Exactly. So, in my reduced model, the norm would be 20k dtons and the freakishly large Tigress would be 50k dtons.
Big ship universe vs small ship universe
- Thread starter Murph
- Start date
My reasoning for 20 kTd is a bit of a wonky side track... it's the size I worked out the Federation CA from the SFTM at. The DN was about 2300 IIRC.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
Tonnage used to be limited by computer model.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Only in HG79/80.
Here is the HG 80 version:
which you can compare with the HG79 table:
Here is the HG 80 version:
| TL | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 |
| max hull size | 9,999 | 49,999 | 99,999 | 999,999 | 1,000,000+ | unlimited | unlimited |
which you can compare with the HG79 table:
| TL | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 |
| max hull size | 4,999 | 19,999 | 99,999 | 299,999 | 1,000,000 | 1,000,000 | 1,000,000 |
Last edited:
bk5-79 page 20 has a maximum ship size column on the computer table.
You really should double check the books BEFORE posting, Mike.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Alternatively you could wait until I have finished editing to complete a post - distractions happen.
(had to go and peal spuds and carrots)
(had to go and peal spuds and carrots)
Verify before hitting "Post reply". The new software for the board saves your draft automatically. Makes life easier on everyone when you're not posting misinformation.
See the image in my prior post
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
I think that the bridge now is responsible for hull size.
The concept would be that the bridge crew would need some idea what's happening in the rest of the spacecraft, and be able to assert control, in real time.
An example was that using smaller bridges cut costs and dedicated tonnage, but penalized by a minus one to ship operations.
The concept would be that the bridge crew would need some idea what's happening in the rest of the spacecraft, and be able to assert control, in real time.
An example was that using smaller bridges cut costs and dedicated tonnage, but penalized by a minus one to ship operations.
Jetrock
SOC-8
I do a "both big and small ship" universe--as mentioned above, big ships are for the wargamers, small ships are for the roleplayers, and at least my campaign has a heavy emphasis on roleplaying, which means small ship actions (even at the mercenary level; the next adventure I'm planning is going to be a battle between a company-sized force and the PCs' force of two fireteams and local levies--yes, it's definitely going to be a "Seven Samurai" type encounter, but with the PCs on the offensive. Nobody said mercin' was easy.)
The character scale being the small-ship scale means that typical interaction with local authorities are generally with patrol corvettes. And yes, I really like the MgT2 convention change from "patrol cruiser" to "patrol corvette," especially because my players, new to Traveller and not having seen images of the Patrol Cruiser, just assume it looks like a giant Chevy Corvette with rockets on the back and a bunch of guns, but the message they get is the same--a fast, pointy, dangerous thing that's tougher than they are, but not overpoweringly so. To facilitate a Traveller universe with large starships but also a relatively chaotic, space-frontier atmosphere, I assume that Imperial Navy forces are numerically small and localized, but structurally big and well-supported; while the Tigress BatRon is away, which is most of the time, the small-ship mice will play, although even the 400 ton house cat (in the form of the aforementioned patrol cruiser/corvette) is more than a match for a mouse--the key thing for the mouse is to be where the cat ain't, and in space, there's a whole lot of ain't to get lost in.
Big ships are good for back story--PCs who served as ship's troops on a Ghalalk or a Plankwell class and have a contact or ally in the ship's captain, or a large interstellar liner as settings for adventures where you need more room to hide things than a 600 ton passenger liner. Or for generating a "wrong place, wrong time" for the PCs to struggle to not be near when it arrives (a good push towards or away from places the GM doesn't want the players to go.) Big ships can practically be worlds on their own. Small ships, on the other hand, are characters--characters may have visited a heavy cruiser, but they know that free trader.
The character scale being the small-ship scale means that typical interaction with local authorities are generally with patrol corvettes. And yes, I really like the MgT2 convention change from "patrol cruiser" to "patrol corvette," especially because my players, new to Traveller and not having seen images of the Patrol Cruiser, just assume it looks like a giant Chevy Corvette with rockets on the back and a bunch of guns, but the message they get is the same--a fast, pointy, dangerous thing that's tougher than they are, but not overpoweringly so. To facilitate a Traveller universe with large starships but also a relatively chaotic, space-frontier atmosphere, I assume that Imperial Navy forces are numerically small and localized, but structurally big and well-supported; while the Tigress BatRon is away, which is most of the time, the small-ship mice will play, although even the 400 ton house cat (in the form of the aforementioned patrol cruiser/corvette) is more than a match for a mouse--the key thing for the mouse is to be where the cat ain't, and in space, there's a whole lot of ain't to get lost in.
Big ships are good for back story--PCs who served as ship's troops on a Ghalalk or a Plankwell class and have a contact or ally in the ship's captain, or a large interstellar liner as settings for adventures where you need more room to hide things than a 600 ton passenger liner. Or for generating a "wrong place, wrong time" for the PCs to struggle to not be near when it arrives (a good push towards or away from places the GM doesn't want the players to go.) Big ships can practically be worlds on their own. Small ships, on the other hand, are characters--characters may have visited a heavy cruiser, but they know that free trader.
Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
I tend to view it as a matter of accessibility.
Whether physical or financial.
One option should be pig in a poke - won it as a wager, inheritance, stolen, salvage, and so on.
Whether physical or financial.
One option should be pig in a poke - won it as a wager, inheritance, stolen, salvage, and so on.
The Clement sector universe is a small ship universe with ships limited to Jump 2. That is interesting and keeps things constrained to J-2. Looking at LBB ships, I suspect there are a LOT of them floating about. Although the Traveller adventure started showing the 2-3-5,000 ton larger merchant vessels.
Also I would have loved to have seen more on the Donosev class Scout vessel in Canon publications.
Also I would have loved to have seen more on the Donosev class Scout vessel in Canon publications.
Having had a player get super lucky - max sized lot of computers, minimum purchase, maximum sale... MCr24 becoming MCr240...
I've seen a number of times where a party had some luck and had a ship's fund in the multi-million credit range. My last TTA run, they hired a captain for the subsidy runs, and built a J2 version for themselves. Given a few years of trade by tramping a 400 Td J2 M1 and the core trade rules, one can get filthy rich and afford a DE out of Sup 9.
Shrug, this is why refs are gifted with encounter tables- for pirates just roll 1d6-3, below 1 the pirate sees or knows the ship threat and won’t risk it, 1 may or may not, 2-3 likely will.
3 Type C will put a dent in most anything players are going to luck into…
I have a ship folder with 61 ships in it, it's a small ship universe, though I like to sit down write them up, and draw them by hand. I spend too much time on the computer, it sometimes feels like I have been punched in the eye, it is nice to get away. Most ships are kind of fanciful, keeping it simple is cool, I think a lot of big ones would violate the square cube law.
For me, it's a matter of scale and challenge. A pirate freighter may chance running from a 400 dton Gazelle, but the mismatch with a 6500 destroyer makes escape unlikely. I use a mostly small ship model, where the 5000 ton limit comes from the size able to enter jump space (and yes, this is tech dependent). Systems willing to build a large hull that cannot enter jump are entirely feasible. For traveling to distant binary stars (~ 5 billion km or less), they can get there in 2-3 weeks at 1 G (thank god for reactionless drives!). In combat, a 10,000 ton ship might be slow, but it can dish out and take damage better than any jumpship, keeping the advantage with the defenders. For people wanting to leave a star system, though, the smaller ships are the only way. Yes, it does mean dozens of them between major worlds and multiple highports would be the only way to handle that level of traffic. Megacorps probably have their own ports anyway. But it also allows the occasional 5000 ton battleship to visit the frontier class C starport without having to wait weeks while the station fuel processors to catch up.
I’ve customised things like this in the past, where instead of the 800dt Merc cruiser it was a Chrysanthemum or similar: big enough to be outside the PC’s ACS capabilities but still within the scope of a patrol ship in a big-ship setting
BackworldTraveller
SOC-13
The biggest dichotomy that hasn't really been solved is around the population sizes Vs Ship Sizes. About 100 Million dTons of shipping are needed to transport the goods for a population "A" world each day. This needs big ships just to prevent traffic disasters. that's 20,000 movements of 10,000 dTon ships per day on average. One spaceport only is a massive bottleneck.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
The biggest question is what proportion of the trade on a planet goes towards offworld trade.
I mean we live on a high pop planet and yet very little of our trade is off world
I mean we live on a high pop planet and yet very little of our trade is off world
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Terra throws a few metric tons per year beyond the atmosphere.I mean we live on a high pop planet and yet very little of our trade is off world
Some of that tonnage even leaves the Terran gravity well for other natural satellites and planets in the star system, albeit mostly for research purposes rather than for commerce ...
