Using D20 modern for T20: The classes

[mike wightman]

And a fine project it is too

I think the D20M/F rules have a lot of good ideas in them for a T20 game. You've done a great job integrating the two.

I'll move the classless bit to its own thread.

 

[Kevin Livingston]

Tjoneslo,
Have you come up with talent trees for the Scholarly and Socalite Attribute classes? All our gaming group did for SOC is that one would apply the SOC Ability Modifier to one's Reputation and Wealth Check.

 

[Kevin Livingston]

Is this post dead?
I would hate to think so after things got so interesting.

 

[tjoneslo]

Nope. I'm just not very good about responding to these forums. It's the reason I dislike web fora.

The Scholarly hero I took a whole bunch of Smart Hero talent trees (including some alternates) and split them between the two classes.

For the Socalite I took some alternate Charismatic Hero talent trees and gave them over.

I really need to work through the social mechanic rules in D20 Modern, which I will need to extend, to come up with a good set of talent trees for both the Charasmatic and Socalites.

 

[TKalbfus]

I look forward to D20 Past coming out, it has weapons that can be used in Traveller T20. AS for the comparision between D20 Future and Traveller T20, T20 wins hands down. I'm not terribly fond of a starship combat system that has starships "walking" around space like characters, and how many times have you ever heard of a spaceship being caught "Flat-Footed" I never even knew they had feet. T20 has acceleration and it has vehicle and spaceship construction rules, D20 Future does not.

 

[tjoneslo]

That was the other half of the rules set I needed to think over. A great many of the feats, talent trees and class features relate to combat. And the T20/D20 modern rules need to encompass more than just the "stabity, stab, stab" style of combat.

 

[clementk]

Offhand aren't d20 Modern classes different enough from T20 in BAB, skill point, and number of feats progression from T20 classes that they'd need some work on that as well? I believe T20 is lower across the board in those areas. That was my understanding the last time I checked d20 Modern.

For d20 Modern goodies I recommend taking a look here:
http://www.thegamemechanics.com/
for pdf versions of expansions written by some of the d20 Modern authors. For example they flesh out starting occupations and advanced classes which might be helpful for ideas if nothing else. Some freebies also. Print versions are done by Green Ronin.

Hmmm they're working on a Future Player's Companion...

 

[tjoneslo]

At the top of my RPGNow wishlist are:

Blue Rose, Hot Pursuit, Modern Players Companion Book 1, and perhaps Dying Earth

Any other suggestions of places to borrow ideas from?

 

[TKalbfus]

Also in T20 you have to wear Armor in order to get your AC/Defense up, in D20 Modern/Future its a function of class level. If you are going to have a high level game in Traveller, expect alot of characters clunking around in powered battlesuits. PCs are going to want to wear those battlesuits all the time and perhaps even sleep in them lest someone mounts a surprise attack while their sleeping. These battlesuits probably weigh a ton. They make the floor creak as the walk through shopping malls looking for new equipment to buy. When they step into a hotel to get a room for the night, these clunking mechanical suits will certainly turn some heads.

 

[lightsenshi]

Having actually had a chance to look at d20 modern for the first time, I am more of the opinion than before that attempting to use d20 modern is "a bad thing".

 

[Malenfant]

PCs are going to want to wear those battlesuits all the time and perhaps even sleep in them lest someone mounts a surprise attack while their sleeping.

They would if they're stupid. Plus it's unlikely that they'd be able to get them anyway.

 

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by lightsenshi:
Having actually had a chance to look at d20 modern for the first time, I am more of the opinion than before that attempting to use d20 modern is "a bad thing".

Any particular reason? Or do you just have an irrational dislike of d20 that you don't want to explain?

 

[lightsenshi]

Originally posted by Malenfant:
Any particular reason? Or do you just have an irrational dislike of d20 that you don't want to explain?

You need a reason to dislike d20? ^_^

It has to do with d20 modern being too generic for my taste.

 

[Malenfant]

Originally posted by lightsenshi:
You need a reason to dislike d20? ^_^

I used to dislike it. Then I played it (with a good DM - that makes all the difference) and now I think it's a fairly decent system. I think d20M fixes a lot of flaws in the D&D3e implementation of d20 too.

It has to do with d20 modern being too generic for my taste. [/QB]

How so? Sure, it has classes based on stats at first, but then you can switch to specific career-type classes if you want. But it allows you at least to define your character any way you want by crossclassing between the stat classes. You can then just say "Ok, my Smart 3/Tough 4/Agile 2 character is really a Scout".

 

[lightsenshi]

(But then again, I'm also extremely opinionated and very stubborn.)

 

[tjoneslo]

Originally posted by lightsenshi:
It has to do with d20 modern being too generic for my taste.

I agree with Malenfant here. A lot of people who just review D20 modern claim it is D&D pounded into a more generic system. This is true, but if you are not playing D&D, it works a whole lot better. Mostly it's removing the assumptions that you are playing in a pseuo-mideval time period, which changes a number of rules in subtle ways.

I won't say D20 modern/future gets everything right, but it does a better job the trying to adapt straight D&D.

 

[solomoncane]

If you like the d20M class structure but are put off by loads of advanced & prestige classes, I would check out Grim Tales. It expands the six basic d20M classes to 20 levels each. No other classes are needed. If you want something new, design a talent tree to simulate new class abilities and make it an option for the appropriate base class. Very few characters develop alike.

It also has parameters for past, present, and future settings and a nifty firearms design sequence, among other things.

 

[Kirth]

Originally posted by solomoncane:
If you like the d20M class structure but are put off by loads of advanced & prestige classes, I would check out Grim Tales. It expands the six basic d20M classes to 20 levels each. No other classes are needed. If you want something new, design a talent tree to simulate new class abilities and make it an option for the appropriate base class. Very few characters develop alike.

It also has parameters for past, present, and future settings and a nifty firearms design sequence, among other things.

I haven't looked at this thread in awhile, but that might be a good suggestion solomoncane. I'll check out Grim Tales

 

[Psion]

Cool. Thanks for the bump -- I missed this sequence of threads.

I have always thought that D20 Future's class selection was a little weak, and think adding Traveller-like advanced classes is just the ticket to patch up the ailing system... and adding the physical conflict style classes that T20 is a bit weak on.

Not so sure about expanding the base classes aroud the new ability scores. I'm not seing the concepts of intelligent/scholarly heroes and charismatic/socialites being different enough from one another to justify a functional class difference.

 

[Kirth]

Originally posted by Psion:
Cool. Thanks for the bump -- I missed this sequence of threads.

I have always thought that D20 Future's class selection was a little weak, and think adding Traveller-like advanced classes is just the ticket to patch up the ailing system... and adding the physical conflict style classes that T20 is a bit weak on.

Not so sure about expanding the base classes aroud the new ability scores. I'm not seing the concepts of intelligent/scholarly heroes and charismatic/socialites being different enough from one another to justify a functional class difference.

I agree.