Trade Classifications

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by Aramis:
[QB] Mars has a clear Ic earned, at it's No Atmosphere, according to you, Mal. (where is the 0.01-0.1 bar definition, anyway?) Given the profound effects of Mars' atmosphere, and the plans to put flying probes there, I'd say clearly that limiting trace to 10mb is moronic with a capital stoopid... but that's just me. I'd put the limit at 1 mb mean radius median pressure...)

Indeed. And that's exactly what I've done in my realistic UWP generator . But yes... I guess Mars is what got GDW thinking about having an ice-capped classification.

Heck, A school I often work at just recently bought a book on space, 2003 imprint, which doesn't mention Jupiter's Rings, and lists only half as many moons for Jupiter and Saturn as are on the nasa pages!

Well, just like any field there's good books and bad books - sounds like they picked a bad one.

Back to topic... Ic makes perfect sense, if, as you propose, mars is listed as Atm 0. I'd say it would make little sense in the inner zone, but in the outer zone, it makes a lot of sense (but does imply a lot of Ic worlds are actually martian-like).

Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

 

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by Aramis:
[QB] Mars has a clear Ic earned, at it's No Atmosphere, according to you, Mal. (where is the 0.01-0.1 bar definition, anyway?) Given the profound effects of Mars' atmosphere, and the plans to put flying probes there, I'd say clearly that limiting trace to 10mb is moronic with a capital stoopid... but that's just me. I'd put the limit at 1 mb mean radius median pressure...)

Indeed. And that's exactly what I've done in my realistic UWP generator . But yes... I guess Mars is what got GDW thinking about having an ice-capped classification.

Heck, A school I often work at just recently bought a book on space, 2003 imprint, which doesn't mention Jupiter's Rings, and lists only half as many moons for Jupiter and Saturn as are on the nasa pages!

Well, just like any field there's good books and bad books - sounds like they picked a bad one.

Back to topic... Ic makes perfect sense, if, as you propose, mars is listed as Atm 0. I'd say it would make little sense in the inner zone, but in the outer zone, it makes a lot of sense (but does imply a lot of Ic worlds are actually martian-like).

Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

 

[aramis]

Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

which is what I assumed all along.

Actually, my prefered System generator was always Starfire's Imperial Starfire ...
World types depend on size, then on placement relative to ecosphere. (Sadly, it's more dated than Traveller, since GG's can not occur inside the Ecosphere nor inner zones....)

Followed closely by 2300's...

 

[aramis]

Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

which is what I assumed all along.

Actually, my prefered System generator was always Starfire's Imperial Starfire ...
World types depend on size, then on placement relative to ecosphere. (Sadly, it's more dated than Traveller, since GG's can not occur inside the Ecosphere nor inner zones....)

Followed closely by 2300's...

 

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by Aramis:
[QB] </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

which is what I assumed all along.
</font>[/QUOTE]It's the most sensible option, but note that isn't implied by the Book 6 rules at all.

 

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by Aramis:
[QB] </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Yes... maybe the solution would be to say that icy worlds don't have a hydrorgraphic percentage unless there really is liquid (e.g ammonia, ethane etc) on the surface.

which is what I assumed all along.
</font>[/QUOTE]It's the most sensible option, but note that isn't implied by the Book 6 rules at all.

 

[RobertFisher]

Originally posted by Flynn:
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.

Well, I'm only using *.sec 'cause that's what sec2pdf takes & I haven't run into any of its limitations yet.

As soon as I do run into one of the limitations, I'll probably switch to CSV & write some conversion filters.

So you're CT without Books 4-8?

Well, I have the 0-8 reprint. I think I even have High Guard & Mercenary LBBs. (2 of 1 of them.)

My intention is to initially stick with B1-3+S4 as much as possible. (& drawing on the other supplements & adventures in bits too, of course) And to save the more "advanced" bits for when/if the group wants something more advanced in a particular area.

 

[RobertFisher]

Originally posted by Flynn:
Of course, if you aren't using the existing *.sec format, that's not an issue.

Well, I'm only using *.sec 'cause that's what sec2pdf takes & I haven't run into any of its limitations yet.

As soon as I do run into one of the limitations, I'll probably switch to CSV & write some conversion filters.

So you're CT without Books 4-8?

Well, I have the 0-8 reprint. I think I even have High Guard & Mercenary LBBs. (2 of 1 of them.)

My intention is to initially stick with B1-3+S4 as much as possible. (& drawing on the other supplements & adventures in bits too, of course) And to save the more "advanced" bits for when/if the group wants something more advanced in a particular area.

 

[Flynn]

I understand. I'm using sec2pdf a lot myself, and I really find it useful.

Very cool, Robert. I'm liking what I hear, and I look forward to seeing what you come up with for your game. Did you ever decide: OTU or ATU?

-Flynn

 

[Flynn]

I understand. I'm using sec2pdf a lot myself, and I really find it useful.

Very cool, Robert. I'm liking what I hear, and I look forward to seeing what you come up with for your game. Did you ever decide: OTU or ATU?

-Flynn

 

[RobertFisher]

Originally posted by Flynn:
Did you ever decide: OTU or ATU?

I decided ATU.

Then I thought about the parts of the work involved that I wouldn't enjoy--that I had not been thinking about. So, I started thinking maybe I'd just use the OTU, although I might mix things up quite a bit.

Then I generated a sector worth of data & looked at it with sec2pdf. I immediately started seeing some boarders. Then I started picking out some of the stand-outs (e.g. high tech levels). & I'm back to ATU again.

I suppose a real decision won't be made until the day the current campaign wraps up & the group says their ready to make Traveller characters. Then I'll either decide I'm happy enough with my ATU & run with it, or I'll just pull out S3 or S10.

 

[RobertFisher]

Originally posted by Flynn:
Did you ever decide: OTU or ATU?

I decided ATU.

Then I thought about the parts of the work involved that I wouldn't enjoy--that I had not been thinking about. So, I started thinking maybe I'd just use the OTU, although I might mix things up quite a bit.

Then I generated a sector worth of data & looked at it with sec2pdf. I immediately started seeing some boarders. Then I started picking out some of the stand-outs (e.g. high tech levels). & I'm back to ATU again.

I suppose a real decision won't be made until the day the current campaign wraps up & the group says their ready to make Traveller characters. Then I'll either decide I'm happy enough with my ATU & run with it, or I'll just pull out S3 or S10.

 

[Flynn]

Mind sharing your PDF or even just your *.sec file? I'd love to see what you're looking at, if it's cool with you.

Might even have some feedback for you, if you're interested in outside opinions,
Flynn

 

[Flynn]

Mind sharing your PDF or even just your *.sec file? I'd love to see what you're looking at, if it's cool with you.

Might even have some feedback for you, if you're interested in outside opinions,
Flynn

 

[clair_rand]

can't help but thinking that since trade classes are totally dependent on world data, with no random element in them the whole trade class section is redundant.. calculate them on the flay as needed.. to search for a world with a trade code of 'Ic' you search for worlds with atmosphere 0 or 1 and hydrographics of 1 or more..

otherwise you store more than you need to.. save teh space in ya data files for ref generated notes and leave the stuff ya can derive as need to the damn computer

 

[clair_rand]

can't help but thinking that since trade classes are totally dependent on world data, with no random element in them the whole trade class section is redundant.. calculate them on the flay as needed.. to search for a world with a trade code of 'Ic' you search for worlds with atmosphere 0 or 1 and hydrographics of 1 or more..

otherwise you store more than you need to.. save teh space in ya data files for ref generated notes and leave the stuff ya can derive as need to the damn computer

 

[Flynn]

Claire, that works so long as you are using your computer at the table. If you aren't, then you have to memorize all of those requirements, and implement them on the fly. Not saying a Ref can't do that, but personally, I'd prefer to keep my mind on the game, if I can note them easily on the printout I'm looking at.

Two more creds to the pile,
Flynn

 

[Flynn]

Claire, that works so long as you are using your computer at the table. If you aren't, then you have to memorize all of those requirements, and implement them on the fly. Not saying a Ref can't do that, but personally, I'd prefer to keep my mind on the game, if I can note them easily on the printout I'm looking at.

Two more creds to the pile,
Flynn

 

[clair_rand]

yeah but if ya *not* using a computer the requirements change once more.. now ya trade classes columns can be as wide as ya likes and hold what ever ya wants.

i always left the stuff on the pc.. printed the subsecotrs out before the game (used to do maps too if only i could find the damn program). the point is ya don't need to *store* the trade classes since they can be built at will.

But like i say using the hight of modern technology (an hb pencil), then well the stars are the limit.. as it should be.

 

[clair_rand]

yeah but if ya *not* using a computer the requirements change once more.. now ya trade classes columns can be as wide as ya likes and hold what ever ya wants.

i always left the stuff on the pc.. printed the subsecotrs out before the game (used to do maps too if only i could find the damn program). the point is ya don't need to *store* the trade classes since they can be built at will.

But like i say using the hight of modern technology (an hb pencil), then well the stars are the limit.. as it should be.