x9 magnification scope. The other rifle I use is a Mauser K98 (WWII German standard issue rifle in 7.92mm or 8mm Mauser calibre).

At 200 yds, I get much better groups with the scoped Saiga than I do with the K98 on iron sights, but to be honest, I still get all shots out of a detail on the paper and regularly in 'the black' with the K98 (occasionally a bull, but that is more luck than ability!). This would imply hits on a torso sized target (assuming said torso wasn't moving!)

Last shoot, we then moved back to 500yds. With appropriate adjustment on the scope for bullet drop, I was still getting the black with the scoped Saiga, and generally reasonable groups. With the K98, I was getting about 30% of shots on target.

I am not military or ex military, simply a civilian shooter.

My conclusion from this is that the benefit a scope brings is quite large! However, the benefit is more noticeable at the longer range(in this case very long range)! I would therefore be inclined to give a bonus for using scopes as +2 at long range and +4 at very long range (which may well have the effect of offsetting the negative modifiers received by the wepaon at those ranges, but I would be inclined to allow it to be a postitive modifier overall, as it certainly aided me! I would imagine a trained marksman would reap even more reward, which is why I would still allow the DM to run positive).

Your mileage may vary, this is simply my two credits worth!