• Welcome to the new COTI server. We've moved the Citizens to a new server. Please let us know in the COTI Website issue forum if you find any problems.

Travelling in The Fringe - A Near Space interpretation

OV had cumbersome gravitic systems. Ships had gravitics and reactionless drives; but the generator was too heavy to fit into a vehicle, except for possible heavy grav barges.
 
Let me suggest that useful psionics is not an "everyman" type of thing. While the Classic RAW says everyone has a psionic strength rating:
  • If not identified it decays with age.
  • If identified it may not be high enough to be useful.
  • It requires training to access.
  • Even after training there's a chance no useful skill(s) will achieved.

Take a look at Classic's psionic rules again, especially the initial strength throw, the six Talents throws, and the costs associated with seemingly minor activities. Useful psionic talents don't occur as often as we think.



That expansion would be a good reason why Jump-1 ships are now within the financial reach of individuals, small groups, and small companies. Let me use the Suez Canal as an example.

Finished in 1867, the Canal allowed steamer to finally compete along Europe to India routes. Their need to refuel after a certain distance, which was tied to engine efficiency, meant they hadn't been able to compete economically on longer routes no matter if fuel was available or not. The Canal put India within "range" of steamers, that put a lot of sailing ships out of work, and that put a lot of sailing on the market at cheap prices. (The fact that sailing ships had to be towed through the Canal and couldn't easily sail northwards in the Red Sea for parts of the year helped too.)

The expansion of Jump-2 is going to put a lot of Jump1 ships out of work which will put a lot of those ships on the market at cheap prices. Prices the PCs or the kinds of patrons who may hire them may be able to swing.[/QUOTE]


My point with Psionics was more how many games tend to interpret it, rather than the strict LBB rules - because IMHO it sure seems to show up statistically more than not in campaigns I've experienced. I like the idea of it as a "strange but useful" trait rather than as the "Jedi/Lensman/Whatever mind powers deus-ex-machina" role. YMMV.

I really liked what you did with the Jump 1/Jump 2 transition idea. Not sure if it would work with what I was picturing (only because I still see Jump 2 as a scarce, controlled commodity, rather than the new, yet expensive hotness) - but you gave a GREAT explanation for how a glut of ships could drop on the market and suddenly be available. I'm going to ponder this and see what comes up. Thank you.
 
Agree, this is a very interesting set up.


No grav vehicles in a setting...

does that mean no artificial gravity and no acceleration compensation? How do you make it stand out from say T2300?

A setting without artificial gravity and air/rafts is very different to one with, even if you make grav generators so large you need something the size of a ship to have them.

You then have the issue of how to handwave the technology that grants ships multi-g acceleration without being mostly fuel tank, or do you handwave magic gravitics again?

Orbital springs to mind as being the hardest published sci fi setting I have seen for Traveller.


As Golan stated, I go the same route - artificial grav is out there, but it's just so large and power-intensive it's currently limited to ships. I'd have to sit and fiddle with numbers (which isn't happening tonight), but my ref-handwave would say "shuttlecraft and above can work it, but air rafts, grav tanks and the like aren't happening."

Again, like Golan said - now all those "retro" transporation skills come in handy, since Grav-x doesn't solve everything. Good atmo? Maybe flyer, or anything else. Thin, tainted atmo? That flyer won't work - so that ATV may be vital. Etc etc.
 
Gengeneering in The Fringe

So... we are 200 years on, we have space travel, advanced tech, etc.

And, even in 2018 we've mapped the human genome.

It's silly to think we won't tweak it as needed.

Here are my thoughts for "genetic engineering" possibilities in a setting like this.

- #1, the majority of "hereditary" diseases are if not eliminated, greatly controlled. Not turning this into a how/why/eugenics argument - but the plain fact is, we're doing early steps of this already, and it will only continue. 200 years from now it's a relatively sure bet that most of these issues have been resolved. (This leads to the aging tables comment I need to post tomorrow).

- I like the route T2300 (Mongoose version in particular) took - most mods are simple, and more in terms of adaptations to offworld life. Take this and run with it. BUT, I also hate rules/tables/bulky settings. So - this is ref/player handwave stuff. Basically I prefer to talk this stuff out rather than throw numbers on a paper. Say your character comes from a low-g, thin atmo world... if you want to drop 1 Str and bump 1 Dex point I'd let it slide - and we role-play the rest. You'll function better than others when the ship starts a rapid decompression... but, the safari on the high-g world is going to make you wear out quick. And the like... Get as crunchy or simple as you want with this.

- Then there are *those others*. Altered. Frankensteins. Lab-grown. Call them what you want - humans who have been specifically DNA modified to be *more* than what Homo Sapiens are. Obviously, a LOW percentage of the population (and possibly even "illegal" on most worlds), but they exist:
-- Is it blending in more of the violent hunter/gatherer, early hominid warrior type traits (See Richard Morgan for a great treatment of this); or enhanced physical characteristics to create "super-soldiers"?
-- Beautiful, willing, lusty (wo)men, created to serve in elite brothels or as concubines?
-- Regressed (barely)-men, built in some corporate clone lab to provide slave labor in hazardous environments, and with fewer tendencies to rebel?
-- Or does this explain Psionics for campaign use - some project which unlocked repeatable, consistent areas of mental power influencing the physical world? Would they allow this information to be public knowledge, or tightly control it for profit and/or power?

Again, at no point would I want a campaign revolving around this - but the tech is there. Maybe it's an NPC the players have to deal with. Perhaps some corporate or government plot they get to expose. It works far better as a background and plot point, rather than as something every player is throwing elbows trying to power-game with.
 
My point with Psionics was more how many games tend to interpret it, rather than the strict LBB rules - because IMHO it sure seems to show up statistically more than not in campaigns I've experienced.


As you note, those problems have more to with the people running and playing in the specific game and nothing to do with rules as written.

I like the idea of it as a "strange but useful" trait rather than as the "Jedi/Lensman/Whatever mind powers deus-ex-machina" role. YMMV.

My mileage doesn't vary because I agree with you! As written, the effects of psionic talents are generally measured in seconds while requiring recovery times generally measured in hours. Any Jedi/Lensmen power level and endurance means the DM ignored the rules.

I really liked what you did with the Jump 1/Jump 2 transition idea. Not sure if it would work with what I was picturing (only because I still see Jump 2 as a scarce, controlled commodity, rather than the new, yet expensive hotness) - but you gave a GREAT explanation for how a glut of ships could drop on the market and suddenly be available. I'm going to ponder this and see what comes up. Thank you.

Not my idea at all, just something I stole from history. I recently read a book about how Joseph Conrad's career as a merchant officer so greatly influenced his career as a writer. Conrad's maritime career straddled the "death of sail" I wrote about. The Suez was the first big blow while improvements in engines and boilers finished to job. The author of the book explained that, while shipping lines and ship designs handled the transition, many of Conrad's fellow merchant officers did not, some by choice and others due to a lack ability.

While all ships have their quirks, as a group steamers handled differently, had to be loaded differently, behaved differently in storms, calm, and port, and the make-up of their crews were different requiring different "people" skills. Navigation was different too, not the mechanics and mathematics bits for sun and star sights, but how often and quickly you needed to check and a very different set of assumptions when using dead reckoning.

Some officers couldn't handle the changes, some chose not to, and regardless of the reason some chose to retire while others competed for fewer and fewer jobs on decaying ships sailing marginal routes. You know those beautiful clippers you see in paintings and photos racing home from China with tea, silks, and porcelain? They ended up carrying fossilized bird guano from Chile to Europe around the Horn with tiny crews of shanghaied men.

Anyway, what I'm trying to point out is that your Jump-1 to Jump-2 transition cab be more than just a technological transition. It could be a skills transition too. Navigation should be different, right? Plotting a longer jump is harder, just look at the computer programs in Book 2. How about operating the jump2 drive? Should an engineer familiar with a jump1 drive simply be able to handle a jump2 version as if the only difference is the number of 'spark plugs"?

With "Jump1 crews" unable or unwilling to upgrade their skills, there could be a glut on the labor market too just like how jump2 ships have made jump1 ships obsolete along certain routes.

Edit - About genetic engineering, LKW always suggested a "below the level of notice" approach too. It's been used to eradicate or repair various genetic diseases and defects much more often than creating "Frankenstein" or "Khan Singh".
 
Last edited:
- #1, the majority of "hereditary" diseases are if not eliminated, greatly controlled. Not turning this into a how/why/eugenics argument - but the plain fact is, we're doing early steps of this already, and it will only continue. 200 years from now it's a relatively sure bet that most of these issues have been resolved. (This leads to the aging tables comment I need to post tomorrow).
What I used for this in TSAO was a TL-dependent +DM to aging rolls, so the higher the TL, the slower you age on average. A DM+2, not to mention a DM+3, would significantly affect the 2D aging rolls...

More about genetic engineering - this shouldn't be limited to humans. Advanced GMOs could be easily adapted to conditions on alien planets and vastly increase crop yields; transgenic spider-silk will revolutionize body armor and probably serve in other roles as well; and so on. Possibly plants engineered to produce various forms of easily-harvested plastics or pharmaceuticals for colonial use.
 
More about genetic engineering - this shouldn't be limited to humans. Advanced GMOs could be easily adapted to conditions on alien planets and vastly increase crop yields; transgenic spider-silk will revolutionize body armor and probably serve in other roles as well; and so on. Possibly plants engineered to produce various forms of easily-harvested plastics or pharmaceuticals for colonial use.

This bit about biotech is deeply ingrained IMTU.

I'm judicial about it's use- for instance I have bioluminescent plants serving as lamps and lights in most homes, but not ships- because there is a good chance there will be vacuum at some point and you don't want your light source dying.

This small tech example leads to such moments as using an NPC to remind the players to 'water their lamps' before they leave the house. Biotech can be a gateway to those 'not in Kansas anymore' moments to build the setting.
 
Bio-engineering has been part of Traveller from its early days. Bio-modding of a sort gets a mention in MWM's Robots article series IIRC and then there is the entry in the original Spinward Marches about biologically engineering colonists to live on a water world.

Like cybernetics it is likely to be a background technology that modifies slightly but rarely augments - no bonus to dice throws but a useful modification would be a baseline modification, a bonus of +1 would be costly, +2 a king's ransom.

Likely breakthroughs:
gene therapy
cloning organs via harvested stem cells
whole body cloning
gene editing/gene splicing (think of a useful animal trait and include it in a biomodified human - storing oxygen in muscle tissue like cetaceans for example)
synthetic organisms
rejuvination
 
Last edited:
As you note, those problems have more to with the people running and playing in the specific game and nothing to do with rules as written.



My mileage doesn't vary because I agree with you! As written, the effects of psionic talents are generally measured in seconds while requiring recovery times generally measured in hours. Any Jedi/Lensmen power level and endurance means the DM ignored the rules.



Not my idea at all, just something I stole from history. I recently read a book about how Joseph Conrad's career as a merchant officer so greatly influenced his career as a writer. Conrad's maritime career straddled the "death of sail" I wrote about. The Suez was the first big blow while improvements in engines and boilers finished to job. The author of the book explained that, while shipping lines and ship designs handled the transition, many of Conrad's fellow merchant officers did not, some by choice and others due to a lack ability.

While all ships have their quirks, as a group steamers handled differently, had to be loaded differently, behaved differently in storms, calm, and port, and the make-up of their crews were different requiring different "people" skills. Navigation was different too, not the mechanics and mathematics bits for sun and star sights, but how often and quickly you needed to check and a very different set of assumptions when using dead reckoning.

Some officers couldn't handle the changes, some chose not to, and regardless of the reason some chose to retire while others competed for fewer and fewer jobs on decaying ships sailing marginal routes. You know those beautiful clippers you see in paintings and photos racing home from China with tea, silks, and porcelain? They ended up carrying fossilized bird guano from Chile to Europe around the Horn with tiny crews of shanghaied men.

Anyway, what I'm trying to point out is that your Jump-1 to Jump-2 transition cab be more than just a technological transition. It could be a skills transition too. Navigation should be different, right? Plotting a longer jump is harder, just look at the computer programs in Book 2. How about operating the jump2 drive? Should an engineer familiar with a jump1 drive simply be able to handle a jump2 version as if the only difference is the number of 'spark plugs"?

With "Jump1 crews" unable or unwilling to upgrade their skills, there could be a glut on the labor market too just like how jump2 ships have made jump1 ships obsolete along certain routes.

Edit - About genetic engineering, LKW always suggested a "below the level of notice" approach too. It's been used to eradicate or repair various genetic diseases and defects much more often than creating "Frankenstein" or "Khan Singh".


As I'm not currently in a position to game, much less run a campaign, I have to leave the skill transition as "food for thought" rather than exploring the concept. Be that as it may, I definitely appreciate you giving me a concept to consider.
 
What I used for this in TSAO was a TL-dependent +DM to aging rolls, so the higher the TL, the slower you age on average. A DM+2, not to mention a DM+3, would significantly affect the 2D aging rolls...

More about genetic engineering - this shouldn't be limited to humans. Advanced GMOs could be easily adapted to conditions on alien planets and vastly increase crop yields; transgenic spider-silk will revolutionize body armor and probably serve in other roles as well; and so on. Possibly plants engineered to produce various forms of easily-harvested plastics or pharmaceuticals for colonial use.

- #1 - yes, was already thinking along those points. Have a longer post planned on the topic of aging and ranks being my two big character creation headaches from LBB, but not up to it tonight. But your method definitely works.

- #2 - In my mind, that's a whole part of the "simpler" types of terraforming when colonizing The Fringe. Start DNA tweaking the biosphere on both ends of the spectrum to meet in the middle, and produce an ecosystem compatible with humans while not being a total change from the original. No, I'm not going nuts on the hard science possibilities, but rather using it for the "what if?" of how these things work rather than hand waving 100's of perfect Earth matches out there.
 
This bit about biotech is deeply ingrained IMTU.

I'm judicial about it's use- for instance I have bioluminescent plants serving as lamps and lights in most homes, but not ships- because there is a good chance there will be vacuum at some point and you don't want your light source dying.

This small tech example leads to such moments as using an NPC to remind the players to 'water their lamps' before they leave the house. Biotech can be a gateway to those 'not in Kansas anymore' moments to build the setting.

You hit on a key referee point IMHO - we don't effectively portray "strange new worlds" with the 4-armed, 8-eyed alien.... it's the subtle things in the background. Bladerunner's mix of languages on the street, and flying cars past giant holograms while people used chopsticks millenia old. Firefly's Persephone port scene. And so on. Whether biotech, a juxtoposition in eras, or just random noise, this is how we turn it from a "scenario" into an *adventure*...
 
To All

First off - THANK YOU! I never expected my simple campaign setting idea would get so much traction, or interaction. I know I didn't reply to everyone's post or thoughts, but trust me in that I read them all and appreciated the fact you chose to share. Additionally, you all have given me ideas for bits I never considered in my initial approach.

Second - I'm more than willing to continue to postulate castles in this sandbox, but would like some input. Any ideas/requests for things to expand on? I'm not volunteering to write a 10 page adventure, or 50 page supplement for anyone - but I do want to let my brain wander more down these paths! Again, I don't promise to develop every concept thrown my way, but will certainly do my best.
 
I'm struggling in my own near-space setting, trying to figure out what to do with nobility. What are you doing?
 
First off - THANK YOU! I never expected my simple campaign setting idea would get so much traction, or interaction. I know I didn't reply to everyone's post or thoughts, but trust me in that I read them all and appreciated the fact you chose to share. Additionally, you all have given me ideas for bits I never considered in my initial approach.

Second - I'm more than willing to continue to postulate castles in this sandbox, but would like some input. Any ideas/requests for things to expand on? I'm not volunteering to write a 10 page adventure, or 50 page supplement for anyone - but I do want to let my brain wander more down these paths! Again, I don't promise to develop every concept thrown my way, but will certainly do my best.

Last I checked, that's what this forum was for.

Postulate away !
 
I'm struggling in my own near-space setting, trying to figure out what to do with nobility. What are you doing?
In Outer Veil, I removed them. They simply did not fit the desired mood and subgenre of the setting. Instead, Social Standing represented your connections in the government an corporations and your "social capital". SOC 2 would be a nobody with a criminal record and no credit rating, which SOC 15 would be someone with personal or family connections to corporate CEOs and politicians - or a celebrity. But no noble titles. OV is more Alien(s) than Dune, after all.
 
IMTU near future setting the nobility are the corporate executives and board of directors, below them there are the heads of state and the old rich families who held onto their wealth by becoming major investors in the robotic factories and space industries - there is some overlap here.
 
My IMTU, it's social pecking order without the feudal overtones. It's also sort of a credit rating, so most ship owners that are not merchants themselves are high SOC people, or at least one will be on to sell the ship loan.

I am considering making SOC be more of a socialization or emotional intelligence marker, making it the base stat for things like Persuade, Leader, Carousing, etc. Haven't got player buy-in yet.

In that case high SOC would be people who understand and can get other people to do things- whether that is inspiration, selling, or intimidating (this isn't charisma per se).
 
IMTU (Main Sequence), nobles are ultra-powerful and they rule planets as well as the space between. There's a strong enfeoffment system and social hierarchy all the way down to the worker. It's still all intertwined with corporate structures, but after a few generations, nobles stop wanting to actually run megacorps and just want to live their lives, especially with widespread anagathics keeping them alive for centuries.

I'm also thinking about changing SOC, as kilemall is considering, and having a separate RANK stat that is really hard to advance in, and PCs probably are forced to start non-noble.

I'd call SOC "Social Intelligence." I would NOT institutionalize the house rule that flips the sign of SOC mods for underworld stuff. If you have high SOC, your lowlife scum can rub elbows with nobles and get along with them. They might still lord their power over you, and convincing them of stuff might get you a hefty skill check penalty. Likewise, a noble can go underground and get stuff done, but lack of knowledge of the street might earn them a penalty.

After all, I want a grittier "post-cyberpunk" feel.

My nobles are divided into 3-5 different kingdoms, engaged in wars (both hot and cold) with each other over stars. They keep their planets from rebelling by intentionally specializing each planet so that they require trade to survive, and the nobles control all the sungates.
 
In Outer Veil, I removed them. They simply did not fit the desired mood and subgenre of the setting. Instead, Social Standing represented your connections in the government an corporations and your "social capital". SOC 2 would be a nobody with a criminal record and no credit rating, which SOC 15 would be someone with personal or family connections to corporate CEOs and politicians - or a celebrity. But no noble titles. OV is more Alien(s) than Dune, after all.

This is probably closest (but not exactly) to my own approach.

SOC in The Fringe can be viewed as "perceived importance and power" - and it may parallel actual power, or be totally separate. It is also world/polity variable - the heavy corporate worlds, it may indicate rank and position within a business structure; bureaucracy, the position and/or access to certain functions; or simply a character from "old Earth money and connections". But, no, it does NOT equate to nobility and ranks in that fashion.

By "perceived" the best example I can give from modern Earth is that of various celebrities and corporate figures. As a few random examples, people like Bill Gates, Bono, Leonardo DiCaprio, Paris Hilton, Mark Zuckerberg, Rush Limbaugh, or whomever else pops up on the front pages of the news, or in the society/entertainment shows, or whatever have little "actual" influence in world events. Sure, they can talk, they can offer opinions, they can even direct money and resources - but, they don't move armies or mobilize whole industries (in general) at a command. On the other hand, it would be a foolish politician which ignored the influence these people might have on perceptions, publicity, or whatever else. And, I would postulate, the higher the SOC, the more that the perceived and actual power are merging together...

Also, SOC is not the sole designator of actual power and control - criminal overlords are rarely going to be high SOC, but may command vast resources and respect... Military leaders (depending on the government) may or may not get associated prestige. SOC is much more a "public" face to things than the other elements. The T5 "Fame" ranking is a similar view I suppose, but I like seeing it this way more.

So, looking at distributions then, I would see an "A" or a "B" as being influential/known on a local level (depending on size of world/community); "C" moving into world/system wide, and maybe some inter-system influence. "D" and above are movers and shakers - they may not control governments directly, but their good or bad decisions can affect industries, wealth, and other issues. "F" - hard to find a comparision in this setting, at least off the top of my head - definitely approaching head of state level.

For PCs, I would default to "OK, so tell me what you think this means for your character?" on a high or low SOC roll - and build from their where in that nebulous pattern they fall. Besides making it more interesting than "Oh yeah, great, another Knight, yippee..." you're bound to get at least a few adventure seeds just off what they present.
 
What About Scouts?

So - if there is no unified Imperium in The Fringe, no central government or galaxy-spanning services, how do we handle Scouts?

It’s actually pretty simple, and fits with how they are written in LBB style (mostly).

Exploration is a chancy proposition - you’re risking ships, personnel and other resources on a gamble effectively. Sometimes it pays off with a garden world and fantastic resources, others are a bust. Plus, you’re doing all of this beyond your regular supply lines, support networks and everything else which come with a developed area. This can make governments skittish about spending precious resources on a limited return (particularly representative systems trying to explain budgets to the masses). Additionally, diverting military resources (the typical government entity which is most prepared for these operations), to exploration and analysis means you’re pulling them from system defense or other needs.

But - space still presents plenty of opportunities for these resources and wealth, and private industry through the mega corporations is eager to exploit this potential. Unlike governments though, the mega corps don’t have fleets of ships available to task towards such needs, nor the station and port infrastructure to support their upkeep, fueling and downtime. There also isn’t a “corporate career track” for someone willing to spend the majority of their time charting new worlds and gathering system data, and then somehow fit into the company mold back home.

Which is wear Scouts come in - the Independent Contractor of the future.

Because, there are *always* people who DO want to “do their own thing,” to avoid the mold and routine of daily life, and to see things no one has before. Sometimes it’s because they have a loner spirit. Sometimes it’s a drive to be on the cutting edge of humanity. Sometimes it’s just because they don’t fit in anywhere else.

Scouts provide an opportunity for everyone to win at lower cost. The Interstellar Commercial Commission first proposed this system to the United Earth Alliance a century ago, and it has worked ever since. The UEA shipyards at Proxima agree to provide exploration ships to the Scouts at-cost (the ubiquitous 100-ton vessel being the prime example,) and to allow them to use UEA facilities for maintenance and upkeep. The ICC subsidizes the exploration and survey of new systems - typically, 50% of a “run” comes from the ICC general fund, and the other 50% from the particular member corporation hoping to develop that system (and having first rights to do so), and provides for the pay of Scout contractors. The Scouts themselves get a chance at a vessel they could never afford otherwise, a guaranteed paycheck, and, most importantly, the freedom to live on their own general terms.

Thus, while there is no Scout “service” or ranks, they exist more as a generalized “co-op” of contractors working in different regions. As such, there is a relative balance between the UEA, ICC and Scouts - each needing what the other provides, and with no real incentive to rock the boat. The UEA gains intelligence and information on new worlds, at a reduced cost. The corporations diversify their risk in exploration and development. The Scouts as a collective have more bargaining power to ensure fair treatment by the UEA and ICC.

With the spread of humanity throughout The Fringe, this has led to the familiar sight of a scout ship parked on some colony world, refueling before heading into the void once more. To the “jack-of-all-trades” crew, from varied worlds and backgrounds, the only common factor the cliched leather jacket with patches or painted artwork unique to each vessel. To that certain percentage of young people gazing towards the stars, waiting to satisfy that itch deep inside that calls them to something beyond….
 
Back
Top