• Welcome to the new COTI server. We've moved the Citizens to a new server. Please let us know in the COTI Website issue forum if you find any problems.

Aslan Bases

OK, I'll take the bait on one point: J2 ships crossing the J-5 passage. Let me put it this way: Forget the Solomani. Forget the humans. Let's just look at the Aslan. The Aslan tech has historically always been at best the equal of human tech; at worst behind human tech. So, if the humans have a max of J2, then the Aslan have a max of J2. How do the Aslan make it across a J-5 gap when they only have J2?

If you answer that question, then you have your answer on how anyone does it.
 
How do the Aslan make it across a J-5 gap when they only have J2?
By building specialized starships specifically designed with the fuel fraction capacity needed to do that.

Solomani don't build their starships with 5 parsecs of range as a design/construction requirement most of the time (indeed, I would be hard pressed to think of ANY circumstances under which they would). The Solomani wouldn't be needing to traverse the Great Rift or the Lesser Rift as a matter of routine operations FROM TERRA.

2 parsec range, even on Jump-1 starships ... fine, no problem, that I can easily believe.
5 parsec range, on Jump-2 starships ... TOTALLY NON-STANDARD.

And remember, you're talking about what are functionally "refugees" departing from Terra "forever" under circumstances that aren't necessarily of their choosing (if they were losers of a war like you said). That means that they would need to Load Up And Leave™ using whatever starships already existed that they could get their hands on to make the journey. Point being, they didn't have a decade to play Naval Architect™ and build their ideal colony transports for their fleet (cue Battlestar Galactica theme played by the Los Angeles Philharmonic). They would have been using "survivor" ships that their faction controlled prior to the conflict (that they lost) and/or surplus starships of a variety of makes and models and tried to cram everyone (and everything) they could reasonably carry in them to begin their voyage.

In other words, it wouldn't have been a TCS type situation where the Sword Worlders get to pick and choose what they want to build and use for the task of getting them all the way out to the Spinward Marches. Instead, it would have been a relative scramble to "get gone" before the Guys With Guns showed up to start making "examples" of people who didn't comply.

The Sword Worlders "retreated" from Terra to Gram ... in whatever starships they could scrounge up for the journey.
I think I'm standing on pretty firm ground that next to NONE of those Solomani designed starships they could acquire on short notice would have been capable of a 5 parsec range through deep space without access to a fuel supply.



Unless you're trying to impute/imply that the Solomani Sword Worlders got to the Great Rift ... TRADED ALL of their starships to an Aslan clan that EXCHANGED those Solomani ships for Aslan designed starships capable of crossing the Great Rift ... and allowed the Sword Worlders to KEEP all of those Aslan designed starships after crossing the Great Rift so the Sword Worlders would be capable of reaching the Spinward Marches sector through the Trojan Reach sector from the Riftspan Reaches sector. Kind of makes you wonder what the Sword Worlders would have needed to "give up" in order to make such a trade for it to be acceptable to the Wahtoi clan controlling the Ku Su'ikh corporation with a monopoly on the J-5 Trade Route through the Riftspan Reaches in the -420 to -399 year time frame.

Did they surrender a significant fraction of their surviving population (and their possessions) to the Aslan as vassals/slaves in order to make the trade to continue their journey with the remainder? Did the survivors who continued to Gram ever regret their decision to ask/make such a sacrifice of their own people to the alien Aslan (during the Aslan Border Wars, I'll remind you)? Was there a conspiracy among the leadership to help make the survivors "forget" their former friends/neighbors/relatives who had to be left behind before the convoy could traverse the Great Rift?
 
They risked their lives (and ships) and fought for someone (forgot who). Eventually someone (I think the Wahtoi) owed them big time, which let them get through.

For crossing, they did buy some Asian ships. GT:SW doesn't go into detail on how they made the crossing, just that they did. Probably used a combination of paid-for calibration points and external jump tanks for the ships they needed to keep. Who knows, they might have made refits, too. But I don't know and the point was glossed over. However their main ship was supposed to have made multiple trips (but never made it back from its last trip).

Regardless, the specifics of making the J-5 leap wasn't directly addressed.
 
This is a popular misconception. To cross the jump 5 route you do not need a jump 5 ship, you just need to be carrying 50% of your ship as fuel, this could be drop tanks and internal.

The MgT has a pretty good supplement that covers crossing the great rift in great detail...
 
This is a popular misconception. To cross the jump 5 route you do not need a jump 5 ship, you just need to be carrying 50% of your ship as fuel, this could be drop tanks and internal.
{ polite cough }

I know that.
Links to proof of my statement of knowing this ... 1 ... 2 ... 3 ... 4 ...

The difficulty comes in when you realize that 2+2+1=5 when you're limited to Jump-2 and that there is a real problem with getting to 50% fuel fraction when starting with 20% as your default baseline starship design while your cargo hold is already full of stuff that a lot of fleeing refugees have brought with them.

At best ... in the absolute best possible case scenario ... what needs to happen is reducing the cargo capacity in exchange for a +10% internal fuel fraction (1 parsec of range) ... AND ... fitting the starships for a +20% external fuel fraction via L-Hyd Drop Tanks.

The procedure then becomes:
  1. Jump-2 using L-Hyd Drop Tanks (which are dropped prior to jump and can be reused after drop) at the beginning.
  2. Jump-2 using natively designed internal fuel tankage of a Jump-2 Solomani starship design.
  3. Jump-1 using cargo space converted to fuel capacity (probably via collapsible fuel tanks in the cargo hold).
The problem with that plan is ... not every mainworld is capable of constructing L-Hyd Drop Tanks. Even in 1105, some of the starports along the J-5 Trade Route are type C at critical locations where you would need to obtain fresh L-Hyd Drop Tank capacity in order to make it across the 4-5 parsec gap to the next star system.

Those L-Hyd Drop Tanks are not going to be available "for free" or just because you pull one of these moves with your ship's pet:

tumblr_ms9e7nMzs11qa6n77o1_500.gif


So the ONLY WAY for a Solomani Jump-2 starship design to cross the Great Rift is with A LOT of helpful cooperation from the Wahtoi clan controlling the Ku Su'ikh corporation at the time. There are no other options or possibilities. Additionally, flying off into Aslan space "on a hope and a prayer" that such cooperation will be forthcoming and can be secured ... later ... once you arrive (and start begging) ... is just foolish All In™ planning that simply beggars belief (especially during the Aslan Border Wars period of history). It's the equivalent of trying to WALK from England to France ... with "a little bit of swimming needed" along the way through the English Channel between the two land masses. You don't start that kind of a journey without a plan for how you're going to survive the swimming part (and a lot of swimmers who have tried to swim the channel have died in the attempt, just saying).

CAN it be done?
Sure ... if EVERYTHING goes right and ALL the breaks fall your way and there are NO PROBLEMS that need to be resolved along the way.

SHOULD it be assumed that it was done?
The combination of events needed for success amounts to being dealt an inside straight royal flush in poker (meaning: really damn unlikely to have turned out THAT favorably).

So ... not impossible ... just mind bogglingly improbable, to the point of seeming impossible at the start of the mission when departing Terra and needing to decide where to go from here (Terra).
 
2 parsec range, even on Jump-1 starships ... fine, no problem, that I can easily believe.
5 parsec range, on Jump-2 starships ... TOTALLY NON-STANDARD.
Mind, in GT:ISW, "back in the day", ships could not jump to deep space. So, the 2 parsec ship wouldn't be able to bridge the gap. Obviously, at some point, they ("they") figured out the math to do deep space jumps.
 
Here is what MgT Great Rift has to say on the matter:
Although it is referred to in most databases as the jump-5 route, the Wahtoikoeakh-Aulryakh transit was navigable long before the Aslan developed long-range starships. A vessel capable of jump-2, carrying sufficient fuel for two jumps, can make the transit from Wahtoikoeakh to Ahfatre in Ryuhleiea subsector, with only the jump to Aoki requiring tanker support. This may have given the Aslan access to the central cluster of worlds found in Ryuhleiea and Aokiylair subsectors relatively early in their spacefaring history.
 
Here's the Map Link (again).
Mind, in GT:ISW, "back in the day", ships could not jump to deep space.
Um ... that's ... DUMB ... to assume.
MgT Great Rift has to say on the matter:
A vessel capable of jump-2, carrying sufficient fuel for two jumps, can make the transit from Wahtoikoeakh to Ahfatre in Ryuhleiea subsector, with only the jump to Aoki requiring tanker support.
There are two segments of the route that are 5 parsecs, which with a Jump-2 drive requires 3 jumps (2+2+1=5).
Most of the rest of the route (not all, but most) of the route has the stars 3 parsecs apart, so a Jump-2 drive requires 2 jumps (2+1=3).
Only one section has stars 4 parsecs apart, so a Jump-2 drive requires 2 jumps (2+2=4).

Details of which part of the route requires what jump capacity to complete can be found here:
J-5 Trans Hierate Trade Route



And yes, I did an in depth analysis of this region of space already ... LINK.
 
Um ... that's ... DUMB ... to assume.
Assume? They're the ones "making stuff up", they don't have to assume anything. They reach in to thin air, grab these tenets and bonk 'em on the head with a CANON stamp.

They have all sorts of constraints on jump in ISW. For example, the Vilani are limited to Jump Tapes, vs those hooligan, "free navigating" Terrans. Early Terran drives consume twice the fuel, T5 style "jump lines", etc.
 
Indeed - the whole point that Spinward Flow seems to have completely lost is that none of the posters supporting the idea that the Sword Worlders used the J5 route via Aslan space is "making anything up"... they are simply repeating what published material says DID happen.

Spinward Flow is the only one making up his own version of the story.
 
Indeed - the whole point that Spinward Flow seems to have completely lost is that none of the posters supporting the idea that the Sword Worlders used the J5 route via Aslan space is "making anything up"... they are simply repeating what published material says DID happen.

Spinward Flow is the only one making up his own version of the story.
And yet, no one has been able to come up with a satisfactory explanation of how you get 5 parsecs out of a Jump-2 Solomani starship designed for 2 parsecs of range other than ridiculous amounts of wishful thinking and Deus ex Machina that requires insanely long odds (against) to have ever actually worked.

I don't care what the "published material says DID happen" if in order for that to have happened you need to resort to "and then a miracle occurred!" in order to get out of the corner you've written yourself into (in the middle of a border war that's been going on for centuries and will continue going on for centuries longer afterwards).

Kind of like how you can't WALK from England to France because there's this 26 mile stretch of seawater in the way of being able to make that journey on foot. It's not like there are enough stepping stones along the way ... and most people can't "walk on water" so ... how do you traverse the gap?



By contrast the alternative explanation of "just go through Corridor sector" since it's Jump-2 all the way from Terra to Gram in the Spinward Marches simply makes more sense for a convoy of refugees/would be colonists who will need supplies (life support consumables at the bare minimum) in order to continue their travels. Oh and the journey took 21 years (-420 to -399) and I would hope that they paused for annual overhaul maintenance (somewhere) at least once during the trip otherwise they should have never made it. Good luck finding type A/B starports around -400 in the Trojan Reaches sector, let alone the Spinward Marches in that time period.

But then again, what right do *I* have to come in with Occam's Razor and try to give this bit of "history" a nice clean shave of practical reality, eh wot? :rolleyes:
 
This has already been answered. I think you yourself did the maths.

2+2+1 or 1+2+2 or 2+1+2 - just carry 50% of your hull % as fuel.
 
I think his point is where are the references in the material that they did this, where are the ship designs they used? For all we know, they could have been staging and using deep space fuel caches (which we do know the Imperium has in order to transit the Rift, at least in emergencies).
 
This has already been answered. I think you yourself did the maths.

2+2+1 or 1+2+2 or 2+1+2 - just carry 50% of your hull % as fuel.
Okay.
What do you toss overboard in order to achieve that?

I mean, the ships were presumably crammed FULL to bursting when leaving Terra, right?
Cattlecar Galactica (and all that jazz), right?

So what do you get rid of to make room for the extra fuel fraction you'll need?

The refugees you're carrying?
Their last possessions that have been brought all this way (and CANNOT BE REPLACED)?
The contents of the low berths (most of whom are probably already dead anyway, right)?

And you're not expecting any kind of mutiny or resistance when you try dumping people/stuff so as to have enough fuel to jump across the Great Rift?

"There's no room."
"We're not trying on Levi's here."

 
Okay.
What do you toss overboard in order to achieve that?

I mean, the ships were presumably crammed FULL to bursting when leaving Terra, right?
Cattlecar Galactica (and all that jazz), right?

So what do you get rid of to make room for the extra fuel fraction you'll need?
Let's do a 5 kTd 3j2
Bridge
100 Td​
2%
JDrive Z
125 Td​
J2
PP Z
73 Td​
P2
MD W
47 Td
M1
J Fuel 3j2
3000 Td​
(3×1000 Td)
Subtotal
3345 Td​
Remaining
1655 Td​
15 core crew; 50 crew requiredC F AAA EEEEEEE M P N
Crew SR × 50
400 Td​
Using Bk5 PP Fuel (bigger than bk2) for 6 weeks
300 Td​
0.01×Pp×M
Subtotal
4045 Td​
Remaining
955 Td​
Putting in 225 passengers
900 Td​
0.1 Td cargo per passenger
23 Td​
(a steamer trunk each)
Model 1bis Computer
1 Td​
22 turrets
24 Td​
gunners fall into te 50 min crew size)
Mail Hold
5 Td​
(Just for S&G's)
LS Hold
2 Td​
510 person-weeks - more than enough for the extra 2 weeks beyond stateroom inclusion
This is a 225 passenger 3j2 Book 2 design with the higher Bk 5 fuel use. If it's pure Bk2, then there is an extra 270 tons for another 50 passengers.
It is, however, TL 15...

A 1000Td similarly:
Item
Tonnage​
Notes
Bridge
20 Td​
JD K
55 Td​
TL 11
PP K
31 Td​
TL 11
MD E
9 Td​
TL 9
Model/1bis
1 Td​
3j2 fuel
600 Td​
200 each
6 wk PP2 Bk5 fuel
30 Td​
Standard 4 week is 20
Crew 11CFPNMAAAEEE
Crew SR
44 Td​
Subtotal
790 Td​
210
50 passengers
200 Td​
0.1 Td/passenger
5 Td​
LS Hold
1 Td​
255 person-weeks
allows 8 weeks (4 SR, 4 stored)
remaining
4 Td​
Only slightly less efficient. And TL 11.
 
I forgot: the 255 person weeks per Td are from the asteroid mining rules in JTAS
 
It is, however, TL 15
Yeah, TL=15 in Imperial year -420 would seem to be a NO GO.
Only slightly less efficient. And TL 11.
This could be on the right track (although some specifics differ) because I was able to find this starship design in CT AM: 6 Solomani on page 43.

Bulk Carrier (type SK): Using a 1000-ton hull, the Buik Carrier is a mid-sized transport handling a number of varied cargoes. It mounts jump drive-K, maneuver drive-K, and power plant-K, giving it performance of jump-2 and 2G acceleration. Fuel tankage of 220 tons supports the power plant and one jump-2. Adjacent to the bridge, the ship carries a Model/2bis computer. There are 20 staterooms and 10 low berths. The ship has two hardpoints and two tons of fire control allocated to them; no weapons or turrets are mounted. There is one ship's vehicle: a 30-ton ship's boat. Cargo capacity is 536 tons. The ship is unstreamlined.

The Bulk Carrier requires a crew of nine: captain/pilot, navigator, three engineers, two stewards, gunner/boat pilot, and medic/gunner. The ship can carry eleven high or middle passengers and ten low passengers. The Bulk Carrier costs MCr369.7 to build (including 10 % discount for standard design) and requires 27 months to build.

The Bulk Carrier is a major component of the corporate fleets of the Solomani Sphere.
In "modern" USP format this LBB2 design would equate to:
Code:
Bulk Carrier   SK-A7222S2-000000-00000-1   MCr 369.7   1000 tons
Passengers=11. Low=10. Cargo=536. Fuel=220. EP=20. Agility=2. TL=11. Crew=9.

Ship's Boat    QB-0206601-000000-00000-0   MCr 16      30 tons
Passengers=6. Low=0. Cargo=6. Fuel=6.5. EP=1.8. Agility=6. TL=9. Crew=2.

So not an unreasonable starting point ... particularly with this note:
The Bulk Carrier is a major component of the corporate fleets of the Solomani Sphere.
Meaning, there ought to be "plenty of them" already built (and thus available for use) by the "banishment exile fleet" of what wound up becoming the Sword Worlds.

The most likely thing to do as a conversion then in order to cross the Great Rift with such a ship would be to have 300 tons of collapsible fuel tank installed in the cargo bay in order to extend range by an additional 3 parsecs (so reduce cargo capacity by -300 tons down to 236 tons).

If you increase the (live) passenger capacity up to 40 (16 high passage because the base design already has 2 stewards, plus 24 middle passage) you'll need an additional 29 staterooms (so reduce cargo capacity by another -116 tons down to 120 tons). The medic onboard can be responsible for 120 passengers, so the remaining 80 passenger capacity becomes low berths (reducing cargo capacity by another -40 tons down to 80 tons).

Fuel purification plants will ABSOLUTELY BE NEEDED for this voyage(!!!!) and a TL=11 fuel purification plant capable of purifying 220 tons of fuel will be required (so reduce cargo capacity down by another -7.7 tons down to 72.3 tons).

So what we wind up with, from a 1000 ton standard design Solomani starship that can eventually be configured to be able to cross the Great Rift without risking misjumps on unrefined fuel during the LONG voyage from Terra to Gram in the Spinward Marches is:
9 active duty crew
40 "live" passengers (16 high passengers, 24 middle passengers)
80 "frozen" passengers (80 low passengers)
72.3 tons of cargo (some of which will need to be additional life support reserves to extend endurance)

the 255 person weeks per Td are from the asteroid mining rules in JTAS
JTAS 3, p18
Supplies: In general, each person in the expedition requires 1 kilogram of canned or packaged food and other essentials per day, costing an average of Cr25 per kilogram. One ton of such supplies in the cargo area will support 2000 person/days at a cost of Cr50,000. That translates to 285 person/weeks at a cost of Cr175 per week.
Uh oh ... looks like I just found an errata while reviewing this entry.
It would seem that there is a conversion error between metric tons (1000 kilograms) and short tons (2000 lbs). If 1 ton of ship capacity is 1000 kilograms, then 1 ton of life support reserves will support 1000 person/days at a cost of Cr 25,000 per ton.

Note that this kind of units conversion error is exactly the kind of thing which managed to doom missions to Mars. Best not to replicate it here then, I'm thinking.



So ... if our 1000 ton refugee ship has 49 "live" people aboard consuming life support, that means that 1 ton of life support reserves will last 20.4 days (1000/49=20.4), which is very nearly 3 weeks.

If our Sword Worlder refugee ship then devotes 7.3 tons of cargo space towards life support reserves, the starship will be able to endure for 7300/49=148.98 days (21.28 weeks) before needing to replenish their life support stocks ... and the 1000 ton Bulk Carrier has only 65 tons of cargo hold space remaining for carrying the necessary supplies to establish a colony settlement once they reach Gram ... IF ... the fleet uses the J-5 Trade Route through Aslan controlled space.



If instead ... the Sword Worlder refugee ship were to route through Corridor sector, they would have 300 tons of additional cargo space to use that wouldn't need to be devoted to fuel.

Do I really need to point out that 300 tons of extra capacity means a LOT more refugees (and a lot more supplies to establish a permanent colony somewhere) can be rescued from Terra for the journey per Bulk Carrier starship? I mean, 300 tons of extra cargo space can mean another 600 low berths(!!!) ... and you would only need to exchange 5 middle passengers for 5 medical crew in order to support that tradeoff.



49 live crew+passengers and 80 frozen low passengers via the Great Rift route through Aslan space
49 live crew+passengers and 680 frozen low passengers via the Corridor route through Vilani space



You tell me which is the better route for a convoy of refugees desperate to survive with limited resources and a limited number of starships available to them.

When the most precious thing you can carry is PEOPLE ... wouldn't you want to take the route that allows you to "save" the maximum number of people from Terra?

After all, the more people you can bring from Terra to your eventual destination, the more likely your colony (once founded) will be able to survive (many hands make short work of difficult tasks and all that).
 
Last edited:
But all this depends on a single thing.

How many ships are they willing to use?

Sure, one ship design is more efficient than another, but number of ships may not be the gating factor. Maybe time is.
 
49 live crew+passengers and 80 frozen low passengers via the Great Rift route through Aslan space
49 live crew+passengers and 680 frozen low passengers via the Corridor route through Vilani space
So here is the absolute Most Favorable Outcome™ that I can possibly imagine that will square this circle.

The Sword World refugee fleet reaches the rimward end of the J-5 Trade Route across the Great Rift and successfully negotiates with the Ku Su'ikh females of the Wahtoi clan for passage. The terms of the agreement boil down to allowing the Solomani ships to "ferry" their own people in low berths across the Great Rift in stages using multiple round trips (which would take multiple YEARS to complete). Aside from permitting passage, all the Ku Su'ikh corporation and the Wahtoi clan would need to provide the refugees is ... replenishment of consumables for life support (relatively cheap, all things considered), annual overhaul maintenance of their starships at clan controlled shipyards (not unreasonable, given the circumstances), collapsible fuel tanks for cargo holds (also cheap, all things considered) and "warehousing" for the low berths carrying refugees while the Solomani ships ferry them across the Great Rift in relay stages (also relatively cheap, all things considered).

So the first run across the Great Rift to coreward would transport 80 low berths plus 65 tons of miscellaneous cargo per Solomani Bulk Carrier, which would then get warehoused on the coreward end of the J-5 Trade Route. The Bulk Carrier would then return to rimward, load up with 210 low berths for the second run to coreward, unload to the warehouses ... wash, rinse, repeat. A total of FOUR relay ferry runs would be needed per Bulk Carrier in order to transport a total of 680 low berths across the Great Rift.

Considering that at Jump-2, it takes 22 jumps to cross the Great Rift which is 137.5 to 160.4 days spent in jumpspace (not including maneuvering for refueling/replenishment of supplies and life support), a single round trip across the J-5 Trade Route can AT BEST take a full Solomani YEAR :oops: ... and if the Sword Worlders needed to make FOUR round trips to ferry all of their "stuff" (people and possession/colony setup cargo) across the Great Rift, meaning at least FOUR YEARS "lost" in transit across the Riftspan Reaches sector during which "nothing bad happens" relevant to the Sword Worlds starships (to prevent the survivors from reaching Gram). Realistically speaking, the true time it would take to ferry everything across the Great Rift would probably be closer to 6-8 YEARS spent in the Riftspan Reaches sector cycling from rimward to coreward, ferrying all of the Solomani survivors across the Great Rift.



Again ... compare and contrast that kind of delay/RISK(!) against taking the Corridor sector route out to the Spinward Marches.

Even assuming a "leisurely" transit of 2 years per sector, with the Riftspan Reaches being an exception of 8 years spent in the sector on the J-5 Trade Route, you're probably looking at a route that looks something like this in terms of time frame:
  1. Solomani Rim sector
  2. Magyar sector
  3. Daibei sector
  4. Ealiyasiyw sector
  5. Riftspan Reaches sector
  6. Riftspan Reaches sector
  7. Riftspan Reaches sector
  8. Riftspan Reaches sector
  9. Trojan Reach sector
  10. Spinward Marches sector
... and that gets you your -420 departure from Terra to -399 founding of the colony at Gram in the Sword Worlds.



Compare and contrast that with a more straightforward route through Corridor sector:
  1. Solomani Rim sector
  2. Diaspora sector
  3. Massilia sector
  4. Core sector
  5. Vland sector
  6. Corridor sector
  7. Deneb sector
  8. Spinward Marches sector
Assuming a "leisurely" transit of 2 years per sector for the refugee fleet, you would expect to reach the Spinward Marches a whole FOUR YEARS EARLIER via the Corridor sector route.

In fact, with the Corridor sector route, you could even take 2.5 years per sector (giving more time for trading, exploration and survey work along the way) for the refugee fleet and STILL be able to complete a one way transit from Terra to Gram in 20 years.
number of ships may not be the gating factor. Maybe time is.
Hence why I'm assuming the Sword Worlder refugee fleet wouldn't have the time (or the funding!) needed to design and construct purpose built starships for the journey. Instead, they are going to be under pressure to get as many people OUT as quickly as possible ... meaning needing to rely on starships that are already constructed (so they don't lose time building more at a starport they don't control!) which can accommodate as many refugees (and their "stuff") as possible, because once they leave ... they are never coming back.

This was a limited offer exodus.
Get out of town NOW, while you still can ... because if you're still here after dark, we'll come hunting for you (so to speak).

So it had to be a fast evacuation of as many people as possible using whatever was available (Cattlecar Galactica scenario) in a "wagon train to the stars" type of situation.

So yes ... quantity of starships was probably less important of a gating factor and the time window to escape would have been.

That also means that anyone who made it aboard would not take all that kindly to needing to (permanently) leave people behind after the voyage started. Refugees who have been through that kind of trauma tend to form bonds of solidarity that will stick with them through the rest of their lives. I sincerely doubt they would look kindly on anyone who took a stance that some of those survivors must be lost in order for the remainder to be saved. I can easily imagine that sentiment among the refugee survivors would turn really hard against anyone proposing to "sacrifice some of their own people" while on their journey into exile BY CHOICE.

Lost to (unfortunate) circumstances ... that's different ... but voluntarily CHOOSING to sacrifice those people (just because you can) ... no, I don't see that as a successful strategy for maintaining authority and respect in the people leading the expedition.
 
Uh oh ... looks like I just found an errata while reviewing this entry.
It would seem that there is a conversion error between metric tons (1000 kilograms) and short tons (2000 lbs). If 1 ton of ship capacity is 1000 kilograms, then 1 ton of life support reserves will support 1000 person/days at a cost of Cr 25,000 per ton.
No - you've found one of the unclear bits of CT... Ship tonnages are NOT mass. They're a volume. A ship's tonnage is in displacement of liquid hydrogen (ranging from 13.2 to 14.1 kl per metric ton IRL, and normalized at 14 kl for most editions.
Here's a source that shows 14 l/kg specific volume at 1 atm and vapor point: https://www1.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuelcells/tech_validation/pdfs/fcm01r0.pdf see page 13.

The deckplan rules give 2 squares 1.5m × 1.5m per Td (Tonnage displacement), and a presumed height of 3m, for a total of 13.5m³ of usable volume, plus deck and ceiling share. In TTNE, we get a mass limit of 10 Tonnes (metric; technically, megagrams) per Td.

Note that mixed volume/mass units are a common enough standard. A TEU is a limit of roughly 24 tonnes in a volume of 40.776192 m³. A naval cargo ton is 100 cu ft cargo space, and gross register tonnage is all in-hull enclosed space at 100 cf per. Note that seawater is 63.9262 lbs/cf... and thus a GRT of 1 ton can hold up to about 2.85 long tons mass afloat; in practice, ships are rated in 4 tonnages: displacement tonnage, laden displacement, GRT, and Cargo Tonnage, with many container ships also having a 5th measure: TEU and/or FEU (20' or 40' units)
It's worth noting that most ships will not load more than 1 tonne of cargo per cargo ton, as more would likely risk swamping, so its a combined measure - and item shipped has the higher of volume in units of 100 cf, or in units of 2240 lbs. 2240 lbs, by the way, is the mass of a wine laden Tun barrel.

Traveller's Td has been, since defined in Bk2, been something other than actual mass.
 
Back
Top