The Times, They Are A-Changin'

[Sifu Blackirish]

Sorry to interrupt, folks...

...but no one has mentioned what happened to Hunter.

Was there an amiable parting of the ways?
Hostile takeover?
Extortion?
Passing of the Pan-Sentient Olympic torch?

 

[Blue Ghost]

He's apparently stepped down for whatever reason.

 

[Colin]

As Far as Moderation Goes...

Most of the problems we have on CotI in terms of attracting new blood cannot be laid at the foot of the Mods. Some yes, in particular a failure to act promptly on hostile behaviour. If anything, our major flaw is allowing people to get away with too much, rather than over-moderating. There have been exceptions, perhaps, but those are rare, and often times something else is going on as well.

We have become too tolerant of some of the "old guard", who have much to contribute, but perhaps have poor social skills, at least in their online communications. I'm not going to name any names here. This will stop. At the same time, we have been occasionally too harsh with those who, for whatever reason, got under our skin. Again, no names here. If you see yourself in one of these groups, it might be a good time to stop and think about "why?" Some of these actions have prevented newcomers from getting comfortable to contribute in a meaningful way.

At the end of it all, this is about a game. A game we find engrossing, and some of us are even a little obsessive-compulsive about it. But it's still a game. The whole point is to have fun. The whole point of communities is shared values. the shared value here is the love, or at least like, of Traveller. If you have a favourite, you need to accept that it might not be ther favourite of others. If you don't like something about a game, you are, of course, allowed to express that, but reflect on whether that complaint is constructive or helpful, or is just designed to lash out. You might find it more constructive to just avoid what you don't like. This is a big board, after all, with plenty of room for everyone.

 

[Colin]

To clarify my words: The above-noted exceptions are exceptions. On the whole Moderation here is fairly smooth, and most take our Warnings, and other actions, in the spirit in which they were intended. The point of the Mods is to let the board operate smoothly, while ensuring that it is a comfortable place where everyone can contribute. CotI isn't there at the moment. I acknowledge that. However, we are working towards that goal, now that we have the ability to implement change.

One of the things that I want to accomplish is a more even style of Moderation, in terms of the way it should apply to everyone, across the board (so to speak). Please note that this doesn't mean it will get slacker. Likely the opposite will be true.

To avoid this fate, reread the board rules. Think about those rules before you post. If you are truly in doubt, send one of us a PM, and we'll let you know if it crosses the line.

The Mods are trying to develop a more consensus-oriented approach to Moderation. Initially, this will mean that our reaction times will be slow, so please bear with us.

One thing that has come out of this so far: A Warning or Infraction will not be reversed unless a quorum of Mods decides that it was in error. Even if remedial action is undertaken, the Warning will still stand as a record on file of what happened.

 

[Spinward Scout]

You can also use Google (and perhaps other search engines) to locate specific posts on the site. On Google, just enter your search terms and then enter "site:www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/" without the quotes to have it crawl the forum.

The search function should point you in the right direction.

I've tried both of those searches and it's interesting how I can't seem to find the posts you are talking about. Maybe you could help us all out here and post some of the threads so we also know who's been saying it.

 

[rancke]

We have become too tolerant of some of the "old guard", who have much to contribute, but perhaps have poor social skills, at least in their online communications. I'm not going to name any names here. This will stop. At the same time, we have been occasionally too harsh with those who, for whatever reason, got under our skin. Again, no names here. If you see yourself in one of these groups, it might be a good time to stop and think about "why?" Some of these actions have prevented newcomers from getting comfortable to contribute in a meaningful way.

At the end of it all, this is about a game. A game we find engrossing, and some of us are even a little obsessive-compulsive about it. But it's still a game. The whole point is to have fun. The whole point of communities is shared values. the shared value here is the love, or at least like, of Traveller. If you have a favourite, you need to accept that it might not be ther favourite of others. If you don't like something about a game, you are, of course, allowed to express that, but reflect on whether that complaint is constructive or helpful, or is just designed to lash out. You might find it more constructive to just avoid what you don't like. This is a big board, after all, with plenty of room for everyone.

Here's a point that I've wanted to make for some time now: You're right about our shared values. I always assume that any new Traveller fan I meet is what Anne Shirley would call 'a kindred spirit' until I have evidence to the contrary. As such, I don't interpret every possible slight in the worst possible way; I try to give fellow Traveller fans the benefit of the doubt. The remark that is intolerably rude between strangers can be mere playful banter between friends.

If I was a moderator, I wouldn't sweat an original rough remark (provided there was a reasonable alternate interpretation) nearly as much as I'd object to escalation. If someone writes something that raises your hackles, you shouldn't respond by ripping him a new one verbally; rather, just let it go, or, if you feel you must respond, just post a calm response that you have a problem with his remark and did he really mean it the way it came out?

I, for one, would welcome a level of discourse that allowed for a bit of rough and ready give and take, and I really think there are times when people don't have the right to take offense at some particular remark. Not when it's between kindred spirits.

Note that I'm not talking about obvious trolls and people of proven ill will. I'm talking about interpreting a remark as an insult instead of as banter. Trolls and boors should absolutely be dealt with expeditiously, but otherwise I see the one who first escalates as much more culpable than the original poster.


Hans

 

[Supplement Four]

A good start (and this applies to everyone) would be to stop dragging up old arguments. We'll never move on otherwise.

We've all made mistakes in the past. I have no doubt we'll make more in the future. But let's at least give each other a chance to change.

That sounds very good to me.

I have no problem wiping the slate clean--even with Aramis. If Colin and Dan and Wil agree, I'll forget and ignore everything that's gone on in the past, turn the page, and start off on a new foot.

Do you three agree?

I find it interesting that not a single mod stepped forth at the above question (that I asked twice) and agreed.

Not a single mod.

Neither Wil, or Colin, or Dan, would join with me and say, "Sure S4! I think what Andrew said is fantastic! Let's wipe the slate completely clean and all get off to a good foot together in the spirit of the new board!"

Not a single mod.

Andrew, that doesn't make me hopeful that your mods aren't harboring agendas by their unwillingness to bury the hatchet.

It's pretty discouraging.

I gave it a shot and got no takers.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

And, Andrew, where do you stand on changing the wording of the Warning to a less confrontational message?

I'll see what can be done.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

...but no one has mentioned what happened to Hunter.

Was there an amiable parting of the ways?
Hostile takeover?
Extortion?
Passing of the Pan-Sentient Olympic torch?

Amiable AFAIK.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

I find it interesting that not a single mod stepped forth at the above question (that I asked twice) and agreed.

Not a single mod.

Neither Wil, or Colin, or Dan, would join with me and say, "Sure S4! I think what Andrew said is fantastic! Let's wipe the slate completely clean and all get off to a good foot together in the spirit of the new board!".

Maybe they're still wading through all 17 pages. Or in bed. Whatever, I'll make sure they behave.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

I expected to have to ban a few people today, but you've surprised me.

This thread has served it's purpose, so I'll close it now.

I am going to look into all your suggestions, but please be patient.

 

[spinwardpirate]

Most of the problems we have on CotI in terms of attracting new blood cannot be laid at the foot of the Mods.

That's probably a fair statement. Obviously, most of the current new blood is going to be coming here by way of MGT. Since Mongoose has their own forum, the MGT portion of the new blood doesn't really need this place. If they find hostility, they have no reason to stay.

If anything, our major flaw is allowing people to get away with too much, rather than over-moderating.

Agreed.

We have become too tolerant of some of the "old guard"... If you see yourself in one of these groups, it might be a good time to stop and think about "why?" Some of these actions have prevented newcomers from getting comfortable to contribute in a meaningful way.

I'm in no way, shape, or form one of the "old guard" here, but I have been playing Traveller since day one, so I don't ever feel uncomfortable speaking up if I have something to say. If, however, I was new to this whole TU thing, I'd feel differently, that's for sure.

At the end of it all, this is about a game. A game we find engrossing, and some of us are even a little obsessive-compulsive about it. But it's still a game. The whole point is to have fun.

Give that man bonus points!!! No truer words have been spoken. Our great to the Nth grandfathers were conquering the world, clearing forests, crossing oceans to undiscovered worlds. And here we sit, getting upset about another's opinion on how to model things in a make-believe universe.

 

[Colin]

I Aim to Misbehave (it's just a joke. Really. See the Smilie?)

For the record, sure. I'll let bygones be bygones. Once. From this point forwards, everyone gets treated exactly the same, by all Mods. Behaviour that we may have tolerated in the past, out of consideration of past contributions, will no longer be tolerated.

Everyone starts on the same line. If the line is crossed, you get a Warning. If you continue, or if you went way over the line, you get an Infraction. The Mods will try to get a consensus before dropping a bomb.

However, let's try to avoid that. Read the rules and follow them. It's really about respect for the other people on this board, and a game they like to play and have fun with. If this board doesn't add to that, then they leave, and we all lose.

Oh, and I never responded to the initial request to let bygones be bygones simply because I've been busy. My house won't paint itself.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

It's really about respect for the other people on this board, and a game they like to play and have fun with. If this board doesn't add to that, then they leave, and we all lose.

Well said, Colin. Thank you.