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The Shape of Space

parmasson

SOC-14 1K
I assume that T5 is the 2D" subway map" universe that we are accustomed to.

Is there any indication that there might be a 3D option as well? Not sure how it would be done in a way that does not blast the rules out of the water but there are minds out there that have spent a lot more time thinking about this than I have.
 
No option at all. And folks here and on the TML have played with the concept for awhile. I've even gone so far as to *try* to convolute our subway map so that it's 3D-yet-doesn't-break-the-map.
 
I’m not really a map partisan either. I toyed with the idea but the notion of hand drawing the maps on an iso grid and then also doing a subway map. My players don’t care and I don’t have the time so I dropped the project.
 
Ditto. 3D space sounds interesting, but it's awkward to use in print or in play, and I've never had a player who cared.
 
Guys: 3d space works just fine given three caveats:

1: you generate link-tables, rather than maps
2: you automate the process
3: you realize the imperium just got 11000+ SYSTEMS, not 11000 inhabited worlds...
4: you can preserve chunks with careful placements
5: you define your jump limits and stick to them rigorously...
6: you don't allow deep-space jumps, or do so only with specific data that is hard to generate, harder still to use, and makes the risks uneconomic but tactically advantageous.

Heck, such routing tables work quite easily:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> x01 x02 x03 x04 x05 x06 x07 x08
01x * . . .
01x * . . .
02x . . . .
02x * . . .
03x . * . .
03x . . . .
04x . . * .
04x . . . *
05x . . <*> .
05x . * . .
06x . . * *
06x . * . .
07x . * . .
07x . . . .
08x . . . .
08x . . . .
09x . . . .
09x . . . .
10x . . . .
10x . . . . </pre>[/QUOTE]Doc (0505)
J1: Jordan (0405), Cavenaugh(0504), Macey (0605)
J2: Bug (0604), Niles(0607)
J3: Marcus (0303), Wellbey (0703), Emdee (0408)
J4: Carter (0202)
J5: Benton (0102)
J6: Pratt (0101)

Jordan:
J1: Doc (0505)
J2: Marcus(0303) Cavenaugh (0504), Macey (0605)
J3: Carter (0202), Bug (0604), Niles (0607), Emdee (0408)
J4: Benton (0102), Wellbey (0703)
J5: Pratt (0101)

Yes, space intensive.
However, it should be doable with software readily. I'm not up to coding it, however, for 2d hexgrids.

For three-d, however, it's easy enough.

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">#/!bin/pythonesque
#This code may have serious errors in the for loop syntax
#Remember: Python is indenting sensitive...
data=[["Name",1,2,3],["name",4,5,6]]
#replace data with system list with name,x,y,z
workloop=data
checkloop=data
workloop.sort()
for datum in workloop:
x1=datum[1]
y1=datum[2]
z1=datum[3]
n1=datum[0]
print n1, " ",x,",",y,",",z
j1 = "J1: "
j2 = "J2: "
j3 = "J3: "
j4 = "J4: "
j5 = "J5: "
j6 = "J6: "
for datums in checkloop:
x2=datums[1]
y2=datums[2]
z2=datums[3]
n2=datums[0]
d = (((x1 - x2) ** 2)+((y1 - y2) ** 2)+((z1 - z2) ** 2)) ** 0.5
if d =0:
#
else if d < 1:
j1.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
else if d < 2:
j2.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
else if d < 3:
j3.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
else if d < 4:
j4.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
else if d < 5:
j5.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
else if d < 6:
j6.append(n2," (",x1,",",y1,",",z1,"),")
print j1
print j2
print j3
print j4
print j5
print j6
print "----"</pre>[/QUOTE]THe output window will output the relevant lists... in name order for sourceworlds, in x.y.z order for destinations.
 
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">WOOOOOooooooshh.</pre>[/QUOTE]Sound of computer code going over my head.

I am just starting to lean HTML. Yesterday, yes really.

So any mapping program will have to be point n click for me and many people to use. Anyway I don’t think it is on the table as a serious consideration. From what I have seen in the UWP fix-it-thread there are still a few worlds with a several hundred square mile downport next to the ocean, beautiful orbital facility all on a totally empty planet with no atmosphere.

I will just be happy if the UWPs make sense and was astounded to heart that every world in the imperium is accounted for. That is lots of data. The new AOTI or what ever comes out would look like several encyclopedia volumes.
 
Back in the late 80s to early 90s there was a computer game that used a slowly spinning 3d star map. What was the name! You could be one of four or five different aliens and it had to run a on a 386 and I only had a 286. Anyway it was just a green screen and the ability to print two different angles is all it would need.
 
If you want 3d space, astrosynthesis 2 has just been released. I was one of the beta testers and I have been able to add most of the datafields for traveller to the program.

I recommend it highly. All I can say is that once my current project is complete, I will go back and finish the finding of the spinward marches in real space......

best regards

Dalton
 
^ Wow . . . when I get home I am going to try the demo. It allows you to input UWPs? Any weak spots I need to be aware of?
Thanks for the input, the scree shots look great. I only have two subsectors of data and someting tells me I am goin to be able to add a few more star systems in a 3D universe.

What is a Pent. IV? I think my chip is a1.xx GHz processor w/256RAM.
 
You can define any fields you wish.
You can manipulate the fields, either manually changing the data, or, using the vbscript/macro language you can dirive the data from the programs own generation routines, or, randomly generate the data yourself.
You can import and export the data via XML.
You can autogenerate surface maps using profantasy's fractal mapper and export the resultant map out to CC2 in traveller world format.

Pentium 4 chipset. I would recomend 512MB ram (well, I am using 2GB, but, I was using real astronomical data, that includes all known systems within 10,000 ly)

best regards

Dalton
 
Dont' need that much data crunching. I am looking at about 50-60 star systems perhaps 70 as time goes on but my homebrew region they play in is not that big. I like to keep things local for plot reasons.
 
The demo runs just fine. Lots of room for customization and apparently you can export a view as an image so I can give copies to the players.

Sweet, parsecs, subsectors, and route lines all in one package. I am going to have to add some systems or it’s going to look empty.


I have not had time to really read all the instructions. Does it generate subway maps automatically?
 
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