Trade Classifications
- Thread starter RobertFisher
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RobertFisher
SOC-12
Do the modifiers for As, De, & Va all apply to trade with an asteroid belt system or only As? If all of them apply, then I'd want to list them all, even if it is a bit redundant.
But then, I'll probably be using only Book 2 trade, so I guess I only really need to be concerned about Ag, Na, In, Ni, Ri, & Po. (Although some of the others could be useful reminders when making up facts about worlds.)
RobertFisher
SOC-12
Do the modifiers for As, De, & Va all apply to trade with an asteroid belt system or only As? If all of them apply, then I'd want to list them all, even if it is a bit redundant.
But then, I'll probably be using only Book 2 trade, so I guess I only really need to be concerned about Ag, Na, In, Ni, Ri, & Po. (Although some of the others could be useful reminders when making up facts about worlds.)
(Note that the format for the minority note is X:x, not Xx).
There's one very important one missing: 'H:x' for Human.
. At least one world in the Spinward Marches (Roget) ought to have it, and I'm sure there must be other worlds run by non-Humans where there are significant Human enclaves.Hans
(Yes, I know Roget has an A:7 note, but I submit that it ought to be an 'H:2' instead).
(Note that the format for the minority note is X:x, not Xx).
There's one very important one missing: 'H:x' for Human.
. At least one world in the Spinward Marches (Roget) ought to have it, and I'm sure there must be other worlds run by non-Humans where there are significant Human enclaves.Hans
(Yes, I know Roget has an A:7 note, but I submit that it ought to be an 'H:2' instead).
Robert,
They still apply, but most Remarks code sections are fifteen characters long, which means you only have space for five trade codes. Dropping De and Va when As is present allows you to put a lot more of the socially dependent codes on the list without running out of space.
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.
So you're CT without Books 4-8?
-Flynn
They still apply, but most Remarks code sections are fifteen characters long, which means you only have space for five trade codes. Dropping De and Va when As is present allows you to put a lot more of the socially dependent codes on the list without running out of space.
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.
So you're CT without Books 4-8?
-Flynn
Robert,
They still apply, but most Remarks code sections are fifteen characters long, which means you only have space for five trade codes. Dropping De and Va when As is present allows you to put a lot more of the socially dependent codes on the list without running out of space.
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.
So you're CT without Books 4-8?
-Flynn
They still apply, but most Remarks code sections are fifteen characters long, which means you only have space for five trade codes. Dropping De and Va when As is present allows you to put a lot more of the socially dependent codes on the list without running out of space.
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.
So you're CT without Books 4-8?
-Flynn
daryen
SOC-14 1K
TNE (or at least the RSB) changed the minority note to X:x. Prior to that it was indeed Xx (see list in Challenge 26 and various CT Alien Modules).
You can go as nuts as you want to with a minority note. For example, in the RSB, I am surprised there is no J:x for Jonkereen or Z:x for Zhodani. (Apparently they felt subdividing "humans" wasn't worth the effort, despite noting such in world descriptions.)
Besides, if you wanted to use change Roget to use H:2, you would have to completely change the UWP line like this:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Roget 0427 B566777-9 Ag Ri A:7 420 Da F8V M9D
-to-
Roget 0427 B5667H7-9 Ag Ri Aw H:2 420 Da F8V M9D</pre>[/QUOTE]It would seem to me that the first line is just easier. But then, I could be wrong.
Besides, wouldn't H:x be used for Hivers rather than Humans?
You can go as nuts as you want to with a minority note. For example, in the RSB, I am surprised there is no J:x for Jonkereen or Z:x for Zhodani. (Apparently they felt subdividing "humans" wasn't worth the effort, despite noting such in world descriptions.)
Besides, if you wanted to use change Roget to use H:2, you would have to completely change the UWP line like this:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Roget 0427 B566777-9 Ag Ri A:7 420 Da F8V M9D
-to-
Roget 0427 B5667H7-9 Ag Ri Aw H:2 420 Da F8V M9D</pre>[/QUOTE]It would seem to me that the first line is just easier. But then, I could be wrong.
Besides, wouldn't H:x be used for Hivers rather than Humans?
daryen
SOC-14 1K
TNE (or at least the RSB) changed the minority note to X:x. Prior to that it was indeed Xx (see list in Challenge 26 and various CT Alien Modules).
You can go as nuts as you want to with a minority note. For example, in the RSB, I am surprised there is no J:x for Jonkereen or Z:x for Zhodani. (Apparently they felt subdividing "humans" wasn't worth the effort, despite noting such in world descriptions.)
Besides, if you wanted to use change Roget to use H:2, you would have to completely change the UWP line like this:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Roget 0427 B566777-9 Ag Ri A:7 420 Da F8V M9D
-to-
Roget 0427 B5667H7-9 Ag Ri Aw H:2 420 Da F8V M9D</pre>[/QUOTE]It would seem to me that the first line is just easier. But then, I could be wrong.
Besides, wouldn't H:x be used for Hivers rather than Humans?
You can go as nuts as you want to with a minority note. For example, in the RSB, I am surprised there is no J:x for Jonkereen or Z:x for Zhodani. (Apparently they felt subdividing "humans" wasn't worth the effort, despite noting such in world descriptions.)
Besides, if you wanted to use change Roget to use H:2, you would have to completely change the UWP line like this:
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Roget 0427 B566777-9 Ag Ri A:7 420 Da F8V M9D
-to-
Roget 0427 B5667H7-9 Ag Ri Aw H:2 420 Da F8V M9D</pre>[/QUOTE]It would seem to me that the first line is just easier. But then, I could be wrong.
Besides, wouldn't H:x be used for Hivers rather than Humans?
I didn't know that. When I originally coded my Trade Calculator, I used the TNE core rulebook because the project was for TNE:1248. I've since modified it based on feedback from my peers. Essentially, if one trade code guarantees another is also present, such as As guarantees that Va and De are both present or Ba means that the world also get Lo as well, then I only note the original trade codes, not the dependents. No one had pointed out the De/Va dependency issue before, and I never noticed it.
I will have to go back and update my Calculator now.
Thanks for the insight,
Flynn
I will have to go back and update my Calculator now.
Thanks for the insight,
Flynn
I didn't know that. When I originally coded my Trade Calculator, I used the TNE core rulebook because the project was for TNE:1248. I've since modified it based on feedback from my peers. Essentially, if one trade code guarantees another is also present, such as As guarantees that Va and De are both present or Ba means that the world also get Lo as well, then I only note the original trade codes, not the dependents. No one had pointed out the De/Va dependency issue before, and I never noticed it.
I will have to go back and update my Calculator now.
Thanks for the insight,
Flynn
I will have to go back and update my Calculator now.
Thanks for the insight,
Flynn
daryen
SOC-14 1K
It's not just De/Va, but De vs atmos 0 (Va) and atmos 1.
The reason is because if a world has an atmos of 0 or 1 and a hydro of 1+, then the world is labelled with Ic (ice world). So, De is unnecessary as the absence of Ic implies the unnecessary De.
(I will admit that they did not do this with A-C atmospheres. If an A-C has a hydro of 1+, then it is Fl. But if its hydro is 0, it is still labelled De. Go figure.)
The reason is because if a world has an atmos of 0 or 1 and a hydro of 1+, then the world is labelled with Ic (ice world). So, De is unnecessary as the absence of Ic implies the unnecessary De.
(I will admit that they did not do this with A-C atmospheres. If an A-C has a hydro of 1+, then it is Fl. But if its hydro is 0, it is still labelled De. Go figure.)
daryen
SOC-14 1K
It's not just De/Va, but De vs atmos 0 (Va) and atmos 1.
The reason is because if a world has an atmos of 0 or 1 and a hydro of 1+, then the world is labelled with Ic (ice world). So, De is unnecessary as the absence of Ic implies the unnecessary De.
(I will admit that they did not do this with A-C atmospheres. If an A-C has a hydro of 1+, then it is Fl. But if its hydro is 0, it is still labelled De. Go figure.)
The reason is because if a world has an atmos of 0 or 1 and a hydro of 1+, then the world is labelled with Ic (ice world). So, De is unnecessary as the absence of Ic implies the unnecessary De.
(I will admit that they did not do this with A-C atmospheres. If an A-C has a hydro of 1+, then it is Fl. But if its hydro is 0, it is still labelled De. Go figure.)
M
Malenfant
Guest
I think "Ic" (which is technically "ice capped", not "ice world") is bit of a pain in the arse, actually...
I mean, places like Europa or Ganymede have atm 0 but their surfaces are made of water ice. But hydrographics is defined as the percentage of liquid exposed on the surface of the planet - not ice. So I think it's right to class them as hyd 0 as has been done in book 6. Plus, they have oceans under the ice, but none of it is exposed to the surface so that further supports using hyd 0.
It seems there's an inconcistency here.
I mean, places like Europa or Ganymede have atm 0 but their surfaces are made of water ice. But hydrographics is defined as the percentage of liquid exposed on the surface of the planet - not ice. So I think it's right to class them as hyd 0 as has been done in book 6. Plus, they have oceans under the ice, but none of it is exposed to the surface so that further supports using hyd 0.
It seems there's an inconcistency here.
M
Malenfant
Guest
I think "Ic" (which is technically "ice capped", not "ice world") is bit of a pain in the arse, actually...
I mean, places like Europa or Ganymede have atm 0 but their surfaces are made of water ice. But hydrographics is defined as the percentage of liquid exposed on the surface of the planet - not ice. So I think it's right to class them as hyd 0 as has been done in book 6. Plus, they have oceans under the ice, but none of it is exposed to the surface so that further supports using hyd 0.
It seems there's an inconcistency here.
I mean, places like Europa or Ganymede have atm 0 but their surfaces are made of water ice. But hydrographics is defined as the percentage of liquid exposed on the surface of the planet - not ice. So I think it's right to class them as hyd 0 as has been done in book 6. Plus, they have oceans under the ice, but none of it is exposed to the surface so that further supports using hyd 0.
It seems there's an inconcistency here.
daryen
SOC-14 1K
I wouldn't use the Book 6 writeups as too much of an example. Mars should be atmosphere 1, not 3. And Europa is listed as not having an atmosphere. So listing Europa and Ganymede with hydrographics of 0 could as easily be a mistake as an example of anything.
Irrespective of that, there are other examples of worlds that include their ice coverage within their hydrographics. Terra comes to mind. There is also Nosea in the Darrian subsector. I am sure if I tried, I could find more examples.
Quite frankly, it wasn't until I started reading these boards that I even heard of the idea that hydrographics was purely "liquid" coverage. I have always read it to include ice caps (when present).
On a side note, in the Traveller Book (at the very least), it specifically lists the "De" requirements as "Hydrographic 0, atmosphere 2+".
Irrespective of that, there are other examples of worlds that include their ice coverage within their hydrographics. Terra comes to mind. There is also Nosea in the Darrian subsector. I am sure if I tried, I could find more examples.
Quite frankly, it wasn't until I started reading these boards that I even heard of the idea that hydrographics was purely "liquid" coverage. I have always read it to include ice caps (when present).
On a side note, in the Traveller Book (at the very least), it specifically lists the "De" requirements as "Hydrographic 0, atmosphere 2+".
daryen
SOC-14 1K
I wouldn't use the Book 6 writeups as too much of an example. Mars should be atmosphere 1, not 3. And Europa is listed as not having an atmosphere. So listing Europa and Ganymede with hydrographics of 0 could as easily be a mistake as an example of anything.
Irrespective of that, there are other examples of worlds that include their ice coverage within their hydrographics. Terra comes to mind. There is also Nosea in the Darrian subsector. I am sure if I tried, I could find more examples.
Quite frankly, it wasn't until I started reading these boards that I even heard of the idea that hydrographics was purely "liquid" coverage. I have always read it to include ice caps (when present).
On a side note, in the Traveller Book (at the very least), it specifically lists the "De" requirements as "Hydrographic 0, atmosphere 2+".
Irrespective of that, there are other examples of worlds that include their ice coverage within their hydrographics. Terra comes to mind. There is also Nosea in the Darrian subsector. I am sure if I tried, I could find more examples.
Quite frankly, it wasn't until I started reading these boards that I even heard of the idea that hydrographics was purely "liquid" coverage. I have always read it to include ice caps (when present).
On a side note, in the Traveller Book (at the very least), it specifically lists the "De" requirements as "Hydrographic 0, atmosphere 2+".
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