OTU Only: Character TL

[Supplement Four]

I was just reading over THIS REPLY in the Reading a Subsector thread (see my sig for that thread), and it reminds me of an issue I've had with Traveller for a long, long time (but have never settled to my satisfaction).

That is...a character's personal TL.

We have much to-do about TL's in Traveller, but we never (I've never seen an official rule) concern ourselves much with the technological knowledge level of the character.

Take that post I link above. Marchand says:

PCs by definition are the extraordinary people. PCs can come from anywhere. It would be easy to come up with a compelling backstory for a PC from Pysadi, for example.

Pysadi, last time I looked, is a TL 4 world. It's not impossible, but I do think it is a tad bit of a challenge to figure how a person from a world where the tech is that of early WWII would get along on a starship.



How do you address this in your games? Or, do you just ignore it?

Or, do you handwave every instance with explanations of how the TL 4 character was exposed (for years) to TL A+ tech at the local starport...or whatever?

 

[GypsyComet]

Within the Imperium:
Only the most isolated worlds are ignorant of the Imperium around them. A Pysadian, for example, might be a dangerously ignorant noob at first, but he won't be the barbarian amongst the space gods. For those, we have the Barbarian career.

Outside the Imperium or any other inclusive polity is a different matter.

 

[Supplement Four]

Within the Imperium:
Only the most isolated worlds are ignorant of the Imperium around them. A Pysadian, for example, might be a dangerously ignorant noob at first, but he won't be the barbarian amongst the space gods. For those, we have the Barbarian career.

Sure, he's aware of the outside Imperium. There's a starport with ships coming and going every day.

But, the majority of Pysadians are TL 4. I picture it like a Third World country today. Like among the poor tribes of Africa today. I just saw the movie Captain Phillips a few weeks ago. Can you imagine those pirates not only taking over the ship but also running it? They couldn't do it.

What about a medic trained at TL 4? Would he be able to use the equipment in the sickbay of a TL 13 free trader?

 

[aramis]

That is...a character's personal TL.

We have much to-do about TL's in Traveller, but we never (I've never seen an official rule) concern ourselves much with the technological knowledge level of the character.

MT Player's Manual, 11 discusses finding the Character's TL.
MT Ref's Manual, page 15 gives the effects of Character TL on tasks.

It reduces effective skill level when it applies.

 

[robject]

Sure, he's aware of the outside Imperium. There's a starport with ships coming and going every day.

But, the majority of Pysadians are TL 4. I picture it like a Third World country today. Like among the poor tribes of Africa today. I just saw the movie Captain Phillips a few weeks ago. Can you imagine those pirates not only taking over the ship but also running it? They couldn't do it.

What about a medic trained at TL 4? Would he be able to use the equipment in the sickbay of a TL 13 free trader?

Yeah, the majority of Pysadians are TL 4. My handwave is that characters are in a fortunate minority, unless it benefits that particular game.

 

[Golan2072]

Using Book 1 careers, most characters have served in Imperial, or at least subsector, forces (Navy, Marines, Scouts, etc), and thus were taught to use higher tech during the many years of chargen regardless of their homeworld. The main exception would be some people in the Army and Other careers, but even then, the skills available suggest a service or work in a higher-tech, starfaring career.

As suggested earlier in this thread, characters who have only served in a low-tech environment in the prior career should use the Barbarian career from S4: CotI.

But this is for the Imperium (or Outer Veil's FNH). In the Traveller: New Era milieu, interstellar travel is far less common, and a lot of characters would be lower-tech; I'd give them -DMs to various tech skills in a high-tech environment.

 

[Spinward Scout]

If there's a Starport, at least some of the people could have access to higher TL goods. Even if it's smuggled goods.

 

[Golan2072]

If there's a Starport, at least some of the people could have access to higher TL goods. Even if it's smuggled goods.

This is how it works in my Outer Veil setting - any colony with off-world contact will have a good number of TL11 (top TL for that setting) gadgets at hand, especially small, lightweight and (relatively) cheap ones. Your TL4 frontier hellhole might find it difficult to do anything beyond basic machine-shop work, but as long as there are traders coming in, many people will have TL11 smartphones, because they are small, lightweight, relatively cheap and so are their spare parts, and even a relay station or two won't take that much of a trader's hold. Guns tend to propagate a little less across TLs as they need good amounts of ammunition, and having something you can manufacture bullets for locally is preferrable, but you'll still find frontier-hardened TL7 assault rifles even on a TL4 colony, with bullets produced on a nearby world or even producible with local tech.

Look at Somalia IRL - they're VERY low TL in terms of manufacturing, yet everyone seems to have an AK-47 (arguably early TL7) and a smartphone (arguably early TL8).

 

[atpollard]

Pysadi, last time I looked, is a TL 4 world. It's not impossible, but I do think it is a tad bit of a challenge to figure how a person from a world where the tech is that of early WWII would get along on a starship.

How do you address this in your games? Or, do you just ignore it?

First, a minor point ... isn't TL 4 more Victorian (1860-1900) than Early WW2?

Second, some thoughts ...
... I really like TL 4 in Traveller and have given it more than a little thought.
In the real world, TL 4 could be like some third world people group, or they could be like some of the stricter Amish communities living in the heart of the first world (Pennsylvania and Ohio). People are people, so they are as intelligent or foolish as any other group of people ... many are able to comprehend modern technology and simply choose to not allow it to dominate their life style. For example, some Amish Communities will allow the use of internal combustion engines, which they can not only operate, but repair, and yet, they will not use tractors to plow their fields. It comes down to their view of a tool vs a vanity. In spite of the staggering technology gap between an Amish farm and a corporate mega-farm, the Amish can actually produce and sell agricultural crops at a higher 'per bushel' profit than a more industrialized farm.

I would suspect that everyone born on a TL 4 world and choosing to become a starfarer is, by definition, an exceptional individual ... not 'better' than the average citizen, but certainly 'different'.
It is also worth pointing out that there were some remarkably forward thinking individuals around in late TL 4 who would have had no trouble learning the ropes if a starship had landed and offered them a chance ...
... Konstantin Tsiolkovsky (1857-1935) created the Tsiolkovsky Rocket Equation from 1883-1897 and would probably have been delighted to leave TL 4 Earth to study Theoretical Jump Physics at the Imperial Academy of Art and Science.
... Thomas Edison (1847 – 1931) would have been a quick learner and probably made a heck of a Starship Engineer (although his constant tinkering in his cargo bay workshop would have cut in on the ship's profits).
... Louis Pasteur (1822 – 1895) give him access to a modern (far future) medical text book and I would be willing to take my chances with him as a ship's doctor.

So those are my thoughts.
And to your last question, I just ignore it.

 

[McPerth]

What about a medic trained at TL 4? Would he be able to use the equipment in the sickbay of a TL 13 free trader?

Remember this works both ways...

Whould a Doctor trained at TL 13 be able to perform surgery (or treat an infection) without advanced equipment, anaesthesia and antibiotics?

MT Player's Manual, 11 discusses finding the Character's TL.
MT Ref's Manual, page 15 gives the effects of Character TL on tasks.

It reduces effective skill level when it applies.

I liked how MT treated it.

 

[Timerover51]

Remember this works both ways...
Whould a Doctor trained at TL 13 be able to perform surgery (or treat an infection) without advanced equipment, anaesthesia and antibiotics?

I suspect that a TL 13 Doctor would be absolutely helpless at say TL 6 and below when it comes to surgery and treatment.

For that matter, if a TL 13 ship crashed or was stranded on a TL 4 planet, they would also be pretty much helpless as well.

 

[aramis]

I suspect that a TL 13 Doctor would be absolutely helpless at say TL 6 and below when it comes to surgery and treatment.

For that matter, if a TL 13 ship crashed or was stranded on a TL 4 planet, they would also be pretty much helpless as well.

I think medicine is probably the worst example, since much of being a doctor is simply knowing the symptoms and treatments, and some fields are unlikely to be affected much by tech level.

the GP is still going to be treating sprains and strains, broken bones, pulled muscles, screening for stuff that goes to the specialists, and providing immunizations.

Osteopaths and Osteologists are quite likely to have little to no change in their most common treatment procedures - the manipulation of dislocated joints to reduce the dislocation, and the splinting/casting of broken bones.

Nephrologists are likely to continue to use dialysis and diet as treatments. A TL4 dialysis machine is possible...

Surgery is where the biggest potential changes lie - the TL 8 transition to laparoscopes... it's likely to be a rarer specialty at TL12+ due to non-surgical treatments becoming more available, but still - pulling bullets, fixing slashed muscles, and removal of tumors hasn't really changed much since the victorian era. The survival rates have, because of knowledge gains in everything else about the surgery process: hygiene, sterility, blood volume replacement, minimum invasion for the task, postoperative care, sedation. But that doesn't change the basics of what a surgeon does - use of physical force and sharp objects to remove things that don't belong, and sewing together of things that got disassembled by trauma.

The biggest issue is that of available medications. EVen now, the issue is getting to the point where doctors are having to look up which medications do what. At TL9+, it is quite likely that doctors won't be prescribing so much as correctly inputting the symptoms and probable diagnosis to an AI system which then pulls the correct meds for the desired therapeutic effect. (My own GP checks the database before writing any new script for a patient. His newest PA searches by disease...)

But this is basically because the issue is they all are working on a TL0 system.

 

[McPerth]

Most doctors today rely quite heavily on thests that could not be performed at TL 4 (CTs, blood analysis¹, MNR, etc...), and would have difficulty to diagnose without them. I expect this to be even worse at TL13, that's why I said a doctor.

And even if the diagnosis was done, most treatments that we give today are more modern than TL 4 (while some could probably be obtained at TL4, once they are known to exist). And, as you say, surgery will be the worst case.

But by TL13 my guess is that steem cells, regeneration, etc... would be integral part of medicine, and this could hardly be done at TL4. If the doctor is used to them, I guess the problems will be serious.

Note 1: While at TL 4 some blood analysis could be done, not to the extent doctors today need/want​

 

[Nathan Brazil]

Mongoose Traveller Book 6: Scoundrel has optional rules about the use of "Tech Familiarity" of a person using futuristic or primitive tech in relation to their home TL, associating penalties for such use. Simple, but does not get in the way overall of playing. And it is an "optional" rule.

 

[Timerover51]

My daughter came home today from her orientation at a local hospital for her student nursing internship, as she is studying to become a nurse. She has one year to go, and is being viewed as the equivalent of a CNA 2, because of her two years of clinicals.

My daughter and 4 other nursing assistants were being checked on their ability to take blood pressure manually, rather than by the digital machine cuffs. She passed with no problems, as her school regularly checks the nursing students on this. The other 4 nursing assistants had major problems, as they complained that they always used the digital machines, and had not taken manual blood pressures since their CNA tests.

From Wikipedia, the sphygmomanometer, giving it its proper name, was invented in 1881, and further developed in 1896 and 1901, which would put in towards the end of Tech Level 4. If I remember correctly, I started seeing the digital ones in the early 1980s at the VA hospital, so roughly Tech Level 8.

I think it would be safe to say that a doctor at TL 13, if operating in a Tech Level 4 to 7 setting, probably would be in extremely serious trouble performing the simple task of taking a blood pressure manually. Taking a pulse may pose problems as well, as I am not sure at TL 13 anyone would be taught how to do in manually. Tech Level 4, if assumed to cover the Victorian Period on Earth, would also be early electricity, so electronic devices without batteries are not guaranteed to work properly. Actually, that is still a problem here on Earth, as there is no universal standard for either electric current or electrical plugs.

 

[atpollard]

For that matter, if a TL 13 ship crashed or was stranded on a TL 4 planet, they would also be pretty much helpless as well.

... I just had a flashback to 'A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court'. :rofl:

 

[Limburger59]

Great topic and discussion everyone.

For just one PC I'd come up with a background where he/she was orphaned at age 10, hung out at the edge of the spaceport, and became the mascot for the Imperial Marines/Scouts/Merchants based there.

 

[Spinward Scout]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the TL of a world only apply to what the world can produce. They should be able to buy anything they can pay the transport cost of, as long as the Law Level allows it, I would think.

Whoever ran an interstellar sales catalog using the x-boat service would make a killing.

 

[Timerover51]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the TL of a world only apply to what the world can produce. They should be able to buy anything they can pay the transport cost of, as long as the Law Level allows it, I would think.

Whoever ran an interstellar sales catalog using the x-boat service would make a killing.

Having been in the Solomon Islands in the real world on Earth, I have a tiny bit of experience with areas of different Tech Levels. Yes, in theory, the Solomon Islands could buy anything that they wanted as they could, eventually, get it. Delivery time would be about 3 months at the fastest.

In reality, they did not have the money to buy all of the goodies that they know, via their limited Internet and occasional visitors, exist. Second, if something breaks, they have no capacity to fix it. Case in point, outboard motors for the vitally needed motor launches connecting the islands. One of them breaks, due to the lack of spare parts, it goes into the salvage pile to becomes a source of spare parts. If no used spare part is available, it is cheaper to get a new motor, as a new motor will generally take 3 months to arrive, while a spare part might never make it.

Case in point Two with respect to the Solomon Islands. The Solomon Islands were essentially bankrupt at the time I was there. The hospital on Gizo, which was our base of operations, had no medications, functioning hospital equipment, or medical personnel above a nurse's aide. The only drug available was the anti-malarial drugs supplied by the World Health Organization. When we departed the Solomons, Bob Ballard donated the medical kits that he had brought with him, and the rest of the party donated whatever medications that we had bought with us. The hospital did not even have supplies of Aspirin. Fortunately, the following year, the Australian and New Zealand governments got the hospital back into operation.

For a low Tech Level planet, much of higher level technology is going to be totally out of reach.

 

[Supplement Four]

MT Player's Manual, 11 discusses finding the Character's TL.

MT Ref's Manual, page 15 gives the effects of Character TL on tasks.

Meaning, a character's TL is the TL of his Homeworld. TL's are categorized into groups (Early Stellar, Stellar, etc), and when on a world outside of that range, penalties apply to the character's skill level.

I get it, and I like the system.

There should be some minimum's though. If a character's birthworld is TL 4, and that character joins the Imperial Army and serves at the base on that world. Birthworld and Homeworld are the same.

But, obviously, the Imperial Army operates with imported tech--the character's personal TL should be adjusted for that.