The Imperial 74

[AndreaV]

And the subclass

Ship: Saliimir Kupa
Class: Ullura
Type: Third Class Battleship
Architect: Andrew Vallance
Tech Level: 14

USP
         B3-P1358JZ-E96908-999H9-0 MCr 83,096.855 74 KTons
Bat Bear             X   4 11119   Crew: 650
Bat                  Y   6 1111C   TL: 14

Cargo: 12.500 Passengers: 10 Crew Sections: 74 of 9 Frozen Watch (x37) 
Fuel: 28,120 EP: 5,920 Agility: 5 Shipboard Security Detail: 74
Craft: 2 x 30T Ships Boats, 4 x 20T Launches
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification
Backups: 1 x Model/9fib Computer 1 x Bridge
Substitutions: X = 38 Y = 48 Z = 74

Architects Fee: MCr 830.969   Cost in Quantity: MCr 66,477.484

COMMENTS
The final twelve example of the Duguay-Trouin class took advantage of the 
improvements in Imperial technology to incorporate Model/9Fib computers and 
a factor 9 nuclear damper. Some consideration was given to upgrading the 
meson screen, but it was considered that the improved protection would not 
compensate for the loss of agility. The survivors currently form Batron 925 
attached to the 124th Fleet.

Ullura - Still in service
Saliimir Kupa - Tranfered to the Vegan Autonomous District as the Igas
Tajk - Tranfered to IISS
Zealandia - Still in service
Sujak - Still in service
Kaashiigab - Transferee to the Vegan Autonomous District as the Largas
Holstein - Still in service
Grosser Kurfurst - Transfered to the IISS
Archduke Martin of Sylea - Still in service
Ishulen - Still in service
Eneri Igundur - Still in service
Implacable - Still in service

 

[BlackBat242]

It is cool, thanks! However, at 74K tons, wouldn't it be a crusier?

Well with factor 14 armour its somewhat thicker skinned than most cruisers, fully capable of standing in the line (probably better than some battleships.) Its a third rate intended to provide capital ship presence in quite areas where you don't need a full sized battlewagon.

Thus neatly filling the role of the 1880-1910 Armoured Cruiser.

Intended for both traditional cruiser functions and as "backing" to stiffen the line-of-battle.

The type was expanded by the British in 1906 with the Invincible class of "armoured cruisers" (sometimes called "dreadnought cruisers")... which was formally re-designated "Battle Cruiser" on 24 November 1911.

 

[BillDowns]

Andrew,

If you are trying for a more Nelsonian feel, rather than an OTU feel, then I would suggest house rules:

• eliminate spinal mounts
• add 75-ton, 25-ton and 10-15 ton bays
• change the availability to 1 hardpoint required per 10 tons of bay
• allow bays to be grouped into batteries using the turrets table
• allow ships built to a long, narrow design to avoid the batteries bearing limitation by rotating on their axis
• finally, limit the maximum size of ships

 

[mike wightman]

I'd add one more rule:

bay weapons don't get the -6 DM on the damage table

 

[McPerth]

I'd add one more rule:

bay weapons don't get the -6 DM on the damage table

The +6 modifier is dependant on the rating of the battery (9- in HG, A+ in MT), not on the kind of mount.

While this has not practical effect on HG, as all weapons rated A+ are spinals, in MT there are bays so rated (at TL 16+, also available on MT, and only for Darrians in HG, and on consolidated errata for TL 14-15 missile bays and Fusion bays).

 

[mike wightman]

You misunderstand the intent of my post - it is a follow on from the post above mine by Bill Downs - rules to make it feel more Nelsonian.

If bays are your big hitters because you have removed spinals then the large bays should dispense with the damage penalty. Try it - it works quite well.

 

[McPerth]

You misunderstand the intent of my post - it is a follow on from the post above mine by Bill Downs - rules to make it feel more Nelsonian.

If bays are your big hitters because you have removed spinals then the large bays should dispense with the damage penalty. Try it - it works quite well.

Sorry, I'm afraid I skipped Bill Dawns' post...

 

[BillDowns]

Sorry, I'm afraid I skipped Bill Dawns' post...

I'm used to that

Actually, my intent was to leave that modifier there because of my 4th point:
[FONT=arial,helvetica]allow bays to be grouped into batteries using the turrets table

[/FONT]Using TL12 Particle 100-ton bays, the base factor is 8. Looking at the Particle Turrets, 1 weapon is Factor 2, 2 weapons is Factor 3, 4 weapons is Factor 4 and so on.

So if you have 4 of those bays, your battery Factor now becomes A, 6 bays yields Factor B, 10 bays would be Factor D. These would be your Nelsonian 64-pounders.

So, add in some 50-ton bays at TL12. 10 of them would be a Factor 9 battery. Here's your Nelsonian 32-pounder battery.

Interpolate a 75-ton bay, and thee would form your 48-pounder battery.

You would need to extend the turrets table beyond 10 weapons, but that won't be hard. You would need to go to 28 weapons, and consider each deck as a battery. IIRC, a 74 usually had a lower gun deck of 28 x 32 pounders (maybe up to 48 pounders), and an upper gun deck of 28 x 18 pounders (maybe up to 24 pounders), plus another 18 guns on the quarterdeck and focsle, usually of something less than 18 pounders.

 

[McPerth]

And the fusion 50 dton bays, with its short range (I asume the note energy weapons: not allowed at long range in page 45 apply also to bays) and high power (at TL 12 one bay is factor 7; only missiles are more powerful, but they need magazines and cost money to fire, if we apply what's being said here) will be your carronades, isn't it?

Shame there is no cannister ammo equivalent :rofl:

 

[BillDowns]

Fusion/Plasma guns as carronades works for me, too!

For cannister work, one could just use turrets, especially missile turrets for that purpose.

Of course, this is all just approximation, but I think it gets closer to "Age of Sail" feel than straight LBB2 or LBB5. But, I may be a bit warped

 

[AndreaV]

Andrew,

If you are trying for a more Nelsonian feel, rather than an OTU feel, then I would suggest house rules:

• eliminate spinal mounts
• add 75-ton, 25-ton and 10-15 ton bays
• change the availability to 1 hardpoint required per 10 tons of bay
• allow bays to be grouped into batteries using the turrets table
• allow ships built to a long, narrow design to avoid the batteries bearing limitation by rotating on their axis
• finally, limit the maximum size of ships

I think simply wiping out spinal mesons would do. That way you get long battles of attrition. Maybe adding rules for laying alongside and boarding ships that can still fire.

 

[BlackBat242]

Shame there is no cannister ammo equivalent :rofl:

For cannister work, one could just use turrets, especially missile turrets for that purpose.

Of course, this is all just approximation, but I think it gets closer to "Age of Sail" feel than straight LBB2 or LBB5. But, I may be a bit warped

For cannister and grape, see "Anti-missiles and Roundshot" by Jefferson P. Swycaffer, Dragon #95 (March 1985) page 76.

Antimissile clusters are "a cluster of dartlets fired from any missile launcher" that are resolved similarly to sand or beam anti-missile fire. This could also be used against other light-skinned close-range targets, and is analogous to canister.

Roundshot is a cluster of larger shot fired from a turret-mounted weapon "identical in characteristics to a sandcaster"*. This weapon is effective at all normal turret-mounted energy beam ranges, and is resolved as such (save that a targeted ship may evade the roundshot by moving to long range at the next range determination step). This is analogous to grapeshot.



* Which fires a canister filled with sand and an explosive dispersal charge to spread it after firing.

 

[McPerth]

For cannister work, one could just use turrets, especially missile turrets for that purpose.

For cannister and grape, see "Anti-missiles and Roundshot" by Jefferson P. Swycaffer, Dragon #95 (March 1985) page 76.

Antimissile clusters are "a cluster of dartlets fired from any missile launcher" that are resolved similarly to sand or beam anti-missile fire. This could also be used against other light-skinned close-range targets, and is analogous to canister.

Roundshot is a cluster of larger shot fired from a turret-mounted weapon "identical in characteristics to a sandcaster"*. This weapon is effective at all normal turret-mounted energy beam ranges, and is resolved as such (save that a targeted ship may evade the roundshot by moving to long range at the next range determination step). This is analogous to grapeshot.

* Which fires a canister filled with sand and an explosive dispersal charge to spread it after firing.

I was just kidding when talking about cannister (and you,Blackbat, read me well when talking about grapeshot, as that what I really meant but didn't find the word).

Seriously talking now, I don't believe there can be a space equivalent, as I see no way to damage the crew without damaging the ship in such armored hulls (except perhaps radiation, but the only way I see is by throwing dirty nukes. Again not an expert in the matter).

 

[BlackBat242]

But anti-missile clusters ("canister" ) would be very useful against pirates attempting a boarding using launches, ships' boats, grav vehicles, etc.

They should also be able to disable unarmored merchant ships by holing the hull (and thus decompressing the ship).

Then there is using them against an orbital station (to leave the station basically intact for later looting/re-use).

They could also be used in "strafing" operations.

 

[McPerth]

But anti-missile clusters ("canister" ) would be very useful against pirates attempting a boarding using launches, ships' boats, grav vehicles, etc.

In MT, sandcasters are quite good as anti personnel short ranged weapons (as to avoid an EVA assault to your ships). They penetrate even battledress at very short ranges (up to 50 m).

 

[Dragoner]

One thought I have had about cannister rounds is that they would make for very good defense if one was being chased by another ship. Fired so the shot would spread it would force another ship to maneuver around a cloud of shot that would be deadly to pass through due to the rate of travel of the ships.

 

[McPerth]

One thought I have had about cannister rounds is that they would make for very good defense if one was being chased by another ship. Fired so the shot would spread it would force another ship to maneuver around a cloud of shot that would be deadly to pass through due to the rate of travel of the ships.

Also in MT, ships require a minimum armor (factor 40) to cope with cosmic radiation and micrometeor damage. I wonder if this cannister rounds would damage at all a ship so armored...

 

[Dragoner]

Make them larger than a micrometeor, however, it is outside of the rules for the most part, same as with space mines.