Virus

[Whipsnade]

MJD explained:

"My great concern when embarking upon this project was that it would drown in a debate on why Virus works, how it works, what its effects were etc."


Sir,

That is something you were very wise to fear.

"It's a big job and some of the decisions won't please everyone. I can only hope that the end result is good enough that it's acceptable."

It is a huge job and I feel certain that your ideas will please enough people to create a concensus.

"But: 1248 is not about Virus."

I am sorry, but that statement is both profoundly true and profoundly untrue. Your treatment of Virus and the Empress Wave will determine whether or not the rest of M:1248 is accepted. If the solutions to both those questions are perceived - please note I said perceived - to be nothing more than another set of editorial fait accomplis, then M:1248 will fail.

You could write the most splendid history of 'the reconstruction of interstellar civilization', it could be full of selfless sacrifices and awesome challenges. From the few tidbits released concerning M:1248, you have indeed written just that. But...

If Virus and the Empress Wave are resolved in a manner that is perceived as just another rabbit from the editorial hat, M:1248 is lost.

To put it bluntly, Dave Nilsen left two turds in the Traveller punchbowl; Virus and the Empress Wave. They were put there as deus ex machinas and the Hobby wants them 'removed'. However, they cannot be removed in the same fashion they were placed there - another deus ex machina will not work.

"Virus is one small facet of this environment. One that I would prefer not to have been saddled with, to tell the truth. But it's in there and we have to do something about it."

Very few of us wanted it there. You're the one willing enough, talented enough, and brave enough to tackle it. How you do so will determine whether you succeed or not.

"The bottom line here is, 1248 is not a volume about Virus. There is a treatment of Virus in there that you can take or leave at your pleasure. But understand that 1248 is more than that."

Yes, Virus and the Empress Wave are only a small part of M:1248. Sadly, they are also the only parts that count. Virus and the Wave will control M:1248's success. If you write a so-so history of 1130-1248 with a knock-out treatment of Virus and the Wave, M:1248 will succeed fantastically. If you write a knock-out history of 1130-1248 and a disappointing treatment of Virus and the Wave, M:1248 will join BtC in the dustbin. They both will not belong there, but they'll end up there all the same.

I'm sorry, it sucks, but it is also true.


Sincerely,
Larsen

 

[Elliot]

I like the C17th feel - its a major part of my life - but in Traveller I like it in terms CT and the ways nobles work (which is why i'm sure GURPS Traveller with its flippant mathmo post-college war gamer style will utterly cock uo the nobles book). I like TNE but not for the nobles but for the new beginning, brave new world out there sort of style.

thats why Virus and EW and those star viking T2K GI types have to be reduced.

That seems to be happening so

 

[MJD]

I have to agree about the turds in the puncbhbowl..

 

[Erik Boielle]

Can ye nay find even a little love in your heart?

If nothing else, Virus provides an excuse to have some cool insane AI badies.

How exactly it works is more of internet to forumites than players (I think - it could slip unnoticed in amongst the less tightly plotted elements of most of the games I've been in.)

But, like, I'm a forumite and you know where I stand.

And The Slider to Cheaptalk, Cheaktalk Go Vikings I still like.

I obviously didn't approve of the politics in Space Viking - it belongs to a genre of scifi books whos thesis is that all the problems of the universe can be solved by finding the right crowd and having mercenaries fire ack-ack guns in to it.

Not that I really minded that - your noble has his place in daydreaming.

But TNE had the star vikings whos anti imperial sentiment appealed to the one in me who was appalled by the mass hysteria that followed Diana Spencer's death in a car crash.

Plus, I understand that the Royal Navy became a world dominating force when reorganised in to something resembling a meritocracy.

Their I dont care who made died and made you immortal attitude I'm only going to explain this one more time attitude really reminded me of the totally self confident, aggressive and damn cool way that Jack Aubery goes to work on his prey.

Yknow. Cause I wish I was like that. And since they were there, and active, I might miss them if they went.

Plus I like the balance that could exist between the 4thI and the RC.

The RC decided to expand quickly, reclaiming the wilds before the became fixed in unpleasant ways.

This meant using force to speed up the process.

They also chose democracy and a loose federal structure.

As such, they now suffer from constant internal wrangling over every decision, institutional aggression and having to support a large population of less than optimal industrial efficiency.

The 4thI on the other hand, chose slow careful expansion, taking in only those worlds that had something to give and who wanted to join.

They also chose an Emperor and a centrist structure.

As a result, while it is a much leaner state the wilds around them are in very bad shape and the population has to put up with more rigid controls.

Its freedom from want versus the freedom to do what you want!

Its Democracy Vs. the Benevolent Dictatorship!

Such differing outlooks mean that these two nations, equal but different, facing each other across the ruins of the Imperium couldn't help but compete in all things, issues of human solidarity aside.

And from conflict flows the Story.

--

Its also TNE vs. CT, which is another balance I like.

-Erik

Who is marked a Space Viking by his shaggy hair, cut long to provide additional padding under a combat helmet.

 

[Whipsnade]

Erik Boielle wrote:

"The 4thI on the other hand,..."


Mr. Boielle,

Please do not discuss ANY M:1248 playtest materials on the open forums here.

The playtest materials are subscription-only; a QLI policy that I happen to firmly agree with by the way, and any leak of playtest information could be detrimental to the product the playtest is developing and/or sales of that product.

Only the author of the playtest materials; Mr. Dougherty, can choose what or what not to share with non-subscribers and when to share it.


Sincerely,
Larsen

P.S. I am not a playtest subscriber - yet.

 

[kafka47]

I have an idea, why don't Mr. Whipsnade and MJD get together to collaborate on the M:1248. As I enjoy MJD's historical analysis and grand epic that he is planning for the years ahead.

Whereas, Mr. Whipsnade's strengths (amongst many other talents above board and hidden) has been his unquestioned technical analysis probing the New Era into areas that I had long thought quadmires that swollowed sentients whole.

 

[Erik Boielle]

Pah!

Most of that is aleady in the public domain.

At

http://www.travellerrpg.com/cgi-bin/Trav/CotI/Discuss/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=28;t=000137

And its heavily spun and, Ahem, adapted to suit my needs anyway.

 

[kaladorn]

Hate to do it, but I have to disagree with one thing MJD said: That the Virus is a small part of 1248.

Like Larsen said (no I am not his dumber evil twin), 1248's success will depend a lot on the treatment of the Virus and the Empress Wave. And by a lot, I mean a that a treatment of them that hangs together poorly or seems like a hand of god (what's with the whole latin thing anyway...?!) style solution, then it almost won't matter how much other good or cool work you have.

Look at it this way, game history is a tapestry. Right now is has some huge runs in it, loose threads that can unravel the whole of it if you pull them. You need to tie those down in an attractive way so as not to destroy the tapestry or encourage picking at them.

The Virus might be small in one sense, but it had a lot to do with the final destruction of the 3I that most of us came to know and love and CT and to fight for in MT. (I won't speak to TNE.... enough of those heretics around anyway! *grin). Lucan and Dulinor and the others had a hand - but they've mostly paid by having their ambitions quashed so there isn't exactly a sense of rightness, but there is some balance. The Virus, on the other hand, was just a big black wave of destruction upon which there is no avenging oneself, no mental shield against the dismal prospects for living with it... at least to date.

If M:1248 can offer some convincing hope for living with the Virus and maybe putting it to bed for all time, or perhaps just learning to cope with it and thus making it less a 'Dragon' and more of a 'slightly oversize Iguana', then M:1248 will probably do just fine, all other things being equal. If it fails to provide a sufficient treatment, I have to agree with Larsen - it won't fare terribly well, fairly or unfairly.

 

[Erik Boielle]

Does it matter that the Virus is as much a victim as anyone else?

It didn't choose to be made in to suicidal, insane instruments of destruction.

It was forced in to being such.

Just think of all the Viral Entities that must have lived short painful lives and died long painful deaths during the collapse and after.

Virus has suffered just as much as Humanity, and the men who casued its change and release are long dead.

Now comes truth, reconciliation, and the future.

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by Erik Boielle:
Does it matter that the Virus is as much a victim as anyone else?

It didn't choose to be made in to suicidal, insane instruments of destruction.

It was forced in to being such.

and, as presented in TNE, is Science Fantasy, not Science Fiction... or is making some REALLY big and acanonical assumptions about AI, Imperial Technology, and the spread of the SDG chips beyond just transponders in so short a few years.

If not handled well, the Empress wave will take it even further into the Sci-Fan category.

 

[Erik Boielle]

Well shit man, the maps 2D as well.

Don't point it out and maybe no one will notice.

 

[flykiller]

Yes, Virus and the Empress Wave are only a small part of M:1248. Sadly, they are also the only parts that count. Virus and the Wave will control M:1248's success.

seems to me that what counts is a good ref and a few players with good attitudes.

 

[TheEngineer]

Hi !

Originally posted by Aramis:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Erik Boielle:
Does it matter that the Virus is as much a victim as anyone else?

It didn't choose to be made in to suicidal, insane instruments of destruction.

It was forced in to being such.

and, as presented in TNE, is Science Fantasy, not Science Fiction... or is making some REALLY big and acanonical assumptions about AI, Imperial Technology, and the spread of the SDG chips beyond just transponders in so short a few years.

If not handled well, the Empress wave will take it even further into the Sci-Fan category. </font>[/QUOTE]Aramis, could You explain the Your destinction between fiction and fantasy ?
At least, both is fiction, isn´t it ?

Or is there a problem with AIs at all ?

Regards,

Mert

 

[Flynn]

If I might voice my personal opinion here, I am a part of the playtest, and have read the history to date. I am suitably impressed with the way that Virus has been handled, bringing it from an over-powered handwave back to the level of a solid threat among many. TNE 1248 makes significant strides towards capturing the best elements of TNE with those of CT, and presenting a diverse milieu where one can play with the flavor of either of these two previous milieus, as fits the needs of the gaming group.

The story of Virus and humaniti's interaction with it is quite epic... it has to be, to deal with the epic nature of Virus as was handed to us ten years ago. But the end result was to bring Virus to a point where you can have it epic in your area of play, if you want to, or have it as an occasional threat, if you'd rather reduce its presence. MT took away stability, TNE took away most options, and TNE 1248 promises to give both back. IMO, YMMV, of course.

Now, I must admit I'm curious as to the Empress Wave, but we'll see that when the Referee's section becomes available.

My two creds,
Flynn

 

[aramis]

Originally posted by TheEngineer:
Hi !

Virus: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Aramis:
and, as presented in TNE, is Science Fantasy, not Science Fiction... or is making some REALLY big and acanonical assumptions about AI, Imperial Technology, and the spread of the SDG chips beyond just transponders in so short a few years.

If not handled well, the Empress wave will take it even further into the Sci-Fan category.

Aramis, could You explain the Your destinction between fiction and fantasy ?
At least, both is fiction, isn´t it ?

Or is there a problem with AIs at all ?

Regards,

Mert </font>[/QUOTE]Science-Fiction: A form of fiction which operates in a setting that is present to futuristic or detatched from our timeline, with a very few fantastic elements, (usually ones which are forseable under current science but not yet proven,) but those element operate in a logical and realistic manner, and the basic realism is maintained. If future-set, reasonable extrapolations of current technology are NOT fantastic elements.

Science-Fantasy: modern , future or alternate universe/timline/world setting Fiction which: uses many fantastic elements; uses fantastic elements in incongrous or incmprehensible ways; has assumptions which are not based upon reasonable extrapolation of science nor other reasonable extrapolations already in the setting; and/or fails to connect the fantastic elements to the settiing in terms of their impact upon the setting.

these are the definitions I got in English Lit.

Note that Science Fiction and Science Fantasy are subsets of fantasy, but in popular culture they are almost interchangeable with each other, but not with fantasy.

Star Trek runs the ragged edge.
Star Wars is pure Sci-Fan. (lots of items not based upon examining the extant science. Lots of incongrous or incompletely thought out paradigms of technology. Setting based upon many unrelated and inexplicable fantastic elements.)
Bab-5 and Space Above and Beyond are both sci-fi, not sci-fan.
Tekumel is sci-fan; it is a logical extrapolation alternate world, with one basic change: magic works, and has since thee dawn of history.
Judge Dredd is Sci-Fan: it has numerous poorly integrated fantastic elements.
Starship Troopers, the Book: Sci-Fi.
Starship Troopers, the movie: Sci-Fan. (You don't run around nuclear battlefields with your helmet off....)
Pern could be argued as either... the fantastic elements of Pern are few: telepathy, genetic enhancement, Thread, and FTL travel. Thread is a hard chunk to swallow, but it is well thought out and well integrated.

Pre TNE, the fantastic traveller elements were: Jump Drive, Psionics, Gravitics, the Ancients. (The Aslan, Vargr, Solomani, and Vilani are outgrowths and logical follow-ons from the ancients.)

Adv 12 could be argued to have added pocket dimensions, but that is actually logically extrapolated from current dimentional theory and topology, as well as Traveller's Jump Drives and/or Psionics.

Anagathics are NOT fantastic, merely a logical progression of current life-prolonging technology. Anagathics ala TNE are somewhat more fantastic, but not so far as to push over the line.

Virus is a fantasy element because it is not explained how it could rewrite a hardware device into an ai capable chip (which in pre-TNE canon, the only imperial AI chips are the symbeline ones, and that is due to being lifeforms hybridized with imperial technology. The Cymbeline chips themselves are Sci-Fi: AI is currently though possible in specially capable hardware.) and could do so remotely using ONLY data connections, rather than code connections. This is unreasonable because
(A) with as many computers there are in the OTU, at leaast one hacker would have used the same back door and gotten caught...
(B) there is no evidence in canon that the computer systems are made of self-reconfigurable processor elements, and limited evidence of synaptic processing,
(C) previous canon has almost inexplicably large computers, and were STILL incapable of true AI.
(D) the research center chosen was not capable of true AI, so how could they reasonably "Lobotomize" the cymbeline chips to be tranponders
(E) Why would an always-on Transponder be attached to the main computer? And even if it was, for monitoring of its health, since the unit is sealed, how would the chips escape or change the code of the main computer?

The Empress wave was probably related to, and an extrapolation of, psionics. Psionics is the only platantly "Pure Fantasy" element of pre-TNE traveller, but it is a staple of the science fiction Genre anyway, as a significant proportion of people believe that psionics OF SOME FORM are possible. (In fact, there has been one successfull and replicated experiment in psionics by credible scientists with adequate peer review: Focussed will can cause a shift of a significant amount in random number generator output.) So, if we can affect random number generation by a CPU, we probably could, with sufficient training, and possibly chemical or genetic enhancement, do more impressive stuff.

Anyway, Dave never explained the Empress wave, and we don't know anything about how or why it works, nor was dave willing to let the cat out of the bag. I don't think he cared. It was a fantasy explanation for Zhodani nobles going insane (it could have just as easily been done with a virus that tweaked the psionic center of the brain...) so that horde of refugees would flood the marches and justify Norris' and his heirs' "Democratic Reforms".

That Dave chose to destroy the preserve set aside for play in "The 3rd Imperium during the Virus era" was spiteful, but neither fantastic nor relevant.

The problem is that traveller always was pushed pre-tne as science fiction, and specifically as nearly the best at being "realistic"; its fantasy elements were well thought out, clearly explained, and the only one not common throughout sci-fi are the ancients.

TNE used those fantasy elements it added to nearly detroy the link to the setting elements of prior editions. It also broke player trust when Dave decided to democratize the regency, eliminate nobles, and such. But that has little to do with Sci-Fi vs Sci-Fan.

TNE did try to do away with one of the setting's key fantasy elements: gravitics. But it did so only in part, and in response to some (then current) NASA research... oon gravity interruption.

CT never explained HOW the constant thrust drives worked... MT did. But MT did so in a way consistant with other gravitics related material in the setting.

 

[Malenfant]

The problem is that traveller always was pushed pre-tne as science fiction, and specifically as nearly the best at being "realistic"; its fantasy elements were well thought out, clearly explained, and the only one not common throughout sci-fi are the ancients.

Yes, there are a few things in TNE that aren't hard sf (like the Cymbeline chips - but those are holdovers from CT, which you class as sci-fi). There's also nothing particularly 'fantastic' about the Empress Wave - it's a spatial/psi phenomenon that nobody really understands, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's poorly thought out.

But I don't remotely see how TNE is 'science fantasy'. Have you taken a look at FF&S lately? That made a hell of a lot more effort to explain the technology and science in Traveller than CT ever did, and it was pretty coherent and consistent too.

TNE used those fantasy elements it added to nearly detroy the link to the setting elements of prior editions. It also broke player trust when Dave decided to democratize the regency, eliminate nobles, and such. But that has little to do with Sci-Fi vs Sci-Fan.

Well, heaven forbid that a setting should change at all . But I guess in your eyes it's more reasonable that there should be a part of the 3I that is completely, utterly unaffected by all the effects of the Rebellion and the Collapse and still carry on exactly as it did before? That'd just daft, IMO - nobody's going to get through the Collapse era unscathed.

If you'd rather there was this happy shiny pocket of CT-ness in there just for the convenience of the players who were dumb enough to expect to carry on just the same as they did before in TNE (despite the whopping great obvious buildup to oncoming wholesale change throughout the Rebellion and Hard Times books), then that's definitely pushing the boundaries of believability further than anything you've been complaining about.

Also, you're assigning words like 'spiteful' and 'breaking player trust' where there's no evidence at all that this was the intention. It's one thing not to like TNE, but it's another to start spouting on with that sort of nonsense.

 

[TheEngineer]

Hi Aramis,

thanks for these explanations..

Originally posted by Aramis:
...
Virus is a fantasy element because it is not explained how it could rewrite a hardware device into an ai capable chip (which in pre-TNE canon, the only imperial AI chips are the symbeline ones, and that is due to being lifeforms hybridized with imperial technology. The Cymbeline chips themselves are Sci-Fi: AI is currently though possible in specially capable hardware.) and could do so remotely using ONLY data connections, rather than code connections. This is unreasonable because
(A) with as many computers there are in the OTU, at leaast one hacker would have used the same back door and gotten caught...
(B) there is no evidence in canon that the computer systems are made of self-reconfigurable processor elements, and limited evidence of synaptic processing,
(C) previous canon has almost inexplicably large computers, and were STILL incapable of true AI.
(D) the research center chosen was not capable of true AI, so how could they reasonably "Lobotomize" the cymbeline chips to be tranponders
(E) Why would an always-on Transponder be attached to the main computer? And even if it was, for monitoring of its health, since the unit is sealed, how would the chips escape or change the code of the main computer?

O.k. Traveller was always some kind of conservative regarding computer stuff.
At least, I am quite glad that nobody tried to write down how hardware rewriting might work for virus 20 years ago

So we got some space to flesh out that topic ourself.

The key to the thing we want to describe are actually FPGAs (Field Programmable Gate Arrays - not Fusion-Plasma-Gun-Advanced ).
These kind of gate arrays can be reconfigured, resulting in piece of hardware, which might perform of completly different classical, even complex ICs.
So its possible to reconfigure hardware just today.
On the other hand, we have got a rapidly increasing amount of computer stuff in nearly
every thing we use (e.g. actual BMW automobils contain over 250 computer controlled subsystems containing an awful bunch of code)

Lets extrapolate this into NEAR future:
The same advanced FPGA may be capabel of reconfiguring to - lets say an AMD Hyplon 50 Ghz or into a Macintosh P64 - 80 GHz in a matter of a millisecond.
What we might experience then, is a even stronger merge between hard- and software than today.

And we have to extrapolate a few thousend years of IT !

So, regarding
(A) there are many computer system on our real world and hacking still happens every second. Hacking and possibilites to hack some system will increase with systems complexity and reconfigurable chips will provide even more complexity.
(B) there is even no evidence that these systems are not used
(C) because the special way to configure AI-capable hardware and to write appropriate software is still not a controlled process.
Al least we already got something AI-like in the Kinunir-adventure.
(D) good question - I have to think about that a bit.
Well, for mw it was always far more easy to modify a larger bunch of software than to write it on my own. From the engineering point of view its a standard procedure to modify a complex technical - even if you dont understand it completely - in order to achieve a special functional effect.
(E) another good one
Perhaps it isnt attached normally. It could just have the capability to be connected.
Perhaps the transponder system imitates another ship system, backup system, maintainance tools or whatever, which is allowed to change code or configurations, in order to connect itself.
If a lobotomized AI fits into a transponder, it may still have access to a vast amount of data previous virus generation gathered in their lifetime and incorporated in its configuration/software.

In summary and from a technical point of view I really would regard Virus and AI stuff as the most possible thing in the TU, perhaps just after fusion power plants but long before jumpspace, gravitics, thrusters etc.

In contrast to psionics. Here I am highly sceptical and its in fact the thing in the TU that I dislike the most. OTOH if its not stressed too much or if it concentrates on telepathy I can live with it. E.g. I really like the way its incorporated in Babylon 5.

I hope the most I have written so far is understandable, as sometimes there is a kind of lack in my vocabulary

Really like this topic

Best regards,

Mert

 

[mad13142000]

O.k. Traveller was always some kind of conservative regarding computer stuff...

wow...what an understatement.
I've got a PDA that has more power than the 1 dton MK I computer in the ol' Beowulf Free Trader....
Some of us nerds read all about AI and programmable chips and how neural nets develop and all that...Most of the problem is that even in a universe that has Psionics, how do you have a physical beign write its existance onto another physical space over a transmission... be it light or radio or whatever. Virus has many problems, and personally, I always viewed it as the GDW crew trying for The Butlerian Jihad times but missing by a mile...Rape and destroy the setting using that magical high tech against the foolish humaniti - a common Sci-Fi theme...But instead of having a huge final battle, and everyone living with a healthy fear of AI (until the big worm comes along), we got Virus.
I think MJD is doing a mighty fine job trying to move the setting past the 2 big albatrosses lying dead on the road. Yeah, his explanations won't make everyone happy, but it's DN's fault, not MJD's...
I'm not saying how I think Virus works...I don't really care - the only way the game moves foward in this timeline is to accept Virus exists and move foward...So the world has gnomes, or the universe has Virus, or the game uses 12 kinds of dice - they all have faults, even real life sucks...
I just want all the 'kill everything and wipe the slate clean' to be over with so we can travel and trade and explore once more without our ships being blasted away in the first scene of an adventure cause we got zapped by endless swarms of vampire fleets and virus and whetever else...I can handle an encounter - pirate, Vampire, new system...an encounter is just that. When you put my ship in the middle of endless war and destruction, THAT'S when I get testy...I still have 21 payments to make...
-MADDog

 

[mike wightman]

I just want all the 'kill everything and wipe the slate clean' to be over with so we can travel and trade and explore once more without our ships being blasted away in the first scene of an adventure cause we got zapped by endless swarms of vampire fleets and virus and whetever else...I can handle an encounter - pirate, Vampire, new system...an encounter is just that. When you put my ship in the middle of endless war and destruction, THAT'S when I get testy...I still have 21 payments to make...

Well said sir, and having read the playtest material MJD is well on the way to building a setting that will allow all that and more

.
Back to Virus.
By having this discussion, and the one over on the Terrans thread, in a civilised manner then a playable version of Virus and its intelligent machine descendents can be arrived at which will upset the fewest people. Psionic Virus versus technological Virus or some fudge in between I no longer care because I know how I will do it, but it will ignite further debate on this and other Traveller forums, have no fear about that.

Yeah, his explanations won't make everyone happy, but it's DN's fault, not MJD's...

I understand the sentiment but it is MJD's responibility, and all those who actively join in the playtest and lend support, to put these issues to bed once and for all and (IMHO) "the Ancients did it" or "it's psionic" are cop out answers in Traveller.

Then consider the Empress wave. Nearly everyone has agreed it must be psionic. So we are to accept a psionic virus entity and the psionic Empress wave? Why not have Grandfather wake up in the shower and say "oops it's all my fault, they're my old experiments" and then he waves his TL30 magic wand and fixes everything

.(This is a joke, I thought I'd better spell that out just in case!)

What a twist it would be if Virus is a psionic energy being (Vorlons, anyone?) and the Empress Wave has a technological explanation

 

[TheEngineer]

Originally posted by MADDog:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> O.k. Traveller was always some kind of conservative regarding computer stuff...

wow...what an understatement.
I've got a PDA that has more power than the 1 dton MK I computer in the ol' Beowulf Free Trader....
...
When you put my ship in the middle of endless war and destruction, THAT'S when I get testy...I still have 21 payments to make...
-MADDog </font>[/QUOTE]Hi furry One !

Uhh, computer stuff.
Guess the power of a PDA depends on what you want to do with it.
You might put a few 100 PDAs together, but you might not be able to control avionics of a passenger plane or a large civilian power plant.
E.g. if You put together all computer related stuff in a power plant your are likely to have more volume togather more than a family home

So, in order to make myself happy I consider Starship computers not to be a large personal computer but a very specialiced thing to enable starship operations and control.
Perhaps you can also play minesweeper with it, but Im not sure

Regarding the other part of the quote:
That really hits the point for me.
Rebellion, Hardtimes and also TNE do not present a setting where my players and I really would like to be in order to set up a TRAVELLER campaign. Who wants to travel or to trade in a devasted area without any stablity at all ?
Just ask Yourself as a real person. Would You like to be beamed into this kind of reality ?
Shudder !

Except you want to concentrate on playing "military" Traveller, but thats really not everybodies taste.
At least the game is called Traveller and not Command and Conquer.

I really hope authors take this into consideration.

Regards,

Mert